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"Bridge on River Kwai" Layer Change Problem?


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#1 of 16 OFFLINE   Jeff Job

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Posted April 12 2002 - 11:37 AM

I just purchased a copy of the 2 disc set of "Bridge on the River Kwai". Great disk, but I found that at the layer change, my screen goes black for 3-4 seconds, and then continues. This seems a little extreme. Also, after the layer change, my chapter index goes back to 1, even though the chapter index card lists all the chapters sequentially. I also can not chapter search backward across the layer change. I have to go back to the scene selection screen, or start the movie over. Has anyone else found this, or is this a disk/player problem? I have not yet tried another machine.

#2 of 16 OFFLINE   Pete B.

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Posted April 12 2002 - 11:41 AM

Works fine on my Pioneer 525 & Toshiba 3750. Pete

#3 of 16 OFFLINE   Eric Paddon

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Posted April 12 2002 - 11:42 AM

That happened to me the one time I played that. I haven't tried it on my DVD-ROM player for comparative purposes but it is the most disruptive layer change I've ever seen on a DVD that wasn't clearly defective at that point like "Man With The Golden Gun" was at the layer switch on many players. If anyone has some definitive word about this, I'd appreciate it too. Jarring layer shifts are still the one thing about DVD technology that can infuriate me at times, especially when I hear layer changes happening on the next to last note of climactic music. Its probably my having a cheap player that's the problem but that can't be helped for now alas.

#4 of 16 OFFLINE   paul o'donnell

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Posted April 12 2002 - 11:43 AM

Jeff, Its the way the disc is mastered. The layer change is in fact a title change as far as I can remember. Thats why the timer resets etc. It caused a longer than normal pause on my player, but there was no black screen. Quite annoying I agree.
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#5 of 16 OFFLINE   BrettB

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Posted April 12 2002 - 11:46 AM

I've only rented it so I don't know about the chapter search issues but the layer change was the worst I've ever seen.

#6 of 16 OFFLINE   Damin J Toell

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Posted April 12 2002 - 11:46 AM

[quote]

Has anyone else found this, or is this a disk/player problem? I have not yet tried another machine.

[quote]



it's not a player problem, it's the way the disc is encoded. most dual-layer discs are RSDL (reverse spiral dual-layer), in which the laser (as it reads from the inside out) would, once it hits the outer edge of the first layer, switch to the second layer and work in the opposite direction (from the outside in). BOTRK, however, isn't reverse spiral; when the first layer is finished, the laser goes back to the center of the disc and begins reading the second layer from the inside out. apparently, slightly more data can be held on a disc that is structured in this way. perhaps Columbia found that the extra space allowed for better a/v quality than would've been possible with a more-compressed RSDL disc. it may also be the case that structuring a disc in this way requires a title change as well, hence the problems you've noticed.



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#7 of 16 OFFLINE   Scott Kimball

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Posted April 12 2002 - 11:50 AM

Paul is correct... it's the way it was mastered and it is a change in title as well as layer. I don't know why they did it this way, but is is not a player problem. I had a longer than normal pause with no black screen, but then some players won't freeze the frame during refocusing while others do. I believe the longer pause is because instead of refocusing on the current location and moving backward, the lens resets to the start position during the change. -Scott

#8 of 16 OFFLINE   Dave F

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Posted April 12 2002 - 02:54 PM

If I remember correctly, this is only an issue on the limited edition release. The extra data on the disc required the odd decision in mastering. The standard edition, which doesn't have the additional data, has a smoother layer change. -Dave
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#9 of 16 OFFLINE   LukeB

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Posted April 12 2002 - 04:05 PM

[quote]

If I remember correctly, this is only an issue on the limited edition release. The extra data on the disc required the odd decision in mastering. The standard edition, which doesn't have the additional data, has a smoother layer change.

[quote]



What additional data is on Disc 1 from the Limited Edition? If I'm not mistaken, I thought all the extras were on Disc 2, which would make Disc 1 be identical to the non Limited Edition release?



I could be wrong about that, though.

#10 of 16 OFFLINE   Dave F

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Posted April 12 2002 - 04:15 PM

I think the difference is the DVD-rom content on disc 1 of the limited edition. -Dave
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#11 of 16 OFFLINE   Jeff Job

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Posted April 12 2002 - 04:51 PM

Thanks for the info. I do hear the laser moving alot during the transition, so it must be a mastering problem. In any case, I'd settle for this rather than having to flip the disc for the second half of the film like I have to do with "Amadeus".

#12 of 16 OFFLINE   paul o'donnell

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Posted April 13 2002 - 07:44 AM

[quote]

I think the difference is the DVD-rom content on disc 1 of the limited edition.

[quote]
Long layer change for some DVD-Rom which I cannot stand anyway! Dag-nam-it.
My uncle was reading the paper one morning and saw an ad that said "Drink Canada Dry"...and he was gone the next morning.

#13 of 16 OFFLINE   Christian Preischl

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Posted April 14 2002 - 04:03 AM

Hi, the Region 2 disc is the same, by the way. Chris

#14 of 16 OFFLINE   Daniel Kikin

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Posted April 15 2002 - 04:11 AM

I have the LE too and the counter reset to 0:00 at the layer change, but I'm not sure about the chapter index.

#15 of 16 OFFLINE   Scott Merryfield

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Posted April 15 2002 - 05:06 AM

[quote]

If I remember correctly, this is only an issue on the limited edition release. The extra data on the disc required the odd decision in mastering. The standard edition, which doesn't have the additional data, has a smoother layer change.

[quote]


The standard edition is mastered in the same way, using the title feature instead of the normal RSDL layer change. I own the standard edition, and was reminded of this poor layer change handling this past weekend when I watched my copy once again.

#16 of 16 OFFLINE   Dave F

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Posted April 15 2002 - 02:41 PM

Well I hate to say it Scott, but I'm kinda happy that the standard edition is hosed too. I'd hate to feel like I got the short end of the stick by buying the limited edition. Posted Image



-Dave
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