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Disk access times


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#1 of 18 OFFLINE   Dean Cooper

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Posted September 04 2001 - 01:14 PM

I managed to dig up all of the disk access times for each of the next gen consoles. Check it out. Disc drive's max data transfer rate: Xbox: 6.9MB/s PS2: 5.5MB/s GC: 25Mbits/s = 3.1MB/s DC: 1.8MB/s I love the fact that Nintendo is the only one that states their disk drive specs in Mega bits instead of bytes. Classic… Dean

#2 of 18 OFFLINE   BrianB

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Posted September 04 2001 - 01:29 PM

Is that peak rates? Sustained rates? On the inside or outside of the discs?

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#3 of 18 OFFLINE   Dean Cooper

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Posted September 04 2001 - 01:54 PM

Good question Brian, unfortunately the specs are not specific enough to tell the answer. I'll dare a guess by saying the max rate that can be sustained by the drive for the entire disk. Should verify that these rates are only for the optical drives of each console. Dean

#4 of 18 OFFLINE   Morgan Jolley

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Posted September 04 2001 - 02:47 PM

Just in case you don't know, disk (with a K) is short for diskette and disc (with a C) means the round type, like CDs and DVDs. So the title should be "Disc access times". Just a little sidenote. I read that the GCN runs faster than the other next gen consoles and if the games are programmed correctly, it can have loading times lasting less than a few seconds. This is probably more of a programming thing than a hardware thing, but Nintendo displayed this in Luigi's Mansion at E3, even though it was incomplete. If this is true, then Nintendo has something on there side. Its not a big deal, but it is more appealing than the minute long (or longer) loading times for the PS2.

#5 of 18 OFFLINE   BrianB

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Posted September 04 2001 - 03:11 PM

[quote]

If this is true, then Nintendo has something on there side.

[quote]

And good programmers can do exactly the same thing on the other consoles - the disc access times are fast enough to allow it on all the main consoles.

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high resolution ipod featuring dlp hd programming is the best, almost as good as playstation 2 with wega windows media on a super cd! ps2 and tivo do dolby tv with broadband hdtv!

#6 of 18 OFFLINE   Morgan Jolley

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Posted September 04 2001 - 03:34 PM

True, but the GCN loads directly to the game, so there is no boot up or anything, so you are actually playing the game on the GCN before the PS2 or XB would have even loaded it. Also, games that feature a "no loading time" feature have one loading time when you start playing that is medium in length and then no loading from there on. GCN has a short loading time of only a second or two for the entire game. So while a no loading feature is available on other consoles, this console is supposed to have ultra-small loading times for everything.

#7 of 18 OFFLINE   Dean Cooper

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Posted September 04 2001 - 04:23 PM

Morgan would you happen to know any sights that go in to detail on this? Sounds like an interesting read. Thanks for the disk/disc correction. Dean

#8 of 18 OFFLINE   Greg Black

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Posted September 04 2001 - 04:32 PM

While it's true to some extent that all of the next-gen consoles can be programmed for in such ways that signifigantly reduces load times (such as pre-fetching, background loading, and forms of prediction), the bottom line is that very few developers actually implement such techniques that work well. Almost all of GCN's titles shown so far on video have exhibited very minimal load times, which are even more amazing considering the drives "slower" speed. However, the smaller diameter of the media does make up alot for this. I believe Psygnosis was one of the early pioneers of "speed loading" techniques on the PS. I remember the first time I played Destruction Derby 2 and was amazed at how much better the load times were than on Destruction Derby (and any other first-gen title for that matter.) It's amazing what they did with that little 2x drive.

#9 of 18 OFFLINE   Morgan Jolley

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Posted September 04 2001 - 04:38 PM

Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver for PSX doesn't have loading times at all. I think it was at GameSpot where they said that they played several GCN demos at E3 and that the loading times were minimal. Luigi's Mansion had the smallest loading time of all. I think the GCN can transfer data at over a GB/second through its memory and such, so this probably has something to do with it. The big thing is that the GCN is supposed to have quick loading times on all of its games, whereas the PS2 its on a game-by-game basis and we haven't heard about anything like this from the XB.

#10 of 18 OFFLINE   Dean Cooper

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Posted September 04 2001 - 05:23 PM

Its too bad Nintendo wasn't running their games on final hardware at E3. Well I understand that you can do some really cool things with data cashing I'm still not sure that the GCN can compete with a drive that is over double the speed and has a hard drive to cash to. HERE is a link to a video that shows the loading times of a DOA3 map which is quite complex. I wish there was a Nintendo movie that showed the same thing. One things for sure, they both should kick the snot out of the PS2 for load times.


Dean

#11 of 18 OFFLINE   Shawn O

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Posted September 04 2001 - 06:55 PM

True, but the GCN loads directly to the game, so there is no boot up or anything.SNIP.

Wasn't the PS2 [b]supposed to work this way.The reason why there as such a small ammount of memory was because it was only supposed to be a buffer?

#12 of 18 OFFLINE   Morgan Jolley

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Posted September 05 2001 - 01:08 PM

What I meant by "it loads directly to the game" is that there is no interface like for the PS2 where it loads up the game and shows the Sony Computer Entertainment logo and such. If you turn the console on without a game, it probably has some sort of GUI to let you handle the memory cards and such, but it loads straight to the game without any sort of interface. It also loads to the game quickly, so you aren't sitting there for the 20 some odd seconds it takes the game to load up.

#13 of 18 OFFLINE   Ron Gilbert

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Posted September 05 2001 - 03:44 PM

Morgan, I'd like to know more about the GC's direct to game bootup, any links? It would surprise me if this turned out to actually be the case, as I would think publishers would want their info front and center at the start of every game. And just FYI, the Xbox has an asynchronous disk transfer system - i.e., information can be loaded off the DVD and into the main memory and the hard drive data cache simultaneously. Of course, only a few developers will be using this feature initially, but once it becomes an ingrained standard...

#14 of 18 OFFLINE   Camp

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Posted September 05 2001 - 03:44 PM

Morgan, Are you sure? I could have sworn there was a Gamecube logo at the boot-up sequence they showed at the E3 press conference. Of course, I'm running totally on memory here...never a good thing.

#15 of 18 OFFLINE   Morgan Jolley

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Posted September 05 2001 - 05:32 PM

I think it was at GameSpot where they played a demo of Luigi's Mansion. They said there was a second or two of the GCN logo then the game loaded right up. This is entirely possible since all it needs to do is load up a few strings of data and then the game takes over. The PS2 has to read 4 different disc types, which is why it takes so long, and the DC had that stupid logo. The PSX had to read the disc as one of 2 types and then check if it was a legal copy. The GCN only reads one type of disc, so if they designate a certain part of the disc as the part that has the boot up for the game, so this is could very well be the case for the GCN. I assume not all games will have the quick load times that the GCN is supposed to have, but from what I hear, Luigi's Mansion does.

#16 of 18 OFFLINE   Scott L

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Posted September 05 2001 - 06:49 PM

Dean- GEEZ! I am speechless after watching that movie you posted. Although the loading times were insane, it was the graphics that knocked me out of my chair. I'm not a fan of DOA3 and don't intend to buy the game but that is the sweetest looking fighter I've seen. Thanks! As for the loading times, doesn't the Xbox's Hard drive speed things up immensely compared to the other consoles? Man it looks like I WILL be buying both systems this November.

#17 of 18 OFFLINE   Dean Cooper

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Posted September 05 2001 - 08:57 PM

Scott, if you want to see some insane game play Check this out
It's had me salivating for a couple days now, holy!
There are actually more movies of DOA3 on that page, heres the link to see them all .


Dean


[Edited last by Dean Cooper on September 05, 2001 at 11:59 PM]

#18 of 18 OFFLINE   Sean Oneil

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Posted September 05 2001 - 10:24 PM

Man, that 'Air Force Delta 2' movie is GREAT! (the first movie posted above this post) That is such a cool looking game! I am actually getting more excited about the X-Box now. I may even pre-order a bundle and pick up 'Air Force Delta' in addition to that. AFD2, DOA3, and HALO in 16x9 Widescreen and DD 5.1! Pretty nice stuff on the way for the X-Box launch. [Edited last by Sean Oneil on September 06, 2001 at 01:26 AM]




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