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SVS SB-2000 or PB-2000


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37 replies to this topic

#21 of 38 OFFLINE   schan1269

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Posted March 13 2014 - 10:31 AM

I got a true funny story for you.

 

I reviewed the SVS Ultra speakers. While doing so, they threw in a 13 Ultra sub(full name of the sub escapes me) that wasn't part of the review(and I only mentioned it in passing).

 

Anyway, I swapped out DCM TF series and a M&K sub for the SVS.

 

Accidentally a guest kicked on Audyssey(which I normally don't use) that was set for the DCM/M&K.

 

The 13 Ultra "on that EQ curve" promptly felt like it was trying to destroy the room...

 

So, in jest, just so you can immediately know the impact of the incoming sub, leave the room EQ set for the prior sub...(we were watching Mama Mia and the bass was something out of dub step...)



#22 of 38 OFFLINE   FoxyMulder

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Posted March 13 2014 - 10:32 AM

I got a true funny story for you.

 

I reviewed the SVS Ultra speakers. While doing so, they threw in a 13 Ultra sub(full name of the sub escapes me) that wasn't part of the review(and I only mentioned it in passing).

 

Anyway, I swapped out DCM TF series and a M&K sub for the SVS.

 

Accidentally a guest kicked on Audyssey(which I normally don't use) that was set for the DCM/M&K.

 

The 13 Ultra "on that EQ curve" promptly felt like it was trying to destroy the room...

 

I would have loved being in that room. 


     :Fun Movie Quotes:

"A good body with a dull brain is as cheap as life itself"   

"Maybe it's a sheep dog... let's keep going" 

"Please doctor, I've got to ask this. It sounds like, well, just as though you're describing some form of super carrot"

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 


#23 of 38 OFFLINE   schan1269

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Posted March 13 2014 - 10:49 AM

Yeah my M&K is not a light sub. But it is 20yrs old.

 

The "idea" of subs in the class the 13 Ultra is in...wasn't even a side thought in speaker designers minds then.

 

My M&K didn't hold the 13's jock strap. 

 

But...the day the M&K powers on for the last time...will be met with a few tears.



#24 of 38 OFFLINE   erew99

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Posted March 13 2014 - 10:58 AM

While I'd like to get a bigger sub, there are other factors.  My biggest is my in-wall wiring, limiting my placement.

 

The other is size.  Because the walls are only 10' (on the sides) I am very limited.  Only one of these walls is usable for a sub.

 

One of the 20' walls isn't usable.  The other has a fireplace, speakers, and some other furniture already there.

 

If I could get the PB-2000, I'd go for that.  My options are the PB-1000 or the SB-2000.

 

Max height has to be under 20".  Max width under 17".  Depth... I have some room to play with, but 24" should be the max.



#25 of 38 OFFLINE   FoxyMulder

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Posted March 13 2014 - 11:45 AM

While I'd like to get a bigger sub, there are other factors.  My biggest is my in-wall wiring, limiting my placement.

 

The other is size.  Because the walls are only 10' (on the sides) I am very limited.  Only one of these walls is usable for a sub.

 

One of the 20' walls isn't usable.  The other has a fireplace, speakers, and some other furniture already there.

 

If I could get the PB-2000, I'd go for that.  My options are the PB-1000 or the SB-2000.

 

Max height has to be under 20".  Max width under 17".  Depth... I have some room to play with, but 24" should be the max.

 

Go for the ported PB-1000 then.


     :Fun Movie Quotes:

"A good body with a dull brain is as cheap as life itself"   

"Maybe it's a sheep dog... let's keep going" 

"Please doctor, I've got to ask this. It sounds like, well, just as though you're describing some form of super carrot"

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 


#26 of 38 OFFLINE   schan1269

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Posted March 13 2014 - 12:53 PM

I'm glad I have a GF that plays an upright bass and (grand) piano.



#27 of 38 OFFLINE   erew99

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Posted March 14 2014 - 04:57 AM

HAHA- I bet you are. 



#28 of 38 OFFLINE   Gaptek Edan

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Posted March 27 2014 - 04:57 AM

Maybe usefull : http://hometheater.a...rs-reviewed.htm Posted Image

#29 of 38 OFFLINE   Robert_J

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Posted March 27 2014 - 06:19 AM

I'm glad I have a GF that plays an upright bass and (grand) piano.

I'm sure this isn't your GF but it is the only girl I've seen play the upright bass.

 



#30 of 38 OFFLINE   schan1269

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Posted March 27 2014 - 08:12 AM

Nope, not her...but good song.Kind of a subdued Better Dig Two by The Band Perry.

#31 of 38 OFFLINE   PaulDA

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Posted June 27 2014 - 06:53 PM

I was trying to decide between the SB and PB-2000. Went with the PB-2000 after some exchanges with Ed Mullen at SVS (other option I was considering was dual PB-1000s, but he suggested the single PB-2000--to me, demonstrates it's not just about extracting dollars from buyers, as dual PB-1000s would be more expensive). Looking forward to its arrival (ordered today).


Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes time, and it annoys the pig.

#32 of 38 OFFLINE   PaulDA

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Posted June 30 2014 - 08:17 PM

It arrived today (well, yesterday, I guess, given the hour). Will get a chance to play around with it in a few days when the house is empty for two weeks (wife and kids are going on a road trip with my mother-in-law). Can't wait to take it out of the giant box.


Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes time, and it annoys the pig.

#33 of 38 OFFLINE   Robert Crawford

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Posted July 04 2014 - 10:27 AM

Paul,

 

How are you liking it?


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#34 of 38 OFFLINE   PaulDA

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Posted July 05 2014 - 12:07 PM

I like that it digs deeper at below 30hz than my old sub. I have limited placement options for it, though, and I'm trying to cope with a serious peak centred on 20 or so hz (measured with REW). With movies, the difference with my old sub is clear, but, so far, with music, less so (outside of a few tracks with really low synth bass). I'm awaiting a replacement mic for my Antimode 8033, which will hopefully tame that peak and allow the 30-80hz range to shine through better than it seems to do at the moment.

 

I'm actually leaning towards keeping my old sub in the "cave" as well. Again, with REW, I measured bass response with my PV900 (placed near field--just to the left of my chair at the MLP) and it cures a pretty big dip centred at 43hz, while providing a about a 3dB boost in output across the range (its level is set low and it is away from the walls, so it doesn't provide a big boost in output--not what I'm looking for from it as it can't keep up with the SVS).photo.PNG

 

Pinkish trace is SVS + PV900, bluish trace is SVS alone.


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#35 of 38 OFFLINE   PaulDA

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Posted July 08 2014 - 10:03 AM

[color=rgb(51,51,51);font-family:Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;background-color:rgb(230,237,245);]Well, after a long session of measurements (few different placements, new sub w/o EQ, new sub w/EQ, new and old sub w/o EQ, new and old w/EQ--in all cases, EQ is Antimode 8033C), I have finally reached a point where I can now test to see if the graph, which looks good, equals good SQ. Attached is a (red) trace of the two subs w/EQ (it was taken at a bit higher volume setting on the AVR, so ignore the apparent large boost in output--REW puts the difference of each trace at 7dB (red one is higher) vs. a green trace of the PB-2000 with no EQ.[/color]

 

[color=rgb(51,51,51);font-family:Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;background-color:rgb(230,237,245);]I tested it with various music and film excerpts. I'm sure I could spend many more hours tweaking further, but I've reached a point where things are nicely improved. Keeping the second sub serves mostly as "null killer", as can be seen in the other graph. The red trace in the first graph shows what adding EQ to the two subs does to smooth the big hump below 40Hz. The pinkish trace in the second graph shows the null created by the EQ with only the SVS in play. It improves a lot of other things, but killing that last null with the extra sub makes it even flatter in room.[/color]

 

[color=rgb(51,51,51);font-family:Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;background-color:rgb(230,237,245);]So, proof that two subs, even if not the same, can be better than one (with a LOT of measuring and placement trials), and some form of EQ for the sub in any space under 3000 cubic feet, is essential.[/color]

Attached Thumbnails

  • new%20sub%20alone%20no%20eq%20vs%20both%20with%20eq.png
  • both%20subs%20no%20eq%20vs%20pb%202000%20with%20eq.png

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#36 of 38 OFFLINE   schan1269

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Posted July 08 2014 - 10:42 AM

This is exactly why I've always been a proponent of full range speakers in all positions(even center, if you can).Having 4/5/7 speakers playing to 40 kills nulls.

#37 of 38 OFFLINE   PaulDA

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Posted July 08 2014 - 10:49 AM

Well, perhaps at my next speaker upgrade (which, judging from past experience, is about a decade away). At least I have subs that'll be able to keep up.


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#38 of 38 OFFLINE   Robert Crawford

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Posted July 09 2014 - 12:43 AM

Yeah, I have a dual sub setup right now in my main HT.  If I buy the PB-2000, I'm thinking of buying two of them as my hearing/brain is used to the dual sub setup.


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