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Hitachi Red Push


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24 replies to this topic

#1 of 25 OFFLINE   daneli

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Posted November 18 2002 - 06:05 AM

Can someone tell me which of the below service mode settings would be for adjusting the Color decoder on my Hitachi 57SWX20B? I would like to remove the red push...

Thanks

ISF Mode Settings

RGBOUT0
SUB-BRT
G-DRV-H
G-DRV-M
G-DRV-S
R-DRV-H
R-DRV-M
R-DRV-S
R-CUT-H
R-CUT-M
R-CUT-S
G-CUT-H
G-CUT-M
G-CUT-S
B-CUT-H
B-CUT-M
B-CUT-S
SUBCNT0
COLOR-4
COLOR-F
COLOR-G
TINT-4
TINT-F
TINT-G
SHARP-4
SHARP-A
SHARP-B
SHARP-9
SHARP-E
RY-PH-4
RY-PH-F
RY-PH-G
R/B-GA4
R/B-GAF
R/B-GAG
GY-PH-4
GY-PH-F
GY-PH-G
G/B-GA4
G/B-GAF
G/B-GAG
DC-PNT0
DC-RET0
DC-LMT0
DABLPN0
DABLGA0
H-POSI
H-POSIH
H-POSID
APRTR-4
APRTR-A
APRTR-C
APRTR-E
CLT-4
CLT-A
CLT-C
CLT-E
SRT-TR4
SRT-TRA
SRT-TRC
SRT-TRE
SRT-FQ4
SRT-FQA
SRT-FQC
SRT-FQE
VSM-PH4
VSM-PHA
VSM-PHC
VSM-PHE
VSMGA4
VSMGAA
VSMGAC
VSMGAE
VSMGAM4
VSMGAMA
VSMGAMC
VSMGAME
CDE-4
CDE-A
CDE-C
CDE-E
CLPPHS0
HBPPH10
HBPPH20
DCUBRT0
DCUCNT0
OSDACL0
OSDBRT0
OSDCNT0
DCRRSW0
COLORG0
YCGA-0
BSP-0
APL/BS0
BLC-0
BDL-0
BS-ARE0
SRTGA-0
WPL-LE0
ABL-PN0
ABL-GA0
TYNCG10
DYNCG20
STATG10
STATG20
YOUTG-0
Y-DTL-0
WP-PNT0
WP-GA-0
HI-VRT0
WPS-0
BLS-0
G-STR-0
BSTRG-0
BSTRP-0
BSCHR10
BSCHR20
SCT-SW0
BBE-LO
BBE-HI
AGC
SURR
OSD-HP
OSD-VP
OSDCL12
OSDCL3
SMPLING
POLLING
START
TIMEOUT
STATUS
WAIT
REPEAT
HFRQ-N
SUBBRTH
M-CONT-H
M-CLR-H
S-CONT-H
S-CLR-H
INPUT1
INPUT2
SYNCDET
F-STD
H-STD
NOISE
DYGA
DCGA
VAPGA
VAPIN
YHCOR
HSYNC-M
VSYNC-M
CSYNC-M
HSYNC-S
VSYNC-S
CSYNC-S
M-CONT1
M-CONT3
M-CONTD
M-COR-1
M-COR-3
M-COR-D
MTINT-1
MTINT-3
MTINT-D
MTOFF00
MTOFQ-0
S-CONT2
S-CONT3
S-CONTD
S-CLR-2
S-CLR-3
S-CLR-D
STINT-2
STINT-3
STINT-D
STOFF00
STOFQ-0
Y-DL1-4
Y-DL1-D
Y-DL2-0
YBLACK4
YBLACKD
BBLACK4
BBLACKD
RBLACK4
RBLACKD
AFCRAN4
AFCRAND
F-DET4
HSEPL-4
HSEPL-5
HSEPL-6
HSEPL-C
VSEPL-4
VSEPL-5
VSEPL-6
VSEPL-C
DSEPL-A
DSEPL-C
AFCMD-L
AFCMD-3
AFCMD-D
VMODE-4
VMODE-5
48ISEP4
BANDW-4
BANDW-5
HDPOSI4
HDPOSI5
HDPOSI6
HDPOSI7
HDPOSIK

#2 of 25 OFFLINE   Michael TLV

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Posted November 18 2002 - 07:00 AM

Greetings

RY's R/B's
GY's G/B's

Regards
Michael @ The Laser Video Experience
THX Video Systems Instructor/ISF Instructor
Lion A/V Consultants Network - TLVEXP.com


#3 of 25 OFFLINE   Doug Schiller

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Posted November 18 2002 - 07:22 AM

Is it a simple on/off setting or do you have to tweak?

I have a new 51SWX20B and after reading the Perfect Vision review (for the 57) they say just fix the red push but they don't say exactly how.

Doug

#4 of 25 OFFLINE   Marc Alexander

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Posted November 18 2002 - 10:07 AM

It is a tweak which can be done with a test disc like AVIA. It can be done by eye to some degree (to fix sunburned skin tones), but you really need a test pattern. Someone who has performed the tweak should be able to post their before and after values and it should prove very close for everyone. Sounds like a job for Mike Fusick!
-------------------------
Equipment List
-------------------------
Mitsubishi 65807 HDTV
Kenwood VR-2090 DD/DTS Reciever; CD-3280 200 Disc ChangerKlipsch Synergy SpeakersKSF-10.5 mains; KSF-C5 center; KSF-S5 surrounds; KSW-300 subwooferOnkyo TX-DS474 DD ReceiverEnergy Take 5 SpeakersPanasonic...

#5 of 25 OFFLINE   Marc Alexander

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Posted November 18 2002 - 10:16 AM

Sorry guys, I thought I was at AVSforum. I haven't been at HTF in quite a long while. I don't know if MikeF frequents this forum or not.

Later
-------------------------
Equipment List
-------------------------
Mitsubishi 65807 HDTV
Kenwood VR-2090 DD/DTS Reciever; CD-3280 200 Disc ChangerKlipsch Synergy SpeakersKSF-10.5 mains; KSF-C5 center; KSF-S5 surrounds; KSW-300 subwooferOnkyo TX-DS474 DD ReceiverEnergy Take 5 SpeakersPanasonic...

#6 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted November 18 2002 - 01:20 PM

I hang around sometimes.

Put up the AVIA test screen with the color decoder check and adjust the color decoder parameters untill it looks correct, with no red, blue or Green push or pull.

Try to get everything inline.

Make sure you click the joystick when you change the values if you want to save it.

Make double sure you write down the original values of anything you change, before you change it, just in case somthing goes amiss.

Also, look in your blacks and darks and see if you see any color. You greyscale also could be off. (most likley isn't D6500K)

Consider getting is ISF-ed for that fix.

But, a slight Red Cut might help a bit as well...

Good luck


#7 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted November 19 2002 - 02:57 PM

Like MichealTLV said "RY's R/B's and GY's G/B's"

You can adjust the other colors as well, (green push/pull or blue push/pull)so everything should come out great color decoder wise.

Alot of set's don't let you do this, and have this much control. Means you have to live with it, or find other more difficult ways to fix it.

Consider yourself lucky in a way.

older sony's have a nice easy fix too..

Wish the MFG's would stop with this red push thing already.

What is very strange is that last years model SWX (which I own) had no red push, yet this years some are 20%.


#8 of 25 OFFLINE   Gregg Loewen

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Posted November 19 2002 - 04:46 PM

Hello,

Do not touch the red drive or red cut, they have nothing to do with red push.

Do not use the AVIA color decoder check to adjust the color decoder. This screen is only meant for measuring and not for adjusting.

Use the AVIA flashing color bars and with the appropriate filter. First select the blue bars and adjust the color and tint. Then select the red bars and adjust the R/Y and R/B controls. Then select the green bars and adjust the G/Y and G/B controls. Then start at the top again. After you complete the above process about 3 times you should have the chroma portion of your set nailed.

Best of luck and as MF has mentioned write down all the values prior to making an adjustment.

Gregg

The Sonodome - circa 2001
The Newest Sonotube - circa 2001
Gregg's DVDs updated...sometimes
Lion Audio Video Consultants usually current


#9 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted November 19 2002 - 05:00 PM

Thanks for the tips GreggPosted Image

I have not actually needed to perform this tweak myself, so your expertise had really shown through.


Gregg is also right about the Cut adjustment. I was recomending it only if there apeared color in the darks or blacks. Otherwise leave it, unless you think you can pefect greyscale by eye to your likeing.

#10 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted November 19 2002 - 05:03 PM

Gregg, Michael..??

What is your policy or tendency to help with tweaking and calibration info to the general forum public?

I usually notice that not many ISF guys are around sharing tips.

You two are the welcomed excepetionsPosted Image

Is there a written or unwritten rule about sharing ISF type info?

Or, perhaps since it is somewhat your profession or hobby and you have taken the time and effort to master such a thing, sharing that with people in the long run hurts your business?

Just curious.


#11 of 25 OFFLINE   Gregg Loewen

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Posted November 19 2002 - 05:54 PM

Michael, I dont mind at all. There are will be 3 million HD TVs in this country by the end of the year, I think I will be able to stay busy.

Some people like to protect trade secrets. Others like to go in and fix other's screw ups Posted Image

Im sending you a email too.

Regards

Gregg

The Sonodome - circa 2001
The Newest Sonotube - circa 2001
Gregg's DVDs updated...sometimes
Lion Audio Video Consultants usually current


#12 of 25 OFFLINE   Michael TLV

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Posted November 20 2002 - 01:28 AM

Greetings

"Why we help ..."

Gregg and I are enthusiasts first, calibrators second. We help people because we like to and we were helping them before we started calibrating so why change now.

Good will also goes both ways.

What we probably won't be divulging are items where one has to sign NDA's for obvious reasons.

For a short while, I used to fear that giving away too many techniques would hurt the business, but I snapped out of that. Once you come to the realization that there simply are some "tweaker" types that would never hire you or anyone else anyway ... and add to that the outrageous distances between people ... then the desire simply comes back to helping people. A good deed is reward in itself.

For every person that likes to do his own oil change, there is another that likes to use the jiffy lube ... each person can take what ever help we provide and go two ways ...

They can implement what we say or they decide to back away as that is something they would rather not do.

Occasionally, you fear that if you help too much, there is always a backlash ... which has occurred sporadically. The need to tear down those that like to help others. Fortunately that is rare.

(No Good Deed Goes Unpunished.)

Regards
Michael @ The Laser Video Experience
THX Video Systems Instructor/ISF Instructor
Lion A/V Consultants Network - TLVEXP.com


#13 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted November 20 2002 - 05:17 AM

Most people will never be able to do as good a job as the two of you.


I have been surfing these forums for a long time now, and I aproach it from a hobby standpoint, yet even I know that the two of you can do a better job than I, and would hire you myself in a second if I was not moving on to a FP theater in the new year.

Perhaps Gregg will make the trip when I get my projector up and running.

Gregg, do you have expertise in FP?


#14 of 25 OFFLINE   daneli

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Posted November 20 2002 - 06:47 AM

Thanks everyone for the tips...

Actually I am the type who likes to understand the way things work, do some things myself, and hire a professional to do the things I am incapable of doing.

I do plan on getting a calibration, but thought? Why not tinker in the meantime...

I played with the decoder settings last night using the AVIA Red Color Bars test pattern. It worked pretty well, and I think I have it close, but I am sure it needs more tweaking.

It appears that the (4) settings are for 480i signals the (F) for 480p signals and the (G) is for the 1080i signals.

What was interesting is that the (4) and (F) red gain settings were set much higher than the (G) settings. I do not have anything other than the dish that will output 1080i so I can not test that particular signal.

I will continue playing tonight...

DanEli

#15 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted November 20 2002 - 02:45 PM

Keep us posted. More info is always better.

I am sure as these RPTV's keep selling for the next 10 months, more than a few people are going to want to perform this tweak.


#16 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted November 27 2002 - 02:18 PM

Here is a "mutation" of this thread over at AVS..


http://www.avsforum.....hreadid=192667


#17 of 25 OFFLINE   PatrickLG

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Posted November 30 2002 - 02:12 PM

Well thanks everyone. especially MF here!!!

My 57SWX20B was very good out of the box!! But Im someone who cant leave well enough alone. After a few days with Avia and the above service menu color tweaks. This set is looking magnificent. A week of burn-in. its settling in very well.
I do have what I think is a color temperature issue as the flashing outer bars with the blue filter in Avia wont match perfectly. Ill probably let this set burn in a few more weeks, and seek out an ISF tech.

Any ISFs here do the north part of Los Angeles???
(Northridge, Granada Hills)

#18 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted December 01 2002 - 12:39 PM

You should try to center the screen and adjust overscan next...

Nothing wild, but a nice 3.5% is good.

Then master convergence and geometry.

I'll be around to helpPosted Image


#19 of 25 OFFLINE   PatrickLG

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Posted December 01 2002 - 02:06 PM

I think the greyscale is too hot. The grey bar on the color bars are almost whit and having trouble getting the blue saturation to match on the bars.

Dont worry, Ill get around to geometry and convergence soon enoughPosted Image

#20 of 25 OFFLINE   MichaelFusick

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Posted February 23 2003 - 03:22 AM

Ever get around to it?