Replacing 7.1 with soundbar (1 Viewer)

Rick Smith_290765 · Nov 11, 2014

I had a 7.1 Onkyo system with wires all over the room that i'm trying to replace with something simpler. The wife has a real hard time hearing voices and and such on the TV and movies, especially heavy bass movies she can't hear anything that's going on.
So, I'm looking for some help finding a soundbar that doesn't require a receiver, has excellent sound range and I can possibly use my subwoofer from my current system (not a deal breaker). I'd like to be able to play music through it from my phone as well.
Some of the soundbars I've seen look like they need a receiver to get the true surround from it. Either way, I've got about $500-$600 to spend and just want something that's high quality and simpler.
So a soundbar or soundbar/receiver combo, doesn't matter to me, as long as it sounds awesome and I don't have wires going in every direction around the room.

Any help or suggestions is greatly appreciated!

-Rick

schan1269 · Nov 12, 2014

Ok, soundbars are either passive(need an AVR) or active(they power themselves).Using your present AVR with a passive soundbar would be the wisest thing.Atlantic Tech makes a good one.

Sam Posten · Nov 12, 2014

Rick: Welcome to HTF. Without trying to be rude this is one of the worst ideas ever. You will not be satisfied with any replacement and if I had to guess you need to calibrate your system so that sound is balanced and correctly set levels so that all channels have accurate sound. Don't do it!

questrider · Nov 12, 2014

I will second Sam that the reason you're not hearing dialog correctly is probably due to the fact that your 7.1 system isn't properly calibrated. That and perhaps your receiver isn't getting native 5.1/7.1 data because you are not using either an optical cable or HDMI. (I bring this up because I had a colleague tell me they were experiencing the same issue described here and came to find out they had their DVD player hooked up to their receiver with stereo RCA cables instead of an optical cable.) The great thing about audio calibration these days is that you do not need to purchase a standalone sound meter as there are apps for smartphones that work nearly as good if not better in some situations (because of a visual graph). I also set my Center channel anywhere from +2.0-+3.0 higher than what I calibrate to assure extra clarity of dialog (e.g., if the calibration says that it should be set at +1.0 then I set the Center channel to +3.0). In the end, there is no way a soundbar could ever replace the sound of a properly calibrated 5.1/7.1 system.

schan1269 · Nov 12, 2014

I will add this...90 % of the issue here...The speakers are pre-package (meaning, not that great) and there are passive sound bars that are better speakers(strictly speaking on quality).You need to invest(speakers are like furniture, buy them right, you have them for decades) in a quality speaker.If that is replacing all 7(I'd start front 3), great and preferred.If that is a passive soundbar, great.End result is met either way.

andySu · Nov 14, 2014

Ether you have mismatched LCR always use the same speakers for LCR.

If your room has noisy noise floor that is when everything is switched off and using SPL db metre with a range 30 or lower have patched to an RTA will show how noisy your room is if near to street during night time you'll might see noise above 40 or 50db and that will impact on your ability to hear soft faint whispering dialogue like a scene from HEAT (1995) when Neal goes to Trejo, home the dialogue is spoken very natural and soft. I can hear the scene fine in my home THX cinema with matched JBL LCR control 12SR with THX crossover.

Downgrading to soundbar thumbs down. Spend the money on something more worthwhile and productive. Don't blow it on a soundbar, Ether get matched speakers and look on ebay I see some JBL control 10 on ebay if you can buy x4 you can use them for LCR and won't have trouble hearing them. Or maybe another speakers just as long as they are matched and same for three identical.

If you set all three up and test each bass mid and mid range to tweeter with pink noise up very close to the speaker to see if all are showing the same frequency response if one or few differ then correct with 1/3 octave EQ or maybe bit of parametric EQ as well. Then there will no reason why they won't sound clear and remember this not all films are mixed equally. Some have dialogue mixed ether loud or has soft to mid to loud range.

Armageddon (1998) has loud dialogue and no reason why not one can't hear that?

Jurassic Park (1993) has soft dialogue to fool you to thinking these dinosaurs sound loud.

Rick Smith_290765 · Nov 15, 2014

All great stuff guys. Most of it is totally greek to me, especially the acronyms. And, honestly, I agree with everything you guys are saying, but for right now the wires I've run to all my speakers keep getting unplugged or spliced by the wife because she wants to "clean" up the room. Honestly I'd just rather put everything in storage for now and get something simple that she isn't going to mess around with. The living room is all hard wood so I cant hide the wires under a carpet and some of the speaker wires are close to 50' or longer to wrap around the room. It's a sacrifice to keep my sanity.
So, back to soundbars, I've been looking all week and have yet to find something I like. I'll keep on searching and if I can't find something that's going to do the job I'll just get a new receiver and figure something out.
I'll check online for the speakers you recommended and see if that's a viable option.

schan1269 · Nov 15, 2014

You don't need a new AVR.The Atlantic Tech FS-7.1 is $670 on Amazon.If you can't stretch $70...

DaveF · Nov 15, 2014

Rick Smith_290765 said:
I had a 7.1 Onkyo system with wires all over the room that i'm trying to replace with something simpler. The wife has a real hard time hearing voices and and such on the TV and movies, especially heavy bass movies she can't hear anything that's going on.
So, I'm looking for some help finding a soundbar that doesn't require a receiver, has excellent sound range and I can possibly use my subwoofer from my current system (not a deal breaker). I'd like to be able to play music through it from my phone as well.
Some of the soundbars I've seen look like they need a receiver to get the true surround from it. Either way, I've got about $500-$600 to spend and just want something that's high quality and simpler.
So a soundbar or soundbar/receiver combo, doesn't matter to me, as long as it sounds awesome and I don't have wires going in every direction around the room.

Any help or suggestions is greatly appreciated!

-Rick

It sounds like you've got aesthetic problems as much as sound problems? I'm guessing your've got visible speaker wires running along baseboards or the up walls and across the ceiling to the 7.1 speakers? A soundbar is the easiest help for that. Other solutions are: fishing wires though the walls and floor to set a 'proper' solution; or a wireless speaker system (which is expensive and complex).

Before you buy a new gadget you might try this:
* Reduce from a 7.1 to a 5.1 setup. (Disconnect the two surround speakers)
* Set your receiver to 5.1 mode
* Make sure it's running in 5.1 mode when watching TV and blu-rays (and not stereo mode)
* If the receiver has a self-calibration feature, run that.
* Make sure the receiver is set "small" speakers, so the bass is routed to the subwoofer
* Turn the subwoofer volume down.

You might find with some small tweaks you can fix the sound problems for free.

reeseherrmann · Nov 17, 2014

These http://www.sourcespeaker.com/PlasmaLCRlist.htmlare passive. Handcrafted, choice of veneers and they sound awesome.

ArmSC · Nov 24, 2014

Rick Smith_290765 said:
All great stuff guys. Most of it is totally greek to me, especially the acronyms. And, honestly, I agree with everything you guys are saying, but for right now the wires I've run to all my speakers keep getting unplugged or spliced by the wife because she wants to "clean" up the room. Honestly I'd just rather put everything in storage for now and get something simple that she isn't going to mess around with.

Here are some of my thoughts:

[*]How about you downsize to a 2.0 or a 2.1? Keep the AVR but get some nice books to pair with your sub or get some towers and remove everything. Just two towers or books up front will keep the wife happy and you will get better sound as these should be better speakers that you currently have. You have enough budget to get something really nice...just something to consider.
[*]Pedestal system, have you considered one of these? You put them under the TV instead of in front like a soundbar. You have enough budget to get a larger one that should give you a decent sound. I'm thinking the 670 ZVOX or something like it might also work for your wife related issues. No wires, no AVR, nothing to deal with except for a box under the TV. These units even have a sub output so you can add in a powered sub later on if you feel you need more bass.
[/list]
I also like DaveF's suggestions about calibrating the system or adjusting the levels to suit your tastes.

vidiot33 · Nov 25, 2014

Another penalty in going to a sound bar is the loss of the high Rez audio formats (DTSMA and Dolby Tru HD). You'd be limited to Dolby Digital, which is a substantial downgrade. I had an expensive AVR which I replaced with a used $200 unit, and I really can't tell the difference (and you can find serviceable units for less). I'd also make a good, dedicated center channel speaker a priority and (as has been pointed out) be sure that is is properly positioned and calibrated. It doesn't need to be expensive or complicated to get good sound: best of luck!

TimmyBosko · Nov 25, 2014

Rick Smith_290765 said:
I had a 7.1 Onkyo system with wires all over the room that i'm trying to replace with something simpler. The wife has a real hard time hearing voices and and such on the TV and movies, especially heavy bass movies she can't hear anything that's going on.
So, I'm looking for some help finding a soundbar that doesn't require a receiver, has excellent sound range and I can possibly use my subwoofer from my current system (not a deal breaker). I'd like to be able to play music through it from my phone as well.
Some of the soundbars I've seen look like they need a receiver to get the true surround from it. Either way, I've got about $500-$600 to spend and just want something that's high quality and simpler.
So a soundbar or soundbar/receiver combo, doesn't matter to me, as long as it sounds awesome and I don't have wires going in every direction around the room.

Any help or suggestions is greatly appreciated!

-Rick

I also have a ton of wires but what my wife and I did was just unplug, untangle, re-connect and then used tie wraps to combine into one or two bunch(s) leaving enough loose cable for little movement and attached them to the back of the entertainment center. This way they are up off the floor and have enough cable left out to move a little.

And like others mentioned.. try a calibration.. Once that is done you can tweak the Sub and speakers as needed. I would think yuou could get better all around sound after that.

Jonathan Perregaux · Nov 25, 2014

When I read the beginning of this thread, I thought it was heading towards, "Replacing 7.1 with sound bar... major disappointment. Replacing wife with 7.1... problem solved."

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