Jump to content



Sign up for a free account!

Signing up for an account is fast and free. As a member you can join in the conversation, enter contests to win things like this Logitech Harmony Ultimate Remote and you won't get the popup ads that guests get. Click here to create your free account.

Photo

"Citizen Kanes" of cinema


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
119 replies to this topic

#1 of 120 Patrick McCart

Patrick McCart

    Lead Actor

  • 7,456 posts
  • Join Date: May 16 2001
  • Real Name:Patrick McCart
  • LocationBlairsville, GA, USA

Posted February 17 2002 - 11:55 AM

A Birth of a Nation is thought to be a total showing of how far cinema has gone at that time. Citizen Kane is thought to be the second film of this kind.

What films do you think accomplished this feat of showing how far film has gone at their time like Nation and Kane?

#2 of 120 Luc D

Luc D

    Second Unit

  • 302 posts
  • Join Date: Apr 29 2000

Posted February 17 2002 - 03:39 PM

2001: A Space Odyssey

#3 of 120 Seth Paxton

Seth Paxton

    Lead Actor

  • 7,588 posts
  • Join Date: Nov 05 1998

Posted February 17 2002 - 04:08 PM

Ben-Hur (when epic set pieces were becoming the norm)

Star Wars, without a doubt.

#4 of 120 Brian W.

Brian W.

    Screenwriter

  • 1,958 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 29 1999
  • Real Name:Brian
  • LocationLos Angeles

Posted February 17 2002 - 09:23 PM

Gotta disagree on "Ben Hur," Seth. While it is very spectacular and supremely entertaining, I don't see how that one advanced the art of filmmaking in any way, or proved particularly influential in style.

I'd vote for D.W. Griffith's "Intolerance," for its innovative use of four parallel storylines running simultaneously, possibly "Psycho," since it started a new genre, the slasher film, and yes, definitely "Star Wars," because it changed not only every sci-fi film that came after it, but the film industry in general -- Hollywood focused on a different kind of movie after "Star Wars." (Unfortunately, one of the side effects was that it became, and still is, very difficult for a straight drama to make any money. Example: "The Godfather" was the highest grossing film of 1972. That could never happen today.) Also, "Star Wars'" grand symphonic score was extremely influential. Film scores sounded very different after "Star Wars," even though it was a return to a certain style rather than a new style.

I'm sure there are tons of others. Chaplin's "The Gold Rush," maybe? Perhaps Bergman's "The Seventh Seal"? Possibly "Bonnie and Clyde" for being one of the first films to star really bad people in sympathetic leading roles.

Going to foreign films, I know Roberto Rossellini's "Open City" was one of the early "neo-realist" films, which forever affected filmmaking style in the US and all around the world, although his next film, "Paisa," is considered the bigger classic today. I believe "Open City" was awarded a special Academy Award, before the Foreign Language category existed.

Orson Welles thought Jean Renoir's "Grand Illusion" was the greatest film ever made.

Take a look at the top ranked films in the Sight & Sound poll that comes out every 10 years. If I think of it when I get home, I'll post all the winners. Citizen Kane has been #1 every year since 1962. (Hey, there's a new poll coming out this year -- that should be interesting.)

#5 of 120 Josh_Hill

Josh_Hill

    Screenwriter

  • 1,051 posts
  • Join Date: Jan 06 2002

Posted February 17 2002 - 09:24 PM

Star Wars Saga
2001
LOTR:FOTR (Coulda never made this movie 20 years ago)

#6 of 120 Ben Motley

Ben Motley

    Supporting Actor

  • 739 posts
  • Join Date: Mar 03 2001

Posted February 18 2002 - 12:47 AM

Maniac Posted Image

#7 of 120 Ken_McAlinden

Ken_McAlinden

    Producer

  • 6,065 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 20 2001
  • Real Name:Kenneth McAlinden
  • LocationLivonia, MI USA

Posted February 18 2002 - 02:12 AM

Battleship Potemkin
Snow White
Toy Story

Quote:
LOTR:FOTR (Coulda never made this movie 20 years ago)
I would disagree simply because, as spectacular as it is, it does not represent the kind of breakthrough and culmination that films like 2001:ASO, Kane, or Birth of a Nation do. More likely candidates would be films that pushed the outside of the digital effects envelope in the early 90s such as Terminator 2 or Jurassic Park.

Regards,
Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

#8 of 120 Chris

Chris

    Lead Actor

  • 6,790 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 04 1997

Posted February 18 2002 - 02:34 AM

I would agree with Snow White as a moment that showed what could happen with film as the first of it's kind; Toy Story is another interesting pick that I would probably agree with as it was the first pure digital animation full length film.

Star Wars would also be on my list.
My Current DVD-Profiler


"I've been Ostrafied!" - Christopher, Sopranos 5/6/07

#9 of 120 DaveF

DaveF

    Executive Producer

  • 13,165 posts
  • Join Date: Mar 04 2001
  • Real Name:David Fischer
  • LocationOne Loudoun, Ashburn, VA

Posted February 18 2002 - 02:43 AM

This may be too narrow, but Willow was the first film to use the special effect "Morphing" (I believe), has since become a bread-and-butter effect for movies.

Definitely Snow White for animation; and Toy Story for animation again. I will also suggest The Little Mermaid which heralded the return of excellent (U.S.) animation after a >10 yr hiatus.

#10 of 120 Josh_Hill

Josh_Hill

    Screenwriter

  • 1,051 posts
  • Join Date: Jan 06 2002

Posted February 18 2002 - 02:55 AM

Quote:
I would disagree simply because, as spectacular as it is, it does not represent the kind of breakthrough and culmination that films like 2001:ASO, Kane, or Birth of a Nation do. More likely candidates would be films that pushed the outside of the digital effects envelope in the early 90s such as Terminator 2 or Jurassic Park.


Wait a sec, that was my opinion, was it not? Yes yes, I believe it was. Its a huge achievement.

#11 of 120 Ken_McAlinden

Ken_McAlinden

    Producer

  • 6,065 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 20 2001
  • Real Name:Kenneth McAlinden
  • LocationLivonia, MI USA

Posted February 18 2002 - 03:00 AM

Quote:
Wait a sec, that was my opinion, was it not? Yes yes, I believe it was.
Hmmmm? If I recall correctly, my post was a disagreement with your opinion. Ah yes, I believe it was. Posted Image

Regards,
Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

#12 of 120 Guy_K

Guy_K

    Second Unit

  • 471 posts
  • Join Date: Aug 14 2001

Posted February 18 2002 - 03:00 AM

A recent example is the Toy Story movie. This revolutionized the way animated films were made. After Toy Story, computer animated movies were the primary, and successful method.

How about Jaws? That seems like a good example. I read somewhere that it gave birth to the 'summer blockbuster'.

#13 of 120 Josh_Hill

Josh_Hill

    Screenwriter

  • 1,051 posts
  • Join Date: Jan 06 2002

Posted February 18 2002 - 03:44 AM

Tis true, Jaws and Star Wars pretty much gave birth to the summer blockbuster.

#14 of 120 Gabe D

Gabe D

    Screenwriter

  • 2,173 posts
  • Join Date: May 16 2001

Posted February 18 2002 - 04:19 AM

The Matrix

#15 of 120 Bill J

Bill J

    Producer

  • 3,970 posts
  • Join Date: Oct 27 2001

Posted February 18 2002 - 04:41 AM

Apocalypse Now

#16 of 120 Vince Maskeeper

Vince Maskeeper

    Lead Actor

  • 6,504 posts
  • Join Date: Jan 18 1999

Posted February 18 2002 - 05:25 AM

Patrick,

I"ve heard BIRTH OF A NATION listed in the context you described above- but I'm unclear as to exactly what it was known for specificaly. I'm not all the familiar with the status of film at the time, so forgive my ignorance. Was it just that it was the first feature length story? I've also seen it credited as the birth of modern filmmaking techniques (camera closeups for example).

Is there any site that talks about specifics of what this film is credited for inventing.

-Vince
Need an introduction to home theater? Check out our FAQ and Primer!!

#17 of 120 Andy Sheets

Andy Sheets

    Screenwriter

  • 2,371 posts
  • Join Date: Aug 06 2000

Posted February 18 2002 - 06:15 AM

I can't seem to find many sites about Birth of a Nation but the review at this site seems okay: http://www.filmsite.org/birt.html. Personally, I remember in film class a few years ago watching many silent movies of that time and when we got to Birth of a Nation I was absolutely stunned by how relatively modern it looked compared to those other primitive films. The story is utterly repulsive but in terms of style and technique, I've been convinced since then that no film is more important to the development of the medium.

#18 of 120 Ken_McAlinden

Ken_McAlinden

    Producer

  • 6,065 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 20 2001
  • Real Name:Kenneth McAlinden
  • LocationLivonia, MI USA

Posted February 18 2002 - 06:25 AM

Birth of a Nation is heralded for originating or streamlining several technical advancements. These included night photography, moving camera techniques, tinting, iris effects, subtitles, fade outs, parallel action, and extensive cross cutting among others.

Cinematographer G.W. "Billy" Bitzer was obviously a very busy man at the time. Posted Image

Addendum the above link has a much more comprehensive list than mine. Good link!

Regards,
Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

#19 of 120 Patrick McCart

Patrick McCart

    Lead Actor

  • 7,456 posts
  • Join Date: May 16 2001
  • Real Name:Patrick McCart
  • LocationBlairsville, GA, USA

Posted February 18 2002 - 06:33 AM

A Birth of a Nation is usually thought to be a condensation of everything film was up until that time. Sure, several of the techniques in the film are not originally from that film (many appeared earlier than 1915), but this film brought all of it together.

Citizen Kane is also thought to be a film like this...most of the revolutionary techniques are not originally from that film, but the film brought them all together.

Sort of like a final exam made from 10 different tests. Posted Image

#20 of 120 StephenA

StephenA

    Screenwriter

  • 1,512 posts
  • Join Date: Nov 30 2001

Posted February 18 2002 - 07:21 AM

Godfather series
Star Wars series
Indiana Jones series
Jaws
Night of the Living Dead
Halloween
Metropolis(1927 version)
Akira

If I can think of more, I will.





Forum Nav Content I Follow