-

Jump to content



Photo

Crash in Somerset, Pennsylvania


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
28 replies to this topic

#1 of 29 OFFLINE   Brett_B

Brett_B

    Supporting Actor

  • 723 posts
  • Join Date: Oct 26 1999

Posted September 12 2001 - 06:22 AM

I have been trying to follow the developments in the other threads, but this topic keeps coming up with much speculation. I posted links, but from the amount of posts the links ended up being "buried".

So I decided to start this thread so people could get information relating to this particular incident.


Here are links to the local (Pittsburgh) newspapers about the Somerset crash

Pittsburgh Post Gazette (http://www.post-gazette.com)
Article: http://www.post-gaze....cenenat4p3.asp

Tribune Review (http://triblive.com)
Article: http://triblive.com/...late=news1.html


Local television:

WTAE (Channel 4 - Pittsburgh)
Link: http://www.wtaetv.com

WPXI (Channel 11 - Pittsburgh)
Link: http://www.pittsburg.../partners/wpxi/




#2 of 29 OFFLINE   andrew markworthy

andrew markworthy

    Producer

  • 4,766 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 30 1999

Posted September 12 2001 - 06:36 AM

I must admit that this one has got me baffled. On Brit TV for quite some time we were told that the plane had crashed at what we were told was an official announcement that is was at an 'undisclosed location'. Later it was said that the plane had presumably been on the way to Camp David and had crashed short of its target.

Curiously, on this evening's Brit TV news, there was plenty of coverage of the first three crashes, and absolutely nothing on the Somerset crash.

The trouble with this level of silence is that it's going to attract a lot of needless speculation (e.g. 'what was at Somerset?' 'is the government covering things up?') which will deflect from the central and far more important issues.

#3 of 29 OFFLINE   MickeS

MickeS

    Producer

  • 5,065 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 24 2000

Posted September 12 2001 - 06:58 AM

Thanks for the links.

Nothing in these stories indicate that the plane was shot down, but it says it was heading for Washington, DC.

There is however mention of an explosion before the plane crashed:
Quote:
Glen Cramer of Westmoreland County 911 told WTAE-TV that a call was received at about 9:58 a.m. that reported the plane was hijacked. The call originated from the cell phone of a man locked in the bathroom of United Flight 93.

The caller was on the phone with 911 operators for about one minute and said that the plane had been hijacked, Cramer said.

An explosion was then heard. The crash was reported 10 to 15 minutes later.

Alice Hoglan told ABC's "Good Morning America" that her son, Mark Bingham, 31, called her from aboard the flight at 9:44 a.m.

"We've been taken over. There are three men that say they have a bomb," Hoglan said her son told her.

Since they said they had a bomb, that could have been the explosion. That wouldn't explain an explosion on the wing, of course, which was reported elsewhere.

The lack of information about this crash is still odd, though, but I guess they feel that it's not as newsworthy of a story as the other tragic events.

/Mike

[Edited last by MickeS on September 12, 2001 at 02:02 PM]
/Mike

#4 of 29 OFFLINE   Richard Travale

Richard Travale

    Producer

  • 3,419 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 27 2001
  • Real Name:Rich Travale
  • LocationVancouver Island, Canada

Posted September 12 2001 - 07:25 AM

Of course the hi-jackers said they have a bomb. What do you think would have happened if they said they had cardboard cutters? They wouldn't have made it out of their seats.

I don't doubt for a second that they were shot down by Jet-fighters after the 911 call.

------------------
Rich

"A) You can never go too far and B) If I'm going to get busted it is NOT going to be by a guy like DAT."
My Website


 "Cock your hat - angles are attitudes. "
- Frank Sinatra 

#5 of 29 OFFLINE   Brett_B

Brett_B

    Supporting Actor

  • 723 posts
  • Join Date: Oct 26 1999

Posted September 12 2001 - 08:01 AM

Quote:
I don't doubt for a second that they were shot down by Jet-fighters after the 911 call.

Richard,

The only problem that I have about the possibility of the jet being shot-down is the fact that not one eye-witness saw any other aircraft. I live in the Pittsburgh area, so there was quite a bit of information coming from Somerset (interviews and live footage).

Another problem that I have is, if this were actually the case (fighter jets sent to take down the aircraft) why would the fighter pilots take the chance of only wounding the aircraft causing it to crash (possibly in a populated area) instead of destroying it while it was still in the air (remember, these aircrafts were FULLY loaded with fuel)?



#6 of 29 OFFLINE   MickeS

MickeS

    Producer

  • 5,065 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 24 2000

Posted September 12 2001 - 08:31 AM

This is a very moving article about this from Washington Post:
Quote:
By Charles Lane
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, September 12, 2001; 3:42 PM


As United Airlines Flight 93 entered its last desperate moments aloft, there was terror and violence on board – but also heroism.

Minutes before the giant airliner smashed into a field southeast of Pittsburgh, passenger Jeremy Glick used a cell phone to call his wife at home in New Jersey and told her that he and several other people on board had come up with a plan to resist the terrorists who had hijacked the plane, according to Glick's brother-in-law, Douglas B. Hurwitt.

"They were going to stop whoever it was from doing whatever it was they'd planned," Hurwitt said. "He knew that stopping them was going to end all of their lives. But that was my brother-in-law. He was a take-charge guy."

Anticipating his own death, Glick, who celebrated his 31st birthday on Sept. 3, told his wife, Lyzbeth, that he hoped she would have a good life and would take care of their 3-month old baby girl, Hurwitt said.

Glick explained to his wife that the plane had been taken over by three Middle Eastern men wearing red headbands. The terrorists, wielding knives and brandishing a red box they claimed contained a bomb, ordered the passengers, pilots and flight attendants toward the rear of the plane, then took over the cockpit.

The story of Glick's words adds to the account of passenger resistance already given by another passenger's mother on NBC's "Today" show this morning. Alice Hoglan of California says her son, Mark Bingham, also spoke of a plan to tackle the hijackers in a last-minute cell phone call to her.

Flight 93 was the only one of four hijacked planes that did not smash into a major target on the ground, and some officials are already saying that the actions of people on board may have prevented an even greater tragedy.

Pennsylvania Rep. John Murtha, the ranking Democrat on the Congressional Defense Appropriations Committee, said at the crash site that he believes a struggle took place in the plane's cockpit and that the plane was headed for a significant target in Washington, D.C.

"There had to have been a struggle and someone heroically kept the plane from heading to Washington," he said.


/Mike
/Mike

#7 of 29 OFFLINE   Patrick_S

Patrick_S

    Producer

  • 3,033 posts
  • Join Date: Apr 01 2000

Posted September 12 2001 - 11:26 AM

Brett, I'm glad you started this thread.

I have been in a meeting all day so I haven't had access to HFT all day and I notice that the last thread is now missing.

It really bothers me that there has been so much wild speculation in the last threads about this plane being shot down.

I'm especially bothered that people like say "one way or another we will never know if they shot it down." This is an extremely self-serving statement which unfounded rumors depend on to sustain life.

I look at it this way, if there were military planes in the sky some one most likely would have seen the fighters in the sky.

Come on people, this kind of wild unfounded speculation accomplishes nothing.


------------------


#8 of 29 OFFLINE   Rob Gillespie

Rob Gillespie

    Producer

  • 3,634 posts
  • Join Date: Aug 17 1998

Posted September 12 2001 - 12:05 PM

Fellas, we've had problems with the threads over the past few days. The post counts weren't that high (relatively speaking), but we can only presume the number of hits to the main threads in this area was enormous. Certainly the posting activity in the main areas has been exceptionally slow.

We will keep the main threads going and restart them when necessary, however the splinter discussions like this one are no problem either.

------------------
Posted Image

"One does not simply walk into Mordor."

Rob's Place


No longer here.

#9 of 29 OFFLINE   Ashley Seymour

Ashley Seymour

    Supporting Actor

  • 945 posts
  • Join Date: Jun 29 2000

Posted September 12 2001 - 12:35 PM

I don't doubt for a second that they were shot down by Jet-fighters after the 911 call.

I DO!

My first thought when the initial images of the crater in the ground came in was that the passengers had gotten together and subdued at lease some of the hijackers. The cell calls from the two guys in the plane just bears out the prospect that there was a heroic struggle on the plane and that their action resulted in the crash and the failure of the mission.

I can't think of any bigger heroes than the passengers on this flight.

------------------

Go Orange, Go Blue,
Fight Fight Fight BSU!

It's not whether you win or loose that counts, but whether you win.

#10 of 29 OFFLINE   Richard Travale

Richard Travale

    Producer

  • 3,419 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 27 2001
  • Real Name:Rich Travale
  • LocationVancouver Island, Canada

Posted September 12 2001 - 01:05 PM

I heard on the radio this morning that there were witnesses to two military aircraft flying away after the crash. This is complete hearsay of course and I won't continue with it.



------------------
Rich

"A) You can never go too far and B) If I'm going to get busted it is NOT going to be by a guy like DAT."
My Website


 "Cock your hat - angles are attitudes. "
- Frank Sinatra 

#11 of 29 OFFLINE   Dean DeMass

Dean DeMass

    Screenwriter

  • 1,829 posts
  • Join Date: Dec 31 1969

Posted September 13 2001 - 03:18 AM

Tuesday, I heard interviews, on the radio, from folks in Pennsylvania, saying that they saw what looked like an F-15 fighter jet fly over right after the plane went down. I still believe that it was shot down.

-Dean-

------------------
My HT Equipment


"I've seen you and you are not cool."


[Edited last by Dean DeMass on September 13, 2001 at 10:19 AM]

#12 of 29 OFFLINE   Deane Johnson

Deane Johnson

    Supporting Actor

  • 528 posts
  • Join Date: Jan 27 1999

Posted September 13 2001 - 03:24 AM

One possibility is that military jets had been scrambled to prevent it from reaching Washington, but did not have time act before it went down for some other reason. Just a thought.

Deane

#13 of 29 OFFLINE   Ted Lee

Ted Lee

    Lead Actor

  • 8,398 posts
  • Join Date: May 08 2001

Posted September 13 2001 - 03:41 AM

Quote:
Anticipating his own death, Glick, who celebrated his 31st birthday on Sept. 3, told his wife, Lyzbeth, that he hoped she would have a good life and would take care of their 3-month old baby girl, Hurwitt said.

i have also heard this story on several network broadcasts. it's amazing to me that these people, facing their own death, we're able to rise above it all and prevent further loss of life. they are truly heroes in every sense of the word!

Quote:
I can't think of any bigger heroes than the passengers on this flight.

i couldn't agree more!!!

i believe, that if the other passengers on the other three planes knew what was truly happening, and had the time, they also would have done the same...

------------------
You step in the stream,
But the water has moved on.
This page is not here.



 

#14 of 29 OFFLINE   Bill Buklis

Bill Buklis

    Supporting Actor

  • 516 posts
  • Join Date: Apr 09 1999
  • Real Name:Bill Buklis
  • LocationChicago, IL

Posted September 13 2001 - 04:05 AM

I'm sure this is the case. Somehow the passengers either heard the plans from the hijackers or learned of the other attacks. They then decided to take action.

They should all be given medals posthumously. As tragic as it was, it could have been even worse. These passengers prevented that.


------------------

Check out my Flickr stream. Join the HTF Flickr Pool.

#15 of 29 OFFLINE   JoeN

JoeN

    Agent

  • 32 posts
  • Join Date: Dec 31 1969

Posted September 13 2001 - 04:12 AM

Officials in southwestern Pennsylvania said they have identified and cordoned off a second debris site about 6 to 8 miles away from the crash site


Hrm... wouldn't this indicate maybe something else happened?

#16 of 29 OFFLINE   Brett_B

Brett_B

    Supporting Actor

  • 723 posts
  • Join Date: Oct 26 1999

Posted September 13 2001 - 04:26 AM

JoeN,

Where did you find that last piece of information at? I heard some interesting tidbits about this incident last night, but I want to find out more before I comment on it.

Thanks

Brett

#17 of 29 OFFLINE   JoeN

JoeN

    Agent

  • 32 posts
  • Join Date: Dec 31 1969

Posted September 13 2001 - 04:27 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2...america.attack/

As of now its the firt bullet point, but that page gets updated all of the time.


#18 of 29 OFFLINE   Ted Lee

Ted Lee

    Lead Actor

  • 8,398 posts
  • Join Date: May 08 2001

Posted September 13 2001 - 04:33 AM

Quote:
wouldn't this indicate maybe something else happened?

that is very interesting and even though i am purely guessing...to me that would indicate one of two things:

1. something else must have happened, probably in the sky.
2. this is some far-flying debris from the initial impact site.

------------------
You step in the stream,
But the water has moved on.
This page is not here.



 

#19 of 29 OFFLINE   Brett_B

Brett_B

    Supporting Actor

  • 723 posts
  • Join Date: Oct 26 1999

Posted September 13 2001 - 04:40 AM

Thanks, Joe.

Last night while discussing this particular incident, I was told that Westmoreland County dispatched about 8 sheriff's deputies to the Latrobe Airport (Tuesday, after the plane went down in Somerset). When they arrived, the FBI were already there and they had ordered all personell out of the control tower, and that no one was permitted inside except for the FBI. Apparantly, the FBI did this to several surrounding airports in the area of Somerset (Johnstown was another).

The person I was hearing this from used to work for the government (Pentagon). He said that the best way to take down a plane was to shoot the wing off (also said that would explain the eye-witness' reports of the plane rolling then going into a dive).

I am wondering now if that this new site they discovered is actually part of a wing? I don't know, but now I am wondering.

I still want to believe wholeheartedly that it was an act of heroism. I think if it is determined to be something else, I still think that those passengers are, indeed, heroes in my book.

God bless them.

#20 of 29 OFFLINE   MickeS

MickeS

    Producer

  • 5,065 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 24 2000

Posted September 13 2001 - 04:44 AM

I wish the media would deal with these rumours.
If someone just asked at a press conference "Was the plane in PA shot down by the US airforce?" and the answer is "No." I'd be satisfied. As it is now, they completely ignore it.

/Mike


/Mike


Back to Archived Threads 2001-2004



Forum Nav Content I Follow