I'm not seeing the need for 4k in home theaters for ancient films
A Frank Capra film. 1939. Beautifully shot in black & white by Joseph Walker.

I’ve been asked if I’m prejudiced against older films to which HDR has been added, and I’m not.

It generally works fine, if not on projectors.

I’ve worked hard for aeons to get my projectors and panels to play nicely with HDR, going back to when it initially appeared along with digital audio tracks on laser discs. As I recall the disc was Miami Vice for digital audio.

Mr. Smith just wasn’t working for me. Blacks tended to clot, and darkness prevailed.

So…

Back into settings.

I must thank Sony for instructions that hardly cover details, so after a helpful chat with Value Electronics Robert Zohn – his background is technical, so he knows his stuff – I experimented, and it seems that the Sony OLED panels will remember settings for both HDR as well as Dolby Vision, once you enter the expert area.

After an hour of experimentation – a wonderful Cabernet at hand, and helpful – Mr. Smith looks far better than before adjustment.

Is it better than the recent Blu-ray?

Not certain, as that was an exquisite job, and simply magnificent.

On an OLED, the imagery is better, but in this specific case, I’m just not seeing the need.

As to 4k, we do get a bit more resolution in pixel peeping mode, and it’s nice. But grain will be deplored by thousands, as it appears akin to a sand storm.

I can live with it, and it’s fine from a nominal seating distance, but I’m not seeing the need for 4k in home theaters for ancient films, that arrived just after sound.

As an aside, these comments are not against the work performed, which is fine. My thoughts regard the overall technology. These films should absolutely be restored and preserved in 4k.

4k Image – 5 &#8211; OLED Panel<br />
4k Image &#8211; 4 &#8211; Projection

Audio – 5

Pass / Fail – Pass

Upgrade from Blu-ray &#8211; Not necessarily

Very Highly Recommended

RAH

Published by

Robert Harris

editor,member

PMF

Cinematographer
Supporter
Joined
May 6, 2015
Messages
4,273
Real Name
Philip
1939 and 4K. With “The Wizard of Oz”, all was just perfect upon perfect. “Mr. Smith Goes to Washington”? Well, it doesn’t sound like a deal breaker by any means, whatsoever. As for “Gone with the Wind” making the transition to this format? Well, that has already been discussed in another thread - by RAH, I do believe - as a venture more likely to produce a visual mess; revealing all the seams of its matte shots, special effects and the likes.

Robert, you once wrote that not all films are candidates for the 4K/UHD format. So, with this in mind, are there any remaining titles from 1939 that you would deem to be a sure-fire winner for this newer technology?
 
Last edited:

PMF

Cinematographer
Supporter
Joined
May 6, 2015
Messages
4,273
Real Name
Philip
Thanks for the review. I'll stick with the original Blu-ray disc which is good enough for me.
Ah, yes, but if this boxed set of 6 titles provides us collectors with at least 4 perfections, then I would encourage us all to purchase and support this offering from the Grover Crisp camp.

Price-wise, 4 titles - all new to the 4K/UHD format - works out to a more than fair deal. Meanwhile, I suspect that our support will signal votes of encouragements towards future volumes and future 4K/UHD treasures.

Anyone here, please correct me if I’m wrong, but I am certain that this boxed set is designed in such a fashion that provides the “stand-alone” fans with the option to remove each title from the box and place them individually and accordingly upon our shelves.

As for “Mr. Smith Goes to Washington”, my equipment is regretfully behind the times in matters concerning the State-of-the-Art. So, until that time arrives where improvements occur, I’ve derived a great deal of pleasure from testing my eye on newer transfers to see if upticks or greater are noticeable; as often such improvements are present and are screaming out to be released. Therefore, this Capra offering will prove to be a fun test. Even if these improvements are merely subtle, I’ll consider it to be a victory for this important classic of classics.

Through and through, this boxed-set is a winner!!! :cheers:
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: benbess

David Norman

Producer
Premium
Joined
Oct 12, 2001
Messages
6,491
Location
Charlotte, NC
Ah, yes, but if this boxed set of 6 titles provides us collectors with at least 4 perfections, then I would encourage us all to purchase and support this offering from the Grover Crisp camp.

Price-wise, 4 titles - all new to the 4K/UHD format - works out to a more than fair deal. Meanwhile, I suspect that our support will signal votes of encouragements towards future volumes and future 4K/UHD treasures.

Anyone here, please correct me if I’m wrong, but I am certain that this boxed set is designed in such a fashion that provides the “stand-alone” fans with the option to remove each title from the box and place them individually and accordingly upon our shelves.

Through and through, this boxed-set is a winner!!! :cheers:

The boxset makes it quite easy to shelf display individual titles or even parcel out titles
 
  • Like
Reactions: PMF

Scott Merryfield

Film Editor
Senior HTF Member
Joined
Dec 16, 1998
Messages
15,809
Location
Michigan
Ah, yes, but if this boxed set of 6 titles provides us collectors with at least 4 perfections, then I would encourage us all to purchase and support this offering from the Grover Crisp camp.

Price-wise, 4 titles - all new to the 4K/UHD format - works out to a more than fair deal. Meanwhile, I suspect that our support will signal votes of encouragements towards future volumes and future 4K/UHD treasures.

Anyone here, please correct me if I’m wrong, but I am certain that this boxed set is designed in such a fashion that provides the “stand-alone” fans with the option to remove each title from the box and place them individually and accordingly upon our shelves.

Through and through, this boxed-set is a winner!!! :cheers:
Sorry, but I do not like being forced to purchase titles I do not want in 4K just to get those that I do. I'll wait for individual releases of these titles, as I am only interested in LoA, possibly Gandhi, and maybe Dr. Strangelove (depending on whether there's a significant improvement over the Criterion BD). I don't need a League of Their Own or Mr. Smith in 4K, and have no desire to see Jerry Maguire ever again.

I am hoping that Apple upgrades my copy of LoA to Dolby Vision soon. It's already in 4K. That will get me by until Sony releases it separately.
 

PMF

Cinematographer
Supporter
Joined
May 6, 2015
Messages
4,273
Real Name
Philip
Sorry, but I do not like being forced to purchase titles I do not want in 4K just to get those that I do. I'll wait for individual releases of these titles, as I am only interested in LoA, possibly Gandhi, and maybe Dr. Strangelove (depending on whether there's a significant improvement over the Criterion BD). I don't need a League of Their Own or Mr. Smith in 4K, and have no desire to see Jerry Maguire ever again.

I am hoping that Apple upgrades my copy of LoA to Dolby Vision soon. It's already in 4K. That will get me by until Sony releases it separately.
I can respect that. As it is, with the sole exception of this set, I’ve never liked those hostage situations, either. But don’t forget, I cited this box as being an impressive deal if there were a minimum of 4 titles to anyone’s liking; whereas for your needs, you cited only 3. On the other hand, though, this boxed set is inclusive of an 80 page book which contains the essays of Julie Kirgo.

In the end, everyone will shop towards their own individual tastes and budget. But in my case, this specific set has rung true and hit the right chord.
 
Last edited:

Johnny Angell

Played With Dinosaurs Member
Senior HTF Member
Joined
Dec 13, 1998
Messages
12,236
Location
Central Arkansas
Real Name
Johnny Angell
The studio held a popularity contest to select what would be in the set and this is what you get. From this thread, Mr Smith is dead weight, if you already own the blu ray which I do. I also have Jerry and I doubt 4K is benefitting this movie much. Sell me a set with LoA, Gandhi, Dr. Strangelove. Better yet sell them individually. And Mr. Studio Boss, don’t abdicate your responsibilities by doing a people’s choice selection.
 

Garysb

Cinematographer
Senior HTF Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2003
Messages
3,431
The studio held a popularity contest to select what would be in the set and this is what you get. From this thread, Mr Smith is dead weight, if you already own the blu ray which I do. I also have Jerry and I doubt 4K is benefitting this movie much. Sell me a set with LoA, Gandhi, Dr. Strangelove. Better yet sell them individually. And Mr. Studio Boss, don’t abdicate your responsibilities by doing a people’s choice selection.
Per the Digital Bites and elsewhere only Jerry Maguire and A League of Their Own were chosen by a poll of online consumers. It was done for more recent films to be included.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tony Bensley

jayembee

Second Unit
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
278
Real Name
Jerry
I can respect that. As it is, with the sole exception of this set, I’ve never liked those hostage situations, either.
I think the problem we have here is that the set is such a hodge-podge of titles. I wonder if one would consider it a different situation if a set was of a film series (like James Bond or Star Trek) and some of the individual films were unwanted.

I, myself, don't like -- and don't really want -- all of the films in those two particular series. I liked enough of the Trek movies to buy the two blu-ray sets when I could get them at a reasonable price. But there were too many Bond films I didn't want to spend the money on to buy the mucka-set of films, and just bought individual titles that I wanted.
 

PMF

Cinematographer
Supporter
Joined
May 6, 2015
Messages
4,273
Real Name
Philip
I am still of the belief that this Columbia Classics Collection will evolve into a many volumed series that will - in the end - contextually prove to be a fantastic mosaic of one studios legacy.
 

Johnny Angell

Played With Dinosaurs Member
Senior HTF Member
Joined
Dec 13, 1998
Messages
12,236
Location
Central Arkansas
Real Name
Johnny Angell
I am still of the belief that this Columbia Classics Collection will evolve into a many volumed series that will - in the end - contextually prove to be a fantastic mosaic of one studios legacy.
Well, right now, the studio is holding LoA for ransome and demanding we pay a bunch of cash to get it.
 

PMF

Cinematographer
Supporter
Joined
May 6, 2015
Messages
4,273
Real Name
Philip
Well, right now, the studio is holding LoA for ransome and demanding we pay a bunch of cash to get it.
Initially, and in truth, this was exactly how I felt.
And yes, I feel that all consumers should be given the simultaneous release date option of purchasing either a boxed collection or an a la carte of any given title. With little doubt, we are all surviving on varied budgets and, perhaps, such studio concessions should be taken into account; especially now, for these times that we are in.

As for me? This boxed set and the farewell TT sale marked my final luxury indulgences, for as long as unemployment and this pandemic remains within our presence.
 
Last edited:

g. mengert

Auditioning
Joined
May 28, 2020
Messages
2
Real Name
george
A Frank Capra film. 1939. Beautifully shot in black & white by Joseph Walker.

I've been asked if I'm prejudiced against older films to which HDR has been added, and I'm not.

It generally works fine, if not on projectors.

I've worked hard for aeons to get my projectors and panels to play nicely with HDR, going back to when it initially appeared along with digital audio tracks on laser discs. As I recall the disc was Miami Vice for digital audio.

Mr. Smith just wasn't working for me. Blacks tended to clot, and darkness prevailed.

So...

Back into settings.

I must thank Sony for instructions that hardly cover details, so after a helpful chat with Value Electronics Robert Zohn - his background is technical, so he knows his stuff - I experimented, and it seems that the Sony OLED panels will remember settings for both HDR as well as Dolby Vision, once you enter the expert area.

After an hour of experimentation - a wonderful Cabernet at hand, and helpful - Mr. Smith looks far better than before adjustment.

Is it better than the recent Blu-ray?

Not certain, as that was an exquisite job, and simply magnificent.

On an OLED, the imagery is better, but in this specific case, I'm just not seeing the need.

As to 4k, we do get a bit more resolution in pixel peeping mode, and it's nice. But grain will be deplored by thousands, as it appears akin to a sand storm.

I can live with it, and it's fine from a nominal seating distance, but I'm not seeing the need for 4k in home theaters for ancient films, that arrived just after sound.

As an aside, these comments are not against the work performed, which is fine. My thoughts regard the overall technology. These films should absolutely be restored and preserved in 4k.

4k Image – 5 - OLED Panel
4k Image - 4 - Projection

Audio – 5

Pass / Fail – Pass

Upgrade from Blu-ray - Not necessarily

Very Highly Recommended

RAH
I am truly confused by Mr. Harris' review. You seem to be saying that there is no need for this 4k upgrade, but you give the 4k OLED panel version an image rank of 5 and say the disc is Highly Recommended. Other reviewers I've read have raved about this 4k transfer. I have a Samsung QLED player. Do I need to do some kind of adjustment to get HDR?
 

Robert Harris

Archivist
Reviewer
Joined
Feb 8, 1999
Messages
12,972
Real Name
Robert Harris
I am truly confused by Mr. Harris' review. You seem to be saying that there is no need for this 4k upgrade, but you give the 4k OLED panel version an image rank of 5 and say the disc is Highly Recommended. Other reviewers I've read have raved about this 4k transfer. I have a Samsung QLED player. Do I need to do some kind of adjustment to get HDR?
Wild West. Player / panel dependent.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PMF