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A Few Words About A few words about...™The Apartment -- in Blu-ray

Discussion in 'Blu-ray and UHD' started by Robert Harris, Nov 6, 2017.

  1. Mike Frezon

    Mike Frezon Moderator
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    "They've all been sitting in a cardboard box...on Funk & Wagnall's porch...since Noon today. NO ONE knows the contents of those boxes..."

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Robert Harris

    Robert Harris Archivist
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    From the info I’m receiving, and it is nothing “official” from Arrow, there seems to be a presumption, that a non-SE should be coming in short order.

    Advice is to pay no more than MSRP.
     
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  3. AlexNH

    AlexNH Stunt Coordinator

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    I just received this from Arrow via FB.

    Hi Alex, We didn't cancel anyone's order and we haven't drastically cut anyone's allocation of this item. We are sorry that you've missed out but as previously said, we shipped out Amazon's full allocation via our US distributor. This cancellation is an issue to question with the retailer although we do understand why you'd want to check with us as well. We understand that a lot of customers have missed out and have been left disappointed and we are therefore looking into what we can do to rectify things from our end and could well have a statement/update for you all over the next week or so. Thank you for your understanding. AV
     
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  4. Mark VH

    Mark VH Second Unit

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    Took them long enough. And again, throwing the blame on Amazon, whether it's their fault or not, is bad form. You made the product, you shipped the product, it's your responsibility to communicate any issues to the customer, because Amazon won't and you know it. Seriously, this Isn't. That. Hard.
     
  5. RJGT

    RJGT Extra

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    An issue I would like to raise is why this was a limited edition in the first place. I know Arrow issues many films as limited editions but unless their licence for the film specifies a limit, why bother to issue in artificially limited quantities when it can hurt potential customers and limit potential profits for Arrow and its retailers? As a collector of classic films, the fact an issue is “limited” plays absolutely no factor in whether I want it or not. If an issue is successful, why not satisfy demand, produce more and make more money? It seems to be a marketing gimmick that has now blown up in the face of Arrow and its customers. Far from being an incentive to buy, any Arrow film marketed as a “limited edition” will be a disincentive to buy after this fiasco. Just for the record, my Oct. 11 Amazon.com order was cancelled Dec. 29, just a few days after receiving an updated estimated shipping date. Amazon.uk says my subsequent order with them has been dispatched but it is yet to arrive. Until it does, as a backup I have an order in the queue with Amazon.ca.
     
  6. TravisR

    TravisR Studio Mogul

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    I assume that it's because of the book (and, by extension, the box) that comes with it. That's why I think there will be a regular non-limited release that has the same disc but no book or box.
     
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  7. Bob Cashill

    Bob Cashill Producer

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    After my Amazon order was cancelled (annoyingly; I ordered it the minute it was available, but them's the breaks) I reordered it via Amazon UK, and it arrived today, six days later. Contrary to the box and disc itself, which are labeled Region B, it played fine on my Region A-only Samsung. The booklet is very nice and the package is worth obtaining.
     
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  8. Scott Merryfield

    Scott Merryfield Executive Producer

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    I received a nice surprise from Deep Discount DVD today. Several days ago they cancelled the order for this title I placed with them after Amazon cancelled my initial order, but today I received the following email:

    Dear Valued Customer, You recently placed an order(s) for The Apartment Limited Edition Blu-ray. Unfortunately, that item was a limited edition and your order was cancelled in error. We understand your disappointment and wish to offer you a $20 off promo code for use on your next purchase from us.

    I used the $20 code to order the UHD of Dunkirk for $9.99.
     
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  9. Message #269 of 453 Jan 3, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2018
    Mark Booth

    Mark Booth Cinematographer
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    My copy from Amazon UK was delivered today, 6 days sooner than the original estimate. It made it across the pond in fine shape.

    BTW, I totally agree with Arrow that this whole debacle lies primarily in Amazon's lap. That's why I beat up Amazon for as large of a promo credit as I could get.

    But I sent Arrow an email last week and they have yet to reply to it. Very poor customer service on their part too. I'm inclined to skip future Arrow releases.

    Mark
     
  10. dana martin

    dana martin Producer

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    so how long is this limited deal, 6000 copies, and a limited run of non special editions. maybe in the future, possibly another distributor in the US could pick this up at a later date, something with a C, or a K, or a T somewhere in their names. .... oh the endless possibilities.
     
  11. David Norman

    David Norman Producer

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    I don;t think the non-LE has any limit on copies -- at least none of the prior std releases seemed to have an upper limit
     
  12. Robert Harris

    Robert Harris Archivist
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    To be fair, Arrow’s offices have been closed for the holidays, re-opening today. Emails have noted that.
     
  13. AlexNH

    AlexNH Stunt Coordinator

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    Me: Does your license with MGM prohibit you making more??? If you just told us what's going maybe we'd stop bugging you. Clearly there is more demand, so make more. Aren't you in the business of selling discs?!

    AV: Hi Alex, As we said, we understand the scale of disappointment with what happened in the US and want to do something about it, we will have a statement in the not too distant future. Thank you for your support. AV
     
  14. Reggie W

    Reggie W Producer

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    When Arrow announced this title and said it would be a limited edition of 3000 units in the US and 3000 in the UK my thinking was "These will be around for a while." because nothing about the sales of classic film on blu-ray in the past show a black and white film of this vintage being capable of selling 6000 units prior to release.

    Sure, you could say that about horror films or a sci-fi title...but a film like The Apartment...no way. So, in my estimation Arrow did absolutely nothing wrong. Why would they suspect that this film would be different than so many others released before it. Why would they increase the special edition to more than 6000 units? Twilight Time can take years to sell 3000 copies of a classic black & white title...and there is never a frenzy of complaints that "My order was canceled!" or "I didn't get mine!" and people only miss out if they wait a year or years to place an order.

    I don't even know if Amazon did anything wrong here. I mean did somebody prove they knew they were only going to get a handful of these discs and kept selling them anyway?

    My question on this title is what retailers got the 3000 discs for the US? Amazon I would think got the majority of them...Wal-mart, Best Buy, and Target do not even put Arrow titles on their shelves. Barnes & Noble do occasionally have some titles but even when they have an Arrow sale, which they did recently, their stores near me had a paltry 2 to 4 titles max out of their catalog. Bullmoose is the only store in New England that I know of where you can go to find a selection of Arrow titles and they either got none of these or only a couple. So where did people buy them? Were there really thousands more orders for The Apartment than there was stock?

    I see people claiming in places on the internet that the orders dwarfed the stock by 10 to 20 to 1. Really? I am supposed to believe now that a classic black and white title like The Apartment comes out...not in a budget edition but one you will likely pay between $24.00 to $49.99 for (because not everybody got the Amazon deal on this) and there was a total frenzy to get this title and pay what most people seem to complain is "too much for a disc" or an "I'll wait for a sale." pricing when that has NEVER happened before. Add in that this is not the first release on blu-ray so some buyers would have to double dip for this...which many won't unless the double dip is cheap...and it seems ridiculous that this title could sell out prior to ever hitting the street.

    I mean, my feeling remains this is great for classic film on blu-ray but when has this ever happened before? Are people serious that some 30,000-60,000 people tried to order this? This seems like a fairy tale.
     
  15. David Norman

    David Norman Producer

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    The 10-20:1 number was likely from me, but that was basically a basic guess going from people reporting Cancellations vs posts saying their Amazon order shipped. I have no access to actual order or stock numbers.

    Here's what I have found reading 6 or so of the most active Movie/Bluray/Collectors forums, sampling Arrow FB, a couple Reddit threads, etc. -- also realizing that many of the same people post in several of these place so absolute numbers may even be smaller that it appears in the mirror.

    AmazonUS -- lots of orders canceled, a 2-3 dozen people reported shipped
    Walmart -- almost all orders canceled though a few people got shipment after cancellations.
    BBY -- none reported shipped and I'm not even sure they had a preorder
    Target -- zero
    Bullmoose -- initially a few stores had shelf stock and a handful of orders shipped. Most were canceled
    Amoeba -- I read 2-3 people got orders shipped

    ALLIANCE group and their dozens of outlets-- arguably (or not so much anymore) the largest Media Distributor in NA
    BN -- 3-4 stores in the country apparently got shelf stock. 4-5 people say they got orders shipped from online orders
    Deep Discount -- 90-95% orders canceled.
    FYE -- had a few in stock this morning online. 2-3 people found a random copy in store. Most have come up empty
    Blowitoutahere, importcds, DvdPlanet, etc -- none reported at all.

    Ebay -- about 20 items auctioned over the last 2 weeks and another 10 single item auctions are listed now (no seller is listing multiples).
    4 Amazon Marketplace sellers list items and 2 or 3 of those are the same Ebay sellers

    AmazonCa -- still listed as a preorder so no shipments

    If there are 3000 US/NA completed sales (completed almost entirely in preorder stage) they are very well hidden. This is not the type release that Family Video is going to suck up stock. If the resellers/scalpers got hold of 2500 copies then they're parceling them out beyond deliberately.

    Now it;s marginally conceivable there are thousands of Bluray Buyers who know of Arrow Video and were in the shadows buying these up who don't participate online at all, but that just seems a bit farfetched knowing most collectors mentalities who actually buy $30-50 physical Bluray media from specialty boutique Studios -- much less 60yo B&W re-releases even as well known/respected as The Apartment might be.
     
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  16. titch

    titch Supporting Actor

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    To everyone expressing stunned disbelief that one of Arrow's special editions sells out virtually before the day of sale: this is nothing new to region B collectors. Their fantastic Withnail & I box set, where one could choose which quote one wanted on the box? Sold out way before street date. Their Hellraiser Scarlet Box? Ditto. Deep Red? The Same. Re-animator? Was on sale about one week from Amazon before it disappeared. Carrie? Etc etc. Arrow's limited edition collector's boxes are very good value for money and they disappear fast. That it happened with a classic American black & white movie is just proof that there are plenty of discerning collectors out there. The only difference this time round was that Amazon completely oversold what stock they were allocated, which is, understandably, very frustrating. Cancelling orders, placed two months in advance, is totally unacceptable. But don't go shooting Arrow and demanding e-mail support in the middle of the Christmas holiday.
     
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  17. cda1143

    cda1143 Agent

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    Thank you Robert. Another good point. I think we Americans can occasionally forget how things work in Europe - even in the UK. The Europeans believe that people are actually entitled to vacations. And vacation means just that - vacation.

    Chris
     
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  18. Mark VH

    Mark VH Second Unit

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    I ordered from Best Buy online and received a copy on Dec. 26. Also ordered one from B&N and received that one as well, on Dec. 29.
     
  19. Josh Steinberg

    Josh Steinberg Executive Producer
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    With respect to Arrow, I don't think it's appropriate for the company to have scheduled a major release during a period when they knew in advance that they would be closed. It's unprofessional to schedule a major release at a time when no one is available should any issues arise, which they clearly have.

    I'm not saying that Arrow employees don't deserve a vacation - merely that you can't schedule a release for a time when you are closed for vacation. If Arrow was going to be completed closed on 12/29, they should not have scheduled that as the release date.
     
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  20. David Norman

    David Norman Producer

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    So at least a few then, but you're really ther first. At least virtually no cancellations from them


    Well -- it appears that the AMAZON Stash has been found and it's up for order at 29.99.
    The scalpers spigot may have been turned off.
     
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