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5 Westerns you'd like to see on blu (1 Viewer)

MLamarre

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The Plainsman
Union Pacific
Bad Day at Black Rock
Ride the High Country
The Ox-Bow Incident

and 5 westerns never even released on DVD

The Big Sky
Viva Zapata!
Run of the Arrow
Johnny Guitar
North West Mounted Police
 

Originally Posted by benbess /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Another fine list of Westerns--but most of them I haven't seen. I think I saw the Sons of Katie Elder long ago--a very good Wayne Western, iirc.
I've always been curious about OK because Deforest Kelley is in it, right? As a big Star Trek fan it would be interesting to see him in something earlier....Is he good? Does he get much screen time. All star cast, as I recall.
And what's funny is that on Star Trek they did an episode about the OK Corral called Spectre of the Gun. That must have been a hoot for him...
Kelley plays one of the Earp brothers and has a rather modest role, but it is kind of cool to see him pre-Star Trek.
 

Richard--W

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One of the things I love most about Anthony Mann's westerns is that he shot them in the National Parks in the ultra-high resolution of dye-transfer color. Not only is the scenery spectacular and way western, but the cinematography is technically correct. This is what western landscapes and western portraiture should look like. What I love most about Budd Boetticher's westerns with Randolph Scott is that he shot them in Lone Pine in dye-transfer color and ... wait, I said that already. Quick, put all the 1950s location westerns that were shot in dye-transfer color onto Blu-Ray, and source them from photochemical restorations rather than from digital intermediates. 1950s westerns were made for Blu-Ray.
Four independent westerns, Monte Hellman's Ride In the Whirlwind and its brother The Shooting (both 1965), Peter Fonda's The Hired Hand (1971), and Robert Young's amazing The Ballad of Gregorio Cortez (1983) should be given a chance on Blu-Ray. The latter was shot by Reynaldo Villalobos himself, a dp who has a rare gift for westerns. These films accomplish A-list quality on miniscule budgets. They look good, and Blu-Ray can show them off to advantage.
The five westerns I most want to see on Blu-Ray are:
1961 One-Eyed Jacks (Paramount)
1969 Tell Them Willie Boy Is Here (Universal)
1970 Monte Walsh (Fox)
1971 McCabe & Mrs. Miller (Warner Brothers)
1972 Ulzana's Raid (Universal)
1973 Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid -(MGM / WB) - director's work-print with theatrical version as a supplement
McCabe & Mrs. Miller and Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid involved specialized processing originally and need to be carefully color-timed and transferred. The latter had an autumnal color pallet in the theaters that I can only describe as deep, rich, and buoyant. It is completely flattened and drained and coated over with a brown residue on the Special Edition DVD. McCabe & Mrs. Miller is noted for its "patina" effect as the darkness gradually brightens as the weather changes and the town grows. The standard DVD is okay but the light doesn't breathe the way it did in the theaters. Blu-Ray can bring out the pictorial best in both films.
 

Richard--W

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Originally Posted by benbess /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu#post_3687220
John: The Searchers, as you say, has truly amazing pq. I'm not sure, but I think that's a special case, both because it was shot in the high res VistaVision format, and because the 3 color separation masters survived in, I think, excellent condition.
I'm not sure, but I think for many pictures the separation masters don't survive, or weren't made correctly to begin with. Could be wrong about that. Someone here probably knows....
The Searchers needs to be wrestled away from the individual currently in charge of it and completely redone by a different pair of eyes.
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by Richard--W /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu#post_3687291
The Searchers needs to be wrestled away from the individual currently in charge of it and completely redone by a different pair of eyes.
Richard W: The colors are a little weird sometimes, I admit. Sometimes the flesh tones seem to me slightly off. But having never seen it any other way than blu, it's hard for me to tell. And the level of detail is amazing.
So, Richard, any chance you could be a little bit more specific in your comments....
Is the slight--to me, anyway--strangeness of the colors from the use of the sep masters? But I guess that could be adjusted.....?
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by Vincent_P /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu#post_3687253

Agree 100% with this one. HEAVEN'S GATE would make for a fascinating special edition on Blu-ray. They could include both the long and short edits of the film, Ron Epstein's excellent documentary FINAL CUT (viewable on Youtube but never released on DVD), and any number of other extras exploring the bruhaha that accompanied the making and release of this film, which is one of my favorites of all time.

Vincent
Vincent: Nice to find another fan of this film. There aren't many others. I've only seen the long version.

And thanks so much for recommending that very fine documentary. Hadn't heard about it, and just watched it on youtube. Good stuff. Cimino was a bit....ah....well....the film still has considerable merit, imho, but it is flawed.
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by MLamarre /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu#post_3687262
The Plainsman
Union Pacific
Bad Day at Black Rock
Ride the High Country
The Ox-Bow Incident
and 5 westerns never even released on DVD
The Big Sky
Viva Zapata!
Run of the Arrow
Johnny Guitar
North West Mounted Police
MLamarre: DeMille!! Like Heaven's Gate it's an acquired or at least a strange taste--but I'm with ya buddy! My favorite is The Plainsman. That's a highly entertaining film. Boris Karloff as the Indian chief, right? Good stuff. Union Pacific has several good moments, but also has even more problems than your average Western in terms of how it deals with Native Americans. Don't think I've ever seen more than a few minutes of NW Mounted. That was in technicolor, wasn't it? I have seen his film after that, Reap the Wild Wind--a non-Western with Wayne--and that's some fun hokum.
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by Richard--W /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu#post_3687289
One of the things I love most about Anthony Mann's westerns is that he shot them in the National Parks in the ultra-high resolution of dye-transfer color. Not only is the scenery spectacular and way western, but the cinematography is technically correct. This is what western landscapes and western portraiture should look like. What I love most about Budd Boetticher's westerns with Randolph Scott is that he shot them in Lone Pine in dye-transfer color and ... wait, I said that already. Quick, put all the 1950s location westerns that were shot in dye-transfer color onto Blu-Ray, and source them from photochemical restorations rather than from digital intermediates. 1950s westerns were made for Blu-Ray.
Four independent westerns, Monte Hellman's Ride In the Whirlwind and its brother The Shooting (both 1965), Peter Fonda's The Hired Hand (1971), and Robert Young's amazing The Ballad of Gregorio Cortez (1983) should be given a chance on Blu-Ray. The latter was shot by Reynaldo Villalobos himself, a dp who has a rare gift for westerns. These films accomplish A-list quality on miniscule budgets. They look good, and Blu-Ray can show them off to advantage.
The five westerns I most want to see on Blu-Ray are:
1961 One-Eyed Jacks (Paramount)
1969 Tell Them Willie Boy Is Here (Universal)
1970 Monte Walsh (Fox)
1971 McCabe & Mrs. Miller (Warner Brothers)
1972 Ulzana's Raid (Universal)
1973 Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid -(MGM / WB) - director's work-print with theatrical version as a supplement
McCabe & Mrs. Miller and Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid involved specialized processing originally and need to be carefully color-timed and transferred. The latter had an autumnal color pallet in the theaters that I can only describe as deep, rich, and buoyant. It is completely flattened and drained and coated over with a brown residue on the Special Edition DVD. McCabe & Mrs. Miller is noted for its "patina" effect as the darkness gradually brightens as the weather changes and the town grows. The standard DVD is okay but the light doesn't breathe the way it did in the theaters. Blu-Ray can bring out the pictorial best in both films.
Yes, Anthony Mann Westerns are always very strong, just as good as Ford's, and in some ways better, imho. They are less...what? Sentimental? I don't know. There's a certain reality to them. They're more believable, maybe?
I don't understand about ultra high res dye transfer color, but it sounds good.
 

Matt Hough

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I reviewed the Criterion DVD release of The Furies some months ago, so if you do a search, the review should come up. It's a really excellent western.
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by MattH. /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu#post_3687305

I reviewed the Criterion DVD release of The Furies some months ago, so if you do a search, the review should come up. It's a really excellent western.
Good review. Thanks. Would like to see it now...
 

Vincent_P

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Originally Posted by benbess /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Vincent: Nice to find another fan of this film. There aren't many others. I've only seen the long version.
And thanks so much for recommending that very fine documentary. Hadn't heard about it, and just watched it on youtube. Good stuff. Cimino was a bit....ah....well....the film still has considerable merit, imho, but it is flawed.
The short version is an interesting watch in that it's not just a simple edit of the long version but a complete reworking of the film. Scenes are moved around in order, dialogue is re-written and redubbed, and most importantly, several minutes of new footage is incorporated into the shorter version. Some of the new material consists of a random shot here or there to cover up other stuff that was cut from the long version, but there's completely new dramatic material, as well. The most interesting stuff surrounds the final battle sequence- we actually see Averill arrive at the battle scene while it's winding down, for example, as opposed to cutting to night as we do in the long cut after he leaves Ella. The short cut has only been released on DVD overseas, I bought it from amazon.fr.
BTW- great HEAVEN'S GATE fanpage on facebook here: http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/pages/Michael-Ciminos-Heavens-Gate/63498056944
Vincent
 

Originally Posted by benbess /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Richard W: The colors are a little weird sometimes, I admit. Sometimes the flesh tones seem to me slightly off. But having never seen it any other way than blu, it's hard for me to tell. And the level of detail is amazing.
So, Richard, any chance you could be a little bit more specific in your comments....
Is the slight--to me, anyway--strangeness of the colors from the use of the sep masters? But I guess that could be adjusted.....?
You might want to look at an old Robert A. Harris column from The Digital Bits. There are problems with the surviving materials. http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articles/robertharris/harris082106.html
 

SAhmed

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Just about all of my choices have been mentioned - anyway...

1) Once Upon A Time In The West
2) Shane
3) Duck You Sucker
4) Junior Bonner
5) A Bullet For The General

Regards,
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by Richard--W /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu#post_3687289
One of the things I love most about Anthony Mann's westerns is that he shot them in the National Parks in the ultra-high resolution of dye-transfer color. Not only is the scenery spectacular and way western, but the cinematography is technically correct. This is what western landscapes and western portraiture should look like. What I love most about Budd Boetticher's westerns with Randolph Scott is that he shot them in Lone Pine in dye-transfer color and ... wait, I said that already. Quick, put all the 1950s location westerns that were shot in dye-transfer color onto Blu-Ray, and source them from photochemical restorations rather than from digital intermediates. 1950s westerns were made for Blu-Ray.
Four independent westerns, Monte Hellman's Ride In the Whirlwind and its brother The Shooting (both 1965), Peter Fonda's The Hired Hand (1971), and Robert Young's amazing The Ballad of Gregorio Cortez (1983) should be given a chance on Blu-Ray. The latter was shot by Reynaldo Villalobos himself, a dp who has a rare gift for westerns. These films accomplish A-list quality on miniscule budgets. They look good, and Blu-Ray can show them off to advantage.
The five westerns I most want to see on Blu-Ray are:
1961 One-Eyed Jacks (Paramount)
1969 Tell Them Willie Boy Is Here (Universal)
1970 Monte Walsh (Fox)
1971 McCabe & Mrs. Miller (Warner Brothers)
1972 Ulzana's Raid (Universal)
1973 Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid -(MGM / WB) - director's work-print with theatrical version as a supplement
McCabe & Mrs. Miller and Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid involved specialized processing originally and need to be carefully color-timed and transferred. The latter had an autumnal color pallet in the theaters that I can only describe as deep, rich, and buoyant. It is completely flattened and drained and coated over with a brown residue on the Special Edition DVD. McCabe & Mrs. Miller is noted for its "patina" effect as the darkness gradually brightens as the weather changes and the town grows. The standard DVD is okay but the light doesn't breathe the way it did in the theaters. Blu-Ray can bring out the pictorial best in both films.
Richard W: This is a very interesting post. Thanks.
Here's a part that deserves highlighting: "Quick, put all the 1950s location westerns that were shot in dye-transfer color onto Blu-Ray, and source them from photochemical restorations rather than from digital intermediates."
So, does this differ from what Ford did?
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by Vincent_P /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu/30#post_3687321
The short version is an interesting watch in that it's not just a simple edit of the long version but a complete reworking of the film. Scenes are moved around in order, dialogue is re-written and redubbed, and most importantly, several minutes of new footage is incorporated into the shorter version. Some of the new material consists of a random shot here or there to cover up other stuff that was cut from the long version, but there's completely new dramatic material, as well. The most interesting stuff surrounds the final battle sequence- we actually see Averill arrive at the battle scene while it's winding down, for example, as opposed to cutting to night as we do in the long cut after he leaves Ella. The short cut has only been released on DVD overseas, I bought it from amazon.fr.
BTW- great HEAVEN'S GATE fanpage on facebook here: http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/pages/Michael-Ciminos-Heavens-Gate/63498056944
Vincent
Vincent: Interesting. So both versions are worth watching, in other words. I somehow thought that the short cut was mostly done by the studio, but obviously I'm wrong about that. Do you know if good negatives or separations exist for both versions? But mgm, which just imploded, probably owns the rights, and so the odds for a blu--never good to begin with--just got worse.
From that documentary Final Cut I have to say that the critics were really quite cruel to this film. Sure it has flaws, but it's ambitious and in parts quite beautiful and then brutal, and has a take on Western history that's not often seen.
Nice facebook page!
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by John Hermes /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu/30#post_3687327
You might want to look at an old Robert A. Harris column from The Digital Bits. There are problems with the surviving materials. http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articles/robertharris/harris082106.html
Interesting article. Thanks. Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but it seems like the color separations have survived pretty well--and thank goodness for that--but maybe it's how these bw materials are interpreted and converted to color that's the issue....? Don't know, just asking...
 

benbess

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Originally Posted by SAhmed /forum/thread/300270/5-westerns-you-d-like-to-see-on-blu/30#post_3687404
Just about all of my choices have been mentioned - anyway...
1) Once Upon A Time In The West
2) Shane
3) Duck You Sucker
4) Junior Bonner
5) A Bullet For The General
Regards,
SAhmed: Nice list. Thanks. Don't know the last three. Any chance you'd post a few comments on why they are favorites?
 

benbess

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Western question of the day: 3:10 to Yuma--do you prefer the 1957 version or the 2007 version, and why?

I just watched the early version on Netflix a day or so ago. What a different ending from the new one. I like both about equally, but for different reasons....
 

Eric Peterson

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It's all about "Once Upon a Time in the West" for me. Everything after that is gravy, but I would like to see the following:
Shane
The Big Country
One-Eyed Jacks
High Plains Drifter
 

PaulaJ

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In addition to everything already suggested (especially Shane), how about:

Blood on the Moon (cinematography by Nicholas Musuraca)
The Gunfighter
The complete Ford Cavalry trilogy, not just She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
The Tollgate (or another William S. Hart western)
The Iron Horse
The Big Trail
All the Anthony Mann-James Stewart westerns
A John Payne western -- Silver Lode or Rebel in Town. Even better, how about both of them? :)
True Grit
Broken Arrow
The Long Riders
The Misfits
Shanghai Noon

How about one or some of Errol Flynn's westerns?

I saw the new print of Jubal at the TCM Classic Film Fest and it looks great now. I'd love to see it on Blu-ray.

Restoration and remastering of the Roy Rogers movies and then release on BD. The Golden Stallion on Blu-ray...

If it counts as a modern-day western, The Last Picture Show.


and... The Oklahoma Kid. ;) OK, just kidding about that one. :)
 

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