A Few Words About A few words about...™The Apartment -- in Blu-ray (1 Viewer)

[rsmithjr]

My recently-ordered copy just came from Amazon.co.uk, two weeks earlier than projected.

It is apparently the complete content of the LE collection. It includes the book. The packaging does say "B" but it plays on my region A player. This just echos what others are reporting.

I took a look at this thing and it looks better than the print I saw about 20 times in original release (if memory serves, which it probably doesn't). I had just started working the theatre, and it was a week before the Oscars, running on a second-run double bill with Elmer Gantry. Terrific business, great fun.

I got my mom to go to see it. She had troubles with the morality of the picture until I explained what it was really about.

This film was intended to look "modern" to me and it still does. Unhappily, The Music Man is not still playing at the Majestic Theatre! But not dated at all for me.

 

[Todd Mattraw]

Pure speculation on my part, but maybe Amazon sold this item under the assumption that Arrow would be dealing it at a specific wholesale price, and then things changed (for whatever reason), and Amazon realized they had sold a bunch below or at cost ($22.99), so they canceled most of those orders with an excuse about not having stock, waited a week (for the air to clear...ha!), and now they're offering the disc at a price they can live with ($29.99).

I spent a lot of years in retail, and this seems like a real possibility, especially since they're not letting people, like me, reorder at the $22.99 price point --- if I look at my canceled Amazon orders, "The Apartment" is still there but it has a price of $0.00, and when I click "Buy it again", it offers it at $29.99. I'm inclined to let them stick it and wait for a $15-20 dollar regular release --- this fiasco has me bitter towards Amazon not Arrow.

 

[David Norman]

Amazon only sold it for that price b/c Walmart lowered their price to 22.99 and then 22.09. Amazon's computer algorithm just auto-matched it so it wasn't a conscious decision for anyone at Amazon.

As much as I'd love to blame Amazon for the whole thing that still doesn't answer why the Alliance Group stores and affiliates. Bullmoose, Amoeba, Walmart, and BBY didn't have the stock they expected either, The latter group likely outsells Amazon for this type release anyway

 

[Mark-P]

Pure speculation on my part, but maybe Amazon sold this item under the assumption that Arrow would be dealing it at a specific wholesale price, and then things changed (for whatever reason), and Amazon realized they had sold a bunch below or at cost ($22.99), so they canceled most of those orders with an excuse about not having stock, waited a week (for the air to clear...ha!), and now they're offering the disc at a price they can live with ($29.99).

I spent a lot of years in retail, and this seems like a real possibility, especially since they're not letting people, like me, reorder at the $22.99 price point --- if I look at my canceled Amazon orders, "The Apartment" is still there but it has a price of $0.00, and when I click "Buy it again", it offers it at $29.99. I'm inclined to let them stick it and wait for a $15-20 dollar regular release --- this fiasco has me bitter towards Amazon not Arrow.

That was my speculation as well, that someone realized that it got priced too low and the only way to circumvent the preorder price guarantee was to cancel orders. But that would be a shady way to do business. I would have more respect for them if they copped to the price error and apologized for the inconvenience of having to cancel orders. Is it true that customers got a $5 credit for the cancellation? If so at least that part is honorable.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

Pure speculation on my part, but maybe Amazon sold this item under the assumption that Arrow would be dealing it at a specific wholesale price, and then things changed (for whatever reason), and Amazon realized they had sold a bunch below or at cost ($22.99), so they canceled most of those orders with an excuse about not having stock, waited a week (for the air to clear...ha!), and now they're offering the disc at a price they can live with ($29.99).

I spent a lot of years in retail, and this seems like a real possibility, especially since they're not letting people, like me, reorder at the $22.99 price point --- if I look at my canceled Amazon orders, "The Apartment" is still there but it has a price of $0.00, and when I click "Buy it again", it offers it at $29.99. I'm inclined to let them stick it and wait for a $15-20 dollar regular release --- this fiasco has me bitter towards Amazon not Arrow.

That doesn't really make sense to me, because canceled orders is something that effected seemingly every retailer, and not just Amazon.

If Amazon goofed on the price and canceled the orders to avoid losing money on it, that doesn't explain why Best Buy, Barnes & Noble, Bullmoose, Walmart and other retailers (some of whom never offered it that low price) also had to cancel theirs.

Right now, most of the retailers aren't saying a lot and they may never. But Bullmoose has been telling customers that they were promised X amount of copies, but then at the last moment, was told that they were going to be getting far less. Arrow then responded by telling customers that that wasn't true, that Arrow shipped exactly the number of copies to each retailer and distributor that they had originally promised, and that the stores were essentially selling items they knew they'd never get. So we're left with two statements that can't both be true at the same time.

Given those two competing statements, which of the below seems more likely?
1. That Arrow made some kind of mistake. This mistake could be almost anything. It could be an error at the replication plant that resulted in Arrow not getting all of the discs they intended to make. It could be an error with their shipping or their distributions, where the discs didn't ship out as they were supposed to, or went to the wrong location. Or, they could have miscommunicated with their retail partners, which led companies like Amazon and Best Buy to believe that more copies were coming than we available. There are any number of mistakes that Arrow could have made, in good faith even, that could explain how we got here.

Or:

2. Retailers were told that there would be a limited quantity of this disc, and every single one of them decided to ignore that limit and sell more than they were told in advance that they would get. This requires you to accept that every single retailer is being dishonest. Bullmoose specifically said that their allotment was significantly reduced by Arrow. Arrow said this is not true, and that the allotment did not change at all. Again, both of those things can't be true at the same time. So why would Bullmoose lie about this? They've had an outstanding track record for customer service for years and it would be out of character for them. Additionally, if you accept that Bullmoose is lying, this means that Bullmoose knew that they were only getting X number of copies, but decided to take Y number of orders while fully aware that they'd never be able to fill them. That doesn't make even a little bit of sense.

I think Arrow is a company that's new to the U.S. market, and made a mistake along the way - I have no idea what the specific mistake is. I think they made the ill-advised decision to schedule a release on a date when no one would be around to be responsible to ensure it went well, and with no one in the office, a mistake of some kind was made and no one was there to catch it. Then, upon returning to the office, they've discovered this huge problem. As a newer company in a crowded marketplace charging a premium price for a premium product, they have very little margin for error. I think someone there may be panicking and trying to make it look like anyone else's mistake.

That was my speculation as well, that someone realized that it got priced too low and the only way to circumvent the preorder price guarantee was to cancel orders. But that would be a shady way to do business. I would have more respect for them if they copped to the price error and apologized for the inconvenience of having to cancel orders. Is it true that customers got a $5 credit for the cancellation? If so at least that part is honorable.

If Amazon was the only retailer that canceled orders, I could accept that it was an Amazon problem. But considering that every major retailer has had an issue with this title, it seems like a much larger phenomenon than Amazon being shady. And some retailers never lowered the price to $22 in the first place, so why would they have to cancel?

Bottom line for me: if there's a problem getting a specific title from a single retail source, but it's freely available elsewhere, the problem is probably with the retailer. If there's a problem getting a specific title from every single retail source, and isn't available anywhere, the problem is probably with the label.

 

[Garysb]

Didn't everyone whose order was cancelled at Amazon US get at least a $5 credit on a future order? That would reduce the current price to $24.99 which is a few dollars more than the cancelled orders.

Amazon UK is selling the set again though they currently say they have only 14 available.

 

[rsmithjr]

Not having anyone in the office really bothers me.

I am a CTO of a company that sells online services to schools, mostly for administrators and also teachers. We have almost no usage over the holidays, but our customer service and support teams were in operation in case someone used one of our web sites. That is just the way you do things.

Arrow, on the other hand, could expect a lot of sales activity over the holidays. They should have had someone minding their operation.

 

[B-ROLL]

At the end of the day, all of this could just be solved if Arrow communicated with their customers about what exactly happened and why. Just put out a damn statement. Not that hard.

Here, I'll do it for them:

"To our valued customers,

We understand there have recently been issues with customers attempting to purchase our Limited Edition Blu-ray release of The Apartment in the US, regarding people's orders being abruptly cancelled with no explanation. Rest assured that we are looking into the issue and determining whether the product has, in fact, sold out, or if there have been delays with our distributor that have caused the cancellations. Please do not pay exorbitant aftermarket prices for this title until we have determined whether additional stock will be delivered to retailers in the USA. We will provide further updates as they become available. We appreciate your business and hope to be able to deliver this title to everyone who wishes to purchase a copy.

Best,

Arrow Films"

Post to social media channels. Send to DVD review/news sites. Boom. Done. That literally took me all of five minutes. NOT THAT DIFFICULT.

Did you have that reviewed by legal and then signed off on three people below Mr. Bezos before HE signed it ...

 

[Josh Steinberg]

Not having anyone in the office really bothers me.

Robert, I agree completely.

My perspective may be skewed because I've always worked jobs that were year-round things. My first ever job as a teenager was at a movie theater, which of course is a business that is open 365 days of the year. While I was in college, I worked at a Blockbuster, another business that was opened every day of the year. I now work for a company that operates 24/7.

The thing is, it's possible to run a business like that in a way that isn't terrible to the employees. Not every person wants to celebrate the holidays, or wants to celebrate in the "traditional" way. In my current job, there are usually willing volunteers to work the holiday shifts (it's probably easier to say "I have to work" than it is to sit across from your weird crazy uncle making small talk). Christmas is a religious holiday that's from a specific religion, and not everyone is a member of that religion - there are plenty of people happy to work on a holiday that's not "theirs" to begin with, but who still get paid extra for doing so. So I disagree with the notion that working over the Christmas holiday is intrinsically bad.

But listen, every company should be able to set the policy and procedure and schedule that reflects their goals and values. There's absolutely nothing wrong with Arrow deciding to shut down for two weeks. But if that's the case, if they're shut down for two weeks, then be shut down for two weeks. Do what Kino and Criterion and Warner Archives and others do - simply do not schedule any releases for the period when you will be closed.

With a December 29th release date, The Apartment wasn't going to arrive in time for Christmas anyway. But if they had put that date down as January 9th instead, someone would have been there at the office to notice something wasn't right here, and could have addressed whatever was going wrong before it became a headache for potential customers.

As I've said before, I have yet to purchase an Arrow release, but I always want to support home video labels that to quality work and do right by their customers. I can't speak to the quality of the disc here, but the way Arrow has conducted itself here makes me not want to support them in the future. The message that I'm getting from this is, "You can try to order the product if you want, but we probably won't ever send it to you, and if you complain, we'll tell you that gravity isn't real." That doesn't inspire a lot of confidence or brand loyalty. And yes, sometimes I have to buy discs from labels I don't like because it's better to have the movie than to not have the movie... but does Arrow really want to be a "hold your nose and buy" brand or a "I'm really excited that it's coming from this label!" brand?

 

[Rodney]

Well -- it appears that the AMAZON Stash has been found and it's up for order at 29.99.
The scalpers spigot may have been turned off.

Thanks. just put in my order. Or re-order. Or re-re-re-order. I'm just hoping this one actually gets delivered.

 

[B-ROLL]

Thanks. just put in my order. Or re-order. Or re-re-re-order. I'm just hoping this one actually gets delivered.

Ditto, Xerox, Mimeo or +1 (for the kiddos)

Items Ordered Price
1 of: The Apartment (Limited Edition) [Blu-ray], Jack Lemmon
Sold by: Amazon.com Services, Inc.

Condition: New
$29.99
1 of: Tomorrow is Forever (Blu-ray), Claudette Colbert
Sold by: ClassicFlix (seller profile)

Condition: New
$17.88


Shipping Speed:
FREE Shipping

Payment information
Item(s) Subtotal: $47.87
Shipping & Handling: $4.97
Free Shipping: -$4.97
Courtesy Credit: -$5.00
-----
Total before tax: $42.87

We'll see if it actually gets delivered (otherwise at least I should get free shipping on the 2nd title - I'm not a Prime Member -"anymore" ...)

 

[Colin Jacobson]

So at least a few then, but you're really ther first. At least virtually no cancellations from them


Well -- it appears that the AMAZON Stash has been found and it's up for order at 29.99.
The scalpers spigot may have been turned off.

Crap - that's terrible news! I planned to sell my copy and fully fund my retirement!

 

[Mark Booth]

There are folks that bought the UK version that are now ordering the region A version (now that it's available at Amazon again). Question: Why? The ONLY difference is the UK rating tag on the disc and packaging. Surely that's not reason to buy it twice? And, if so, seriously?

We watched the film (UK version) today and I was VERY impressed with the transfer. I did, however, notice two spots where the film shifted sideways in the gate and then back again. It happened very quickly but sitting 10 feet from a 75" display it was quite noticeable. The first occurrence gave me a bit of vertigo feeling but only for a quick moment.

Mark

 

[Matt Hough]

Speaking of The Music Man signage in the film, I noticed that Robert Preston was still with the show two years into the run (I'm assuming the movie did its location work in 1959) and that Paul Ford had joined the cast as Mayor Shinn (which he likewise reprised in the movie version). Their names were big enough to see without pausing and walking up to the screen to study that poster.

 

[haineshisway]

Well, well, well - Amazon just "happened" to find copies, huh? Just like that, magic. In other words, all 6,000 copies did NOT sell out, had never sold out, were never anywhere NEAR selling out - this was some kind of silly game to get people in panic mode so that when the copies were magically found (I mean, come ON), everyone, being in panic mode, would buy them immediately. Had they not done this, I believe this limited edition would have been around for six months or more. This just reeks.

 

[Winston T. Boogie]

What? This can't be happening! This was the most sought after film in the history of blu-ray! It sold out in seconds! These new copies they found have to be fakes! Call the FBI! We need an investigation! This is just not possible! Billy Wilder films are in greater demand now than they ever have been!

 

[SAhmed]

I reckon we need a Special Counsel to investigate this Obstruction of Purchase!

Regards,

 

[Jonathan Perregaux]

To be sure, I snapped up 2,000 copies for myself. One to watch, 1,999 to take a bath in. They should arrive packed in hay and driven by a mule named Frank. Oh, and I think I lost my God-damned mind over this.

 

[JoshZ]

But listen, every company should be able to set the policy and procedure and schedule that reflects their goals and values. There's absolutely nothing wrong with Arrow deciding to shut down for two weeks. But if that's the case, if they're shut down for two weeks, then be shut down for two weeks. Do what Kino and Criterion and Warner Archives and others do - simply do not schedule any releases for the period when you will be closed.

With a December 29th release date, The Apartment wasn't going to arrive in time for Christmas anyway. But if they had put that date down as January 9th instead, someone would have been there at the office to notice something wasn't right here, and could have addressed whatever was going wrong before it became a headache for potential customers.

Every week I write a blog post summarizing new Blu-ray releases for the U.S. market. One thing I've noticed is that Arrow titles are almost always delayed from whatever date they were originally announced. If I see an Arrow title on my site's release calendar for that week, I make a point of going to Amazon to see how far back the street date has been pushed, as it almost inevitably will be.

My assumption is that Arrow has had chronic distribution pipeline problems getting product to the U.S. market on time. As I recall, The Apartment was originally scheduled for an early December release. I suspect that it had to be pushed back, as many Arrow titles are, and realistically should have been moved to January. However, Arrow must have wanted this release on the books for 2017 for accounting purposes, and so put it on the latest possible date for that calendar year, even though their offices would be closed at that time. Then, when that deadline came, their distributor couldn't actually deliver the product on time and we wound up with this fiasco.

None of this excuses Arrow's handling of the situation. However, I believe this to be the most plausible explanation for how we got here.

 

[Robert Harris]

Speaking of The Music Man signage in the film, I noticed that Robert Preston was still with the show two years into the run (I'm assuming the movie did its location work in 1959) and that Paul Ford had joined the cast as Mayor Shinn (which he likewise reprised in the movie version). Their names were big enough to see without pausing and walking up to the screen to study that poster.

Don’t know about location work, but I was on set summer of 1961 in Burbank.