6 Rocket 750 Towers and a 200 Center? Go all out? PLEASE READ, sorry its long!!

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Adam_Reiter, Feb 15, 2003.

  1. Adam_Reiter

    Adam_Reiter Second Unit

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    Ok guys. I am sorry to keep throwing out these long ass posts, but with the money around the corner, I of course want to make the best decision I can. Ok, here is one of my new dilemmas. It turns out that I may be getting $4000 to $4500 to spend after splitting the refund with the wife. I originally thought it was only $3000. Being $3000, I have a clear plan. Now that its $4000 or more, I feel I have more options. Ok, on with the senarios.

    Just in case you have not read my other LONG posts, here is a quick run down of my equipment.

    Anthem AVM-20 : Preamp
    Aragon 2007 7ch : Amp
    Pioneer DV-444 : DVD Player
    nOrh CD-1 : CD Player
    SVS B4-Plus MONSTER SUB (just ordered)
    QSC RM2450 2500 watt sub amp (going to buy)

    Option #1:
    Ok, Originally with $3000 to $3300 I was going to get the Rocket Loudspeaker package with the RS 750 Towers, RSC 200 Center, and RSS Dipoles for $2260 shipped. Then get the upgrade on my Anthem to THX Ultra2 $350, then get the Denon 1600 DVD Player, $400 shipped, and get an AV Rack $280 shipped.

    Option#2:
    However, with $4000, I have a new option, I can get everything in Option #1, plus get the Rocket RS 250 bookshelves to complete the 6th and 7th speaker for 7.1. With option #1, I was just going to use existing bookshelves I allready have to do the 6th and 7th back channels for the time being.

    OR

    Option #3
    Instead of the 6th and 7th Rocket speakers, use the existing bookshelves I have and use the extra money to get a Panamax 5510 power/line conditioner.


    OR

    Option #4 (the Ultimate, yet Sacrifice option)
    I am wondering about possibly the Ultimate solution. Should I use the Entire $4000+ to get the Rocket RSC200 Center, and then go 6 Rocket RS750's!!!!!???? This would mean that I couldn't yet get the upgrade, the a/v rack, or the new dvd player. But, I have always subscribed to the theory of getting the BIG Purchases out of the way when you can. An upgrade is $350. A dvd player is $400. An A/V Rack is $400. These things, to me, are easily picked up throughout the year. Especially since the new Samsung HD-DVD, 1080i player is comming out in June for less than $400, I should probably wait on the DVD Player anyway.

    I will now list the reasons I am even thinking of Option #4. Ideally the best 7.1 setup would use 7 identical speakers. I couldn't imagine how good this setup would sound. I would guess phenominal!! Specially at over 200 ultra clean watts per channel going into these babies!! Then, think of SACD or DVD-A down the road. I would have the ULTIMATE SACD setup. 6 IDENTICAL and KICK BUTT Tower SPEAKERS for Rocket!! Few setups would even come close to rivaling this setup! I am speculating of course. Especially being that I am going to have that B4-Plus sub, I can only dream of what it would sound like. If I go with this option, you guys are gonna have to drive out and hear this sh*t!!!! hehe

    Now I will list potential cons I can think of with this setup. I am worried about space. It's going to be a little hard using 6 towers. My present room is only 15 feet wide. With bookshelves, I can mount on the wall. With towers, you are limited to stands only. Might get really tricky especially since we might be moving soon. I might have to pick houses for rent just based on a big enogh room to host the HT. Potentially an ugly situation.

    Second, I am worried how a tower would sound in place of a wall mounted dipole side surround. The dipole at least will give an enveloping sound. More non directional. I am worried that with towers on the side surrounds, the speakers might be saying "HEY, ITS ME!! I AM YOUR SURROUND SPEAKER!!" and possibly be very localized instead of dispersed.

    I will be doing much more HT than SACD, specially since I dont even own a SACD yet. But, I plan on getting one. But, I might have to wait until next years refund. This of course depends on the level of SACD. I am sure I would cave in and at least get a $400-$500 SACD player on eBay just the test the system out. Depends on how long it would take me to get the Anthem upgrade, and a new DVD and the A/V rack and a PANAMAX during the year. But, I need a job first. hehe.

    So, would it be way more trouble that its worth going 6 towers!!??

    Or would I reach an audio nirvana and should go for it at all costs and just pick up the little extras along the way?

    Like I said before, if its within my means and I can get it, I usually try. I am just not sure yet wether 6 towers would be such a leap in sound quality as to justify cutting out all the extra stuff in order to achieve it. Not to mention the potential placement headaches. But, going with all the extra stuff now, I would probably NEVER justify going to a 6 tower setup. $300 and $400 a pop is much easier to come up with than $1400 or $2800 at a time. I have run out of stuff to sell. Gonna have to rely on work, or taxes for the rest.

    You guys have been such a HUGE help. I love this forum, and can't wait to start getting replies. Thanx so much.

    SlaggBot@hotmail.com
    Adam
     
  2. Bolivar G

    Bolivar G Second Unit

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    6 Rocket towers sounds like over kill to me[​IMG]
    But if I had the money for it, what the hell[​IMG]
     
  3. Khoa Tran

    Khoa Tran Supporting Actor

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    i say, go for the towers...but that's just me because i'm crazy about this stuff =) bigger the better!!!
     
  4. Adam_Reiter

    Adam_Reiter Second Unit

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    The 6 towers idea sounds so kick ass to me. Its just that I have no idea how it would do in the side surround catergory.

    It would be nice to demo 6 towers, and then 4 towers and the Dipoles for side surround.

    But another thing that bugs me is that the Dipole surrounds dont have the same vifa tweet as the rest of the speakers. They would definately be the weak spot in a 6.1 SACD/DVD-A setup.
     
  5. Brian Schucher

    Brian Schucher Supporting Actor

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    I just think perhaps the room size is the biggest issue with placement of six towers... I would personally do the bookshelves in the rear...
     
  6. Randy G

    Randy G Second Unit

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    Hi Adam,

    I've been following the Rocket thread for more than a year now and thoroughly understand your predicament. My buddy received his 750's yesterday and can also afford to do the complete 750 setup, but I suggested to him otherwise.
    Don't forget that alot of this boils down to one's own personal preference regarding side speakers. My own preference is the diffuse ambience you get from dipoles speakers...I love 'em...mostly because I HATE my side speakers shouting at me "HERE I AM" when the bullets are firing, footsteps, doorslams, etc.
    His downstairs family room is also about 15 feet wide by about 25 ft long or so and it's perfect for dipoles on the right side(when you're facing the TV, but not so perfect on the left because there's a doorway right there. HOWEVER, above the doorway is a space of about 18 inches or so. I told him that although a little bit high, they'd be just fine for dipoles. Otherwise, you'd have to stick another big old Rocket in the middle of the doorway/opening. He also pondered the notion of using dipoles on the sides and 750's for the rears, but along the back wall is a bar/serving counter. I said "why the hell mess up that space when you can mount some 250's near the ceiling at about the same height as the dipoles. Ya know what?..it's the PERFECT solution for him. Once again, he can afford to do the whole 750 thing all around, but I personally think it would be overkill and I'd hate to see him ruin his living space when it ain't necessary, in order to still have phenomenal sound. As a matter of fact, I'll be doing the same type of setup, but may/may not use the Rockets. I may be going with GR-Research or Von Schweikert instead, but the Rockets aren't out of the running.

    Good Luck on your decision,

    Randy
     
  7. Adam_Reiter

    Adam_Reiter Second Unit

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    Yeah, thanx Randy. I am wonering if a 6 tower setup would really only work in an actuall Theater you built specifically for Home Theater. That way you can make it to spec.

    I think maybe if SACD was my thing, the 6 towers would be perfect, but since I am dealing with a wife who NEVER likes it LOUD [​IMG], and Home Theater 85%, Maybe the Dipole and Bookshelves are the way to go for side and rear surround. A lot less headaches as for as placement, that is FOR SURE.

    I almost think I would need a room 25 ft wide in order to properly do Towers as side surrounds. 3 ft out from the wall, plus the depth of the speaker, plus space between listener and speaker.

    Man, I don't know... I am gonna have to mill it over a bit. Hopefully I get some more comments/advice as to what to do.
     
  8. Adam_Reiter

    Adam_Reiter Second Unit

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    Also, the only thing that has me ruling out 750 Towers as rear surrounds and Dipoles as Side Surrounds, is that the tweeters on the dipoles aren't that same. So SACD would lack because of the dipoles.

    There isn't going to be THAT much info going to the back surround speakers, which is why the bookshelves would do fine. I wouldn't need towers for rear as they would be TOTALLY underutilized. I would only put towers in the back if I put towers on the side. Its kinda like all or nothing.

    If I am not going all out to make my system a Dual System of 6 towers for SACD and Home Theater, then the RS250's would be plenty for home theater. Plus I would have way more mounting options.
     
  9. Randy G

    Randy G Second Unit

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    Adam,

    I fully concur with your spacial perceptions as to what would be proper for a full 750 setup.
    Yeah, the tweets are different for the dipoles, but as anal as we sometimes get, I think they'd be just fine...especially since Mark(Chief Rocketeer) voiced the dipoles to match up to the 750 fronts. Also, if your dipoles are mounted a few feet above your head(as they should be), then you might be dealing with the aural anomoly of the sound dipping back DOWN toward your 750's in the rear....might make for a roller coaster effect. I think you'll be totally happy with the dipole sides and 250 rears.

    Randy

    ps- as for SACD, I'm not a believer. I think they just mix SACD recordings "hotter" to make them sound "different" than plain old CDs...just my opinion. Also, I prefer the main thrust of my recordings to come from the FRONT soundstage. While neat at first, I don't like the feeling of being in the center of the stage. That's why I like dipoles for music as well.
     
  10. Adam_Reiter

    Adam_Reiter Second Unit

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    Randy, did you see the new mounting feet/platforms that Onix just came out with for the Rocket towers? I am definately going to get those. Bigger footprint, get the towers off the ground for better imaging. Sweet. Tell your bro.


    http://www.av123.com/products_produc...ers&product=19
     
  11. Geoff L

    Geoff L Screenwriter

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    Little can I add but will wine a bit for you...[​IMG]
    I can only add, I am so extremly envious of your, oh so tuff decesion.

    Take your time and weigh all the factors that are in play, or may in the future come into play.Looks as though you are trying to do this, smart idea!

    Good golly and a B-4 to boot, I am crying right now...[​IMG]

    You might consider the 6-750's and (also a set of the poles).
    Put them on a switch box.
    When doing HT run the poles and when doing SCAD, etc, switch to the 750's. Another expence, but the best of both worlds. Also if you do move later and don't have room for the 750's for the sides, the poles should fit fine while the 2 extra 750's take a rest in storage at my house. Kidding...[​IMG]

    It's more just money but as you said, why limit yourself....Boy I wish I had 1/2 your budget and electronic goodies!

    Cheers
    Geoff
     
  12. Randy G

    Randy G Second Unit

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    Adam,

    Yeah, I'm familiar with the risers but an skeptical of the sound improvement hype. I mean, if ya need the riser to bring the tweeter up to ear level, that's great, but otherwise, unless you point/tilt the tweeter downwards, your ears will be off axis. Maybe for rears, you could use them to match up with the dipole height, but the risers are probably not high enough. All depends upon the height of your listening position.

    Randy

    ps- I suppose they could also be useful for bringing the tweeter level with the center channel tweeter...maybe.
     
  13. Seth_L

    Seth_L Screenwriter

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    I'd go with 6 750s and the RCS200. Right now I have 2 750s and when I can afford it I'm going to get the Ultra package (4 750s and RSC200). I don't know if it's right for you, or not.

    Seth
     
  14. Steve Zimmerman

    Steve Zimmerman Second Unit

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    Let me throw some advice into the already crowded ring. Aside from the actual 5 (or 7) speakers you are considering purchasing, you already have close to, what, $10000 spent on the other gear?

    I am as big a Rocket fan as there is on the planet, but frankly I think your spending priorities are out of whack. It seems CRAZY to me to spend that much money on other gear and then limit your spending on your front 3 speakers to around $1700 or so.

    If it were me, I would buy the very best three front speakers $4000 could buy and use some less expensive surrounds until I had another $2000 or to upgrade the back and side channels.

    In other words, it is my opinion that the amount you've already spent on other gear warrants something like the Onix Ref 2s as mains and the Onix Ref center channel AT THE VERY LEAST.

    Otherwise, as I've said before, you're like the dude at the gym with the 24 inch biceps and the 14 inch quadriceps.

    Also, you're surely not planning (with the SVS B4 at your disposal) to run your 6 channel music without crossing over to the subwoofer for your low bass, are you? Reaally? You *really* ought to consider purchasing an Outlaw ICBM to take advantage of that subwoofer, IMO.

    --Steve
     
  15. Adam_Reiter

    Adam_Reiter Second Unit

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    Steve, what you don't understand is, the WAF! Basically, if it were not for the beautiful look on the Rockets, I would be buying nOrh loudspeakers for HT. It just so happens Rockets are supposedly a phenominal speaker. My wife hates the look of the Ref's and frankly, so do I. I hate the look of any boxy speaker. I was actually going to go nOrh, until I found the Rockets. I like the look of Rockets. Its nice to have a set, speacially for 7 damn speakers, that they all match and look good, as well as sound good.

    If I were to go for a better speaker, I would go nOrh Marble 9.0's. But, I'd rather buy a pair of those down the line for 2ch, or maybe possibly the front 3. I dont know, come to think of it, I could probably pull off getting 3 nOrh 9.0 Marbles for the front. Not sure if the wife would like the mix and match tho.

    This is why I put it up for discussion, I haven't pulled trigger yet.

    Of course I plan on using the sub for music.
     
  16. Khoa Tran

    Khoa Tran Supporting Actor

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    i think the norhs are just plain ugly...get the rockets
     
  17. Steve Zimmerman

    Steve Zimmerman Second Unit

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    I understand the WAF, believe me. In that case, I'd say go with bookshelf surrounds, save the money and upgrade the fronts to the Stratas in another year or two. I'd bet they will pass WAF muster if they're not too big.

    I would still go with the Outlaw ICBM when you are ready to got the SACD/DVD-A route. You can find them used for less than $200.

    --Steve
     
  18. Mike Matheson

    Mike Matheson Second Unit

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    Adam,

    My vote (for all but the most extreme, controlled, custom-built dedicated HT-room situations) would not be for the towers all the way around. Less money, more flexible setup.

    I'd take the money and try playing with other toys--an ICBM, a BPT 2.5 or 3.5 balanced power unit (or the Panamax), etc.

    BTW, I don't recall what you're doing video-wise? Seems like you definitely will have the audio portion handled. . .
     
  19. Adam_Reiter

    Adam_Reiter Second Unit

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    Well, it looks as tho $4500 is gonna be my take. I have decided to get the Rocket Ultra Package with an Extra set of Dipoles. That way I can run SACD with the front 3 and the back surrounds. SACD will play through the 4 towers, the center, and the sub. I am also gonna get risers for both sets of towers. That is gonna run about $3600 shipped. Then I will get the Anthem Upgrade and a A/V rack.

    I wish I allready had the upgrade to the Anthem done. In that case I would get the Panamax 5510.

    BTW, I dont need the ICBM if I allready have a Rane PE17. Am I right?
     
  20. Randy G

    Randy G Second Unit

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    Personally, I agree with Mike, but I'd spend the extra money on a Buttkicker for the couch or floor.

    Randy
     

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