75% cable/satelite and 25% DVD viewing. Should I still get a widescreed HDTV ?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by anthony_b, Nov 23, 2001.

  1. anthony_b

    anthony_b Screenwriter

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    I'm having this dilema that I'm losing sleep over. My TV will be on almost the whole day (two small kids)and they watch mostly cartoons on cable and the satelite. I'm afraid of the "burn in effect". What would you do in my shoes ?...I'm looking into the Panny 47' widescreen but now I'm having second thoughts..[​IMG]
     
  2. Micheal

    Micheal Screenwriter

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    If you keep the contrast and brightness fairly low and just stretch the image to fit the 16 x 9 image you shouldn't have anything to worry about. My Toshiba 40 x 81 does a great job at stretching the image without distorting it so I don't have to use the grey side bars and worry about burn in.

    Mike
     
  3. Richard Burzynski

    Richard Burzynski Second Unit

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    "Should I still get a widescreed HDTV?"

    No.

    If your set will *primarly* playback analog 4:3 material, buy an analog 4:3 set.

    You will save money, not wind up watching short/fat people 75% of time (result of popular 16:9 TV stretch mode), and be surprised by how good the picture will still look - especially those DVD's. Analog sets give you a sharp picture. Just make sure you get the appropriate size set so that you don't see scan lines from the main seating position(s) and you will be happy.

    Consider these 4:3 models:

    (replace the xx with the screen size)

    Sony KPxxV90 series (little pricier than Mits)

    Mitsubishi VSxx609 series

    Price range depending on size (50"-60") and local store sales: $1250-1750

    Mits is running 14 months same as cash financing this week (my neighbor took delivery of his 50"-er yesterday).

    Both models above have 3DYC filters (important for analog material like cable) and good guns.

    Enjoy!

    Rich B.
     
  4. Jeff D.

    Jeff D. Supporting Actor

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    Anthony;

    If 4:3 viewing is the primary mode - especially if the set is on all day, I'd opt for a 4:3 set. Unless you don't mind using a stretch mode for non-critical 4:3 viewing.

    I wouldn't recommend analog though. I recommend anyone who is buying a new TV to go HD-ready. The progressive ability will make your DVDs look so much better. Cable won't look great - but when does it ever? As long as it isn't critical viewing (again, is cable ever critical viewing?), you'll be fine.

    I'd recommend one of the new Toshiba 4:3 sets. In addition to an absolutely stellar picture all-round, including an excellent line doubler with 3:2 pulldown detection and compensation, these sets also feature the anamorphic squeeze mode. With the flip of a switch in the menu, you can have a widescreen image full of the extra resolution on an anamorphic DVD. Definitely the best of both worlds.

    ----

    Jeff
     
  5. anthony_b

    anthony_b Screenwriter

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    Jeff, I think you're right. I forgot to mention that I want to buy an HDTV ready unit to use with my progressive scan DVD player. I guess I could always use the built in "squeeze" mode like on my 32'WEGA. I heard Toshiba's are good but the customer service is not that great ?...I'm thinking of buying in the next couple of weeks and have a budget of $2000.
     
  6. Jeff D.

    Jeff D. Supporting Actor

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    Anthony;
    You're tailor-made for a Tosh! [​IMG]
    The new series is spectacular. They claim it comes down to their new CRT and lens technology. I don't know enough to say if that's true or not, but I DO know that the new series boasts a markedly better image than the previous series.
    Customer service is hard to judge. I've heard many happy stories, as well as read of a few nightmares on this forum. When it comes down to it, I think you'll find a bad customer service story for _every_ manufacturer if you ask around. No one is perfect. I certainly haven't heard so many bad stories to think something was seriously wrong.
    ----
    Jeff
     
  7. anthony_b

    anthony_b Screenwriter

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    Jeff, what are the model numbers of the new series ? (under $2000 us ).Under 50 inches ?
     
  8. Sam C

    Sam C Stunt Coordinator

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    16:9 or 4:3 ... I had the same dilema ... First a big gripe ...

    In 4:3 why can't someone make the grey panels on the side of the screen black instead of this annoying grey/blue ? I refuse to watch this way ... I made the suffering through the 'stretch' modes because I just can't stand those bars ...

    Now in stretch mode (I have a Mits and it offers 4 modes other than the 4:3) At first these modes looked very strange to me ... Especially on any sporting event ... The field/court looked very long and short height wise ... It's something I don't even notice anymore ... Also any view that shows only one person on the television looks very strange ... Catch a shot of someone like Jennifer Lopez and you think her hips are wide enough to land a 747 on ...

    Now that being said ... dvd's ... Excellent ... Nothing really needs to be said about that due to you know in 16:9 it'll come down to pic quality for you rather than should you get 16:9 ...
     
  9. anthony_b

    anthony_b Screenwriter

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    I think I'll just get a 4:3 that has a decent pull down feature....
     
  10. Jeff D.

    Jeff D. Supporting Actor

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    Anthony:
    You'd be looking at the 43" model. Either the 43H71 or 43HX71. The HX model is the Cinema Series model. You can compare them at these sites:
    43HX71
    43H71
    ----
    Jeff
     
  11. CaspianM

    CaspianM Stunt Coordinator

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    I just bought a 53"H71 and despite some quirks it is a phenomenon set. Last year I had a Sony HS10 and the difference is.. well no comparison. This set performs well from both analog and hi def signal. The colors are not in same league as my projector (Nec 1352LC) but it is a must buy if one is looking for a HD 4x3 set.
     
  12. anthony_b

    anthony_b Screenwriter

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    Is the cinema series the "better" line ?....and why ?
     
  13. Henry Colonna

    Henry Colonna Stunt Coordinator

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    I just went through the same thing. I wound up with a Toshiba 61H71.

    Why?

    I watch both DVDs and 16x9. Plus, at Sears, with a 10% off sale, I got the set real cheap. How cheap? On continental trade, they sell the set for $2080. Sears pricematched and took 10% off that. I paid $1880 plus $40 shipping and 4.5% sales tax for a set that sells in the store for $2699 or occasionally $2599.

    I personally chose to limit my choices to the sets that Sears sell because of their great customer service and they are a national chain - I may move across continent next year and because you can take advantage of them during their 10% off sales and Internet matching.

    If you price what I paid per inch of TV for this set in this manner it was QUITE cheap. A 16x9 set would have been considerably more per inch.

    The HX models are definately better. But Sears doesn't sell them, so I left them out of my choices.
     
  14. Andy_B

    Andy_B Stunt Coordinator

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    I noticed no one asked you what TV shows you watch.

    ER, The West Wing, Enterprise, Babylon 5, and most movies on Bravo, TCM and AMC are all broadcast in widescreen.

    This is the start of a trend that will only see more shows, not less, move to a wide screen (16:9) format.

    If you buy a widescreen, test drive the different stretch algorithms.

    The Toshiba's and Pioneer's have VERY good stretch algorithms, while the Mits is very poor (IMO).

    Of the 50 or so people who have seen my widescreen, not one of them ever knew it was in a stretch mode while watching TV.

    Andy
     
  15. anthony_b

    anthony_b Screenwriter

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    You're right, that's something I'm going to look into. I went to check the "strech mode" on the Panny 47' wide screen and the guy from the store did not know how to do it.
     
  16. Jeff D.

    Jeff D. Supporting Actor

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    The Cinema Series is simply the top-end of Toshiba product. All the extra niceties are reserved for this line.
    For example, the protective screen gets an anti-reflective coating in the Cinema Series. It is still extremely reflective - so I'd hate to see what the regular, non-coated screen looks like! [​IMG]
    Also, I think you get the best lenses (Niltava) and CRTs (Pegasus) in the Cinema Series. The cabinet is a bit nicer in the Cinema Series as well, and the remote is slightly improved.
    Just a bunch of "little" things, but they can make the set more refined.
    While a lot of shows are widescreen, a lot aren't either. Especially your kids' cartoons. [​IMG] The 4:3's really offer the best of both worlds. They will display widescreen HD material in its proper aspect ration without a loss of resolution (again, the squeeze mode), so you can have your cake and eat it too. I will second the fact that the Toshiba widescreen's have wonderful stretch modes, though.
    ----
    Jeff
     
  17. CaspianM

    CaspianM Stunt Coordinator

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    I have been putting this set (53"H710) into some tests.

    For those who really are interested in buying one might want to read this.

    My sample came last Tuesday from Sears. When I powered it up I switched to Movie mode and turned the contrast to 0 and disabled the DNR. After about 60 min, I start looking at various sources. The convergence looked OK and got better with 9 ponit convergence.

    Initial impression- picture looked dark, however, appeared solid and nice. I noticed green in shadow and red/blue in bright portion. I also felt that the set had some edge enhancement along fine detail of the image.

    After a few days playing and experimenting with various setting, I played the Video Essential looking at some patterns.

    First the gray scale was way off and looked closer to 6500 K in the low window (shadow) and was hi in hi window (bright white). Second my suspicious turned out to be true about the enhancement. The multiburst pattern showed a good deal of enhancement up to 6 MHz. Unlike other sets that opt for lower/mid frequency edge enhancement via SVM, Toshiba has both of the world. Although the SVM can be disabled through the user's menu by going into Movie mode. Unfortunately the upper frequency enhancement is there to stay. Even with sharpness at 0, it sticks there like glue. Looking at the multiburst patter you will see all the lines carry a white ghost line with them from mid to the right of screen. In fact all the lines appear as while rather than gray.

    Looking at some all white pattern shows a 2" vertical strip to the right that has a reddish cast after overscan adjustment. This is not correctable with convergence and lens stripping. On lower left corner about 4" diameter a strong bluish cast is very prominent and annoying. Again these quirks to the best of my judgment cannot be corrected. Some one may offer some help here if there is a known cure.

    Gray scale adjustment was a breeze with this set. It tracks the scale very nicely ( using a Phillips color analyzer which I borrowed). I have a data sheet that I might post.

    I forgot to mention focus out of box was average. In particular my red was out a good deal electronically and green optically. After focus, this set delivers detailed images even with sharpness at 10%. Given this, I really do not understand why Toshiba opted for edge enhancement in upper freq. Range!

    The color temp uniformity is typical of any RPTV and the set probably improves by lens stripping which I have not done.

    Playing some DVDs, images are excellent with dynamic colors and bold presentation. The internal line doubler works well with cable/SAT but it was not a match with my Sony 9000ES. A stand alone DVD player should help a whole lot. The picture was really involving and I hardly noticed the flaws.

    The set has extremely good black level and retention under rapid transition from bright to dark scenes indicating a good power supply.

    I personally found the menu navigation a pain and a single preference not enough. The set exhibit orange cast to skin tone once the set gray scale is calibrated. But then again, which set has true color corrected RGB?

    Choices for a 4x3 set with raster squeeze option are limited to this set and Sony and... Sony is more expensive and I do not know if it actually is a better set or not.

    I am planning to return this set because my set cannot sync well to 1080i time to time. For the time being I will try to look at the Sony.

    With all the above quirks which are not that uncommon these days, Toshiba delivers excellent performance for the buck specially if you get your set price matched. I hope it helps.
     
  18. Henry Colonna

    Henry Colonna Stunt Coordinator

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    Cool, thanks Mahmood.

    $1980 for 61H71? From a reputable retailer? I get nervous when I spend that much money but I think I did good :-]
     
  19. John_Bonner

    John_Bonner Supporting Actor

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    Well Anthony....what did you decide??
     
  20. anthony_b

    anthony_b Screenwriter

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    Because of my family's viewing habits, I'm better of with a 4:3 TV with a good "squeeze" mode. Now my decision is between a Panny 51 inch or a Toshiba 43 inch. (the toshiba with the cost of a stand will be the same as the Panny !!).
     

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