A Few Words About A few words about...™ It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World -- in Blu-ray (1 Viewer)

[ManW_TheUncool]

WB is MGM's new home entertainment distributor since Disney bought Fox, if MGM wanted to release a UHD themselves it would be through WB and Universal's joint distributor, Studio Distribution Services.

It’s irrelevant to whether things get released though. They put out what MGM tells them to, as I understand it.

I'm guessing they might only release the theatrical version in 4K that way, if at all, since that's what they did on BD (and even reissued that BD 2x in just a few years after the original, decade-old release). Of course, that (all) was also long before Amazon acquired MGM.

What's probably more likely at this point is Amazon just (eventually) makes it available for streaming in 4K, especially if the previous old scan for that old BD was already done in 4K. I definitely wouldn't count on them putting it out on 4K disc thru Warner/Universal for the foreseeable future...

_Man_

 

[Stephen_J_H]

It’s irrelevant to whether things get released though. They put out what MGM tells them to, as I understand it.

And certain titles (Bond, for example) are distributed by Universal. Before anyone says anything, yes, I’m aware that Universal is the foreign distributor for the Bond titles, but there are other MGM titles handled by Universal for home entertainment; Licorice Pizza and Fighting With My Family, for example.

 

[Chewbabka]

And certain titles (Bond, for example) are distributed by Universal. Before anyone says anything, yes, I’m aware that Universal is the foreign distributor for the Bond titles, but there are other MGM titles handled by Universal for home entertainment; Licorice Pizza and Fighting With My Family, for example.

I assume that is because of agreements made prior to production/theatrical distribution for some recent titles, right? As in universal had some financial involvement in these films. As far as “the catalog” goes, though, seems a minor detail.

 

[ahollis]

Licorice Pizza was a co production between MGM and Focus Films. MGM got the North American theatrical rights, Universal received Foreign rights and Home Video rights.

 

[battlebeast]

Well, they have the DVD and BD rights to it at the moment. Whether they have UHD rights is unknown.

After all, Kino has released or announced UHDs of the following titles, all of which are still in print on BD/DVD from Criterion: The Great Escape, Some Like It Hot, In the Heat of the Night, Killer's Kiss, The Killing, Paths of Glory, The Manchurian Candidate, The Night of the Hunter, and 12 Angry Men. The common link is that they're all licensed from MGM, as would be It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World. So it's not out of the question that a UHD of it would come from Kino.

When did they announce 12 ANGRY MEN?

 

[darkrock17]

When did they announce 12 ANGRY MEN?

Back in February, it's slated to come out this Summer.

 

[rmw650]

I have the two tape widescreen MGM VHS version that had those little bits and extras incorporated into the film but if a 4K Blu-Ray will be coming out and hearing it might just happen, will those extra bits that were not in the Criterion version then be included into this newest version, to make the film officially completed? Just asking for clarification purposes.

 

[Malcolm Bmoor]

It's obvious that comedy works best in a public context with an audience, although of course we watch and laugh at home. Kevin Brownlow always tells people who don't find Charles Chaplin funny to see the films with an audience. He himself has rediscovered some of them this way.

I've only seen MAD WORLD once: My father took me when it was first issued and we were on holiday in Glasgow to THE GLASGOW CINERAMA. I doubt that there were twenty people present and neither my father or myself (nor the 'audience' in general) found it funny. I actually thought the relentless, desperate greed acutely depressing.

I'm sure that it's a riot with a full house and deserves its reputation so we should be grateful for the essential difference between theatre and cinema: In cinema the cast don't share in the knowledge that there's nobody in and it's all going very badly.

 

[Tino]

Are people rally dismissing the Criterion version as incomplete because of a deliberately deleted scene? At what point will the film be considered “complete”? When every last bit of footage shot whether it was meant to be in the film or not is added in?

 

[John Morgan]

I have the two tape widescreen MGM VHS version that had those little bits and extras incorporated into the film but if a 4K Blu-Ray will be coming out and hearing it might just happen, will those extra bits that were not in the Criterion version then be included into this newest version, to make the film officially completed? Just asking for clarification purposes.

I don't think you could say MAD WORLD is officially completed without the scenes that are now "still photos" somehow showing up. I know the chances are unlikely, but surprises like that do show up from time to time. My fantasy is: back in the day when the full 70mm roadshow prints went out and after a few weeks, the theater's projectionist was given the map to cut the film, and being a film lover thought he'd take the trims home for a keepsake. To complete my fantasy- the aged projectionist is found here at Home Theater Forum. And although his memory is shot and eyesight pretty bad, he gets someone to read this thread, which triggers his memory, and he finds the little plastic 70mm spindles of the cut scenes in his garment drawer and wall-la, the 8k version is dedicated to this gentleman and the book on MAD WORLD can be closed.

 

[RolandL]

It's obvious that comedy works best in a public context with an audience, although of course we watch and laugh at home. Kevin Brownlow always tells people who don't find Charles Chaplin funny to see the films with an audience. He himself has rediscovered some of them this way.

I've only seen MAD WORLD once: My father took me when it was first issued and we were on holiday in Glasgow to THE GLASGOW CINERAMA. I doubt that there were twenty people present and neither my father or myself (nor the 'audience' in general) found it funny. I actually thought the relentless, desperate greed acutely depressing.

I'm sure that it's a riot with a full house and deserves its reputation so we should be grateful for the essential difference between theatre and cinema: In cinema the cast don't share in the knowledge that there's nobody in and it's all going very badly.

Glasgow ABC Coliseum

 

[Jack P]

Are people rally dismissing the Criterion version as incomplete because of a deliberately deleted scene? At what point will the film be considered “complete”? When every last bit of footage shot whether it was meant to be in the film or not is added in?

I think it's the same reason why so many fans were passionate about the LD cut of "1776" or seeing the original preview cut of "Major Dundee" with its original score. If people become accustomed to seeing something that's been put in already on a previous home video format then you're going to get some people ticked if it's suddenly not in the next release, because that means they'll have to hold onto a previous format for that reason. I'm not as passionate about this regarding "Mad World" but I understand why some fans are going to develop the same attitude I've felt when this sort of thing comes up with other titles. Now we've seen "1776" fully realized in what it can do and maybe it's the precedent of that which has some "Mad World" fans hoping to see something similar like putting the LD cut in SD as another supplement for comparative purposes (then all previous versions that have had a video release are now available in a "one-stop" release).

Again, it's not a big deal for me since as long as I was able to find the other footage on-line and have it preserved I'm basically happy with the Criterion version, but I'd certainly go for another release that duplicates the "1776" approach.

 

[rmw650]

Are people rally dismissing the Criterion version as incomplete because of a deliberately deleted scene? At what point will the film be considered “complete”? When every last bit of footage shot whether it was meant to be in the film or not is added in?

To me, it's a perfect opportunity to add the missing remaining pieces into a newer release and version is what I'm thinking here to make it totally completed and even stellar than the Criterion version, but don't get me wrong here as Robert Harris and the folks that worked on this film did a splendid job on that version, but if there is a 4K BD version forthcoming, might as well top it off with whatever else of the film still is salvageable and bring it to life and stellarness.

 

[ManW_TheUncool]

As RAH (and some others noted), given how jarringly different in PQ (and motion-to-stills-subs) at least some of the (re)added scenes/footages will look in a potential 4K disc release, I certainly hope such a release will make sure the (by-far) best PQ (and full motion) shorter version won't end up being compromised in however they might handle the mastering/authoring while still giving us the option(s) for the (much) longer cut(s)... including how clunky the seamless branching might/could be for at least some 4K disc players -- there does seem to be some such potential playback issues particularly for BD100 discs and combining that w/ branching.

Maybe they should simply put the best PQ shorter version on its own dedicated 4K disc and the longer cut(s) on a separate disc instead. Unfortunately, there's probably not enough of a 4K disc market to have 2 separate releases (like previously done for BD) to allow people to choose (whether wanting just one or the other or both).

Personally, I also suspect we really only need a 4K disc release that covers the shorter version (since we already have the Criterion BD), but maybe optionally augmented (via seamless branching) to some extent w/ some variation of the best PQ additional scenes/footages w/out necessarily including the entirety of what was on the Criterion BD... or maybe just allow that as a 3rd option for those of us who'd (sometimes, but not always?) want to avoid the very jarring diffs in PQ and/or motion-to-stills-subs...

_Man_

 

[Malcolm Bmoor]

Roland:

Thank you so much for the pictures of The Glasgow ABC Coliseum Cinerama. I only went there once. We had family in Glasgow so were frequent visitors but it was more about tea with aunties than entertainment.

Many thanks.

 

[Robert Harris]

As RAH (and some others noted), given how jarringly different in PQ (and motion-to-stills-subs) at least some of the (re)added scenes/footages will look in a potential 4K disc release, I certainly hope such a release will make sure the (by-far) best PQ (and full motion) shorter version won't end up being compromised in however they might handle the mastering/authoring while still giving us the option(s) for the (much) longer cut(s)... including how clunky the seamless branching might/could be for at least some 4K disc players -- there does seem to be some such potential playback issues particularly for BD100 discs and combining that w/ branching.

Maybe they should simply put the best PQ shorter version on its own dedicated 4K disc and the longer cut(s) on a separate disc instead. Unfortunately, there's probably not enough of a 4K disc market to have 2 separate releases (like previously done for BD) to allow people to choose (whether wanting just one or the other or both).

Personally, I also suspect we really only need a 4K disc release that covers the shorter version (since we already have the Criterion BD), but maybe optionally augmented (via seamless branching) to some extent w/ some variation of the best PQ additional scenes/footages w/out necessarily including the entirety of what was on the Criterion BD... or maybe just allow that as a 3rd option for those of us who'd (sometimes, but not always?) want to avoid the very jarring diffs in PQ and/or motion-to-stills-subs...

_Man_

I’m not certain what other material fans expect to be “out there.”

I don’t recall the precise number of long prints w/o going back to our notes, but what I do know is that they were all (possibly 10) brought in, recut and redubbed, and retuned to service. Of the 10 or so, at least a couple were in German, and one or two had acid etched sub-titles.

Let’s make things more complex.

Some of the trims were straight UP70, to be projected on flat screens, while others were optically printed, adjusting the anamorphosis across the image to be projected spherically, with the curvature of the screen creating a normal image.

At the time the trims “escaped,” several other boxes were left and presumably destroyed.

Of the LV tracks, the set was incomplete, and we were told that the rest ended up in a landfill In Pennsylvania.

Of the trims that we were able to access, all were totally faded, probably a third had VS, and some so intense that they could not be properly salvaged in any way.

We checked with collectors, archives, accessed the entire MGM inventory, and left no stone unturned.

There were never 35mm prints produced.

We had the original 35mm work picture, which survived in cut form w/o rolls of trims.

We checked every possible scenario, inclusive of inspecting personal 16mm copies produced in 1963 - Mr. Hackett was kind enough to loan us his copy, which was the final version.

We spoke with many of the people who worked on the film, both in front of and behind the camera - and there was nothing.

So…

What are the expectations of fans for a longer cut?

My advise. If someone wishes to put out a 4k of the cut version, go for it.

For an extended version, it would be extremely problematic to impossible. The version that we created for Criterion cannot be redone, and that version is owned by Criterion.

I may post one of our internal spread sheets later today, which will allow some idea of the complexity of the reconstruction.

I’m hearing Miss Merman shaking her bracelet in the background.

 

[Tino]

I can’t believe RAH actually has to defend his work on the Criterion version of the film. He obviously did everything he could, lovingly, and still some are not happy. I just don’t get it. No good deed…….

 

[Mark B]

For me personally, I just mentioned the coyote bit as something I enjoy, not something that I would expect to be put back into the film. I stopped watching the 155m version in 1991, and after the Criterion set will never have the need to purchase the film again.

It's funny that no one ever talks about the rough assembly of the scene driving from the crash site that was part of that sloppy and unnavigable trims they threw onto the DVD. The sequence of shots varies greatly, and there are so many lines that were eventually trimmed out. It makes for a fascinating comparison.

 

[Ronald Epstein]

I can’t believe RAH actually has to defend his work on the Criterion version of the film. He obviously did everything he could, lovingly, and still some are not happy. I just don’t get it. No good deed…….

Tino,

Okay. Enough with the grandstanding. This is the second time you have posted the same message to reinforce the same point as if you are baiting for a response.

Nobody here is criticizing the job RAH has done on the Criterion release. I don't know where you are reading that.

However, since I made a prominent point a few posts back I am starting to take your comments personally so here is the response you have successfully baited me into...


Robert Harris made this comment a few posts back:

"The Criterion reconstruction was exhaustive and contains every bit of extant material, short of a few more stills to better animate a couple of missing sequences."

I simply pointed out this was not true. Without a bit of criticism on the job RAH did for the Criterion restoration, I pointed out there was indeed a scene that was on the Laserdisc release that was not considered for the restoration.

RAH and I have argued this scene many times before in private. My opinion is not new to him. His point is that it's not part of the Roadshow release. My point is that the scene is out there and available, why not just include it as it was in the laserdisc release?

It's a losing argument for me, but I would be crazy not to make the argument again when another release is being
considered. Of course, we were just told that anyone that wants the scene included should make their own home version for themselves. That's sort of the answer I expected.

I also stated that if the upcoming 4k Criterion release would be the theatrical version and we would simply get the same Blu-ray restoration on a separate disc, I would have no interest. The theatrical version is not my preferred watch.

However, I don't see anyone taking RAH to task for what he accomplished with the existing Criterion restoration. It was indeed done out of love and greatly appeased all the fans out there for the additional content we weren't expecting.

In short, that restoration along with the recent "1776" 4k release are the two most prized discs in my collection.

 

[ManW_TheUncool]

FWIW, as I essentially indicated earlier, I would definitely support and buy a Criterion 4K release w/ just the theatrical version in 4K and maybe the same extended cut BD included -- I have no issues w/ that... and would just gladly pass my prior Criterion BD to my son, who'd probably love to have his own copy of that.

I greatly enjoy both versions myself -- and often, I just don't have the time to watch the extended cut anyway...

_Man_