Dean Martin Celebrity Roasts (1 Viewer)

Just received the 25-disc set yesterday. The shows look good, considering they were videotaped. I watched a couple of the documentaries and they were well-edited and pretty enlightening. The new interviews range from charming to strangely irrelevant, much like the ones on the Dean Martin Show sets did. (Speaking of which, the bonus episodes included from that series are just the first two discs of the first six-disc Dean Martin Show collection.) The bonus sketches are cleverly presented in that they come from the same episodes as some of the roasts on the same disc, so it allows us to see some of that week's roasters doing other things.The only real disappointment thus far is that there are music edits. I have only watched a few of the roasts, but the Telly Savalas episode runs about four minutes short and is missing the Good Ship Lollipop montage, as well as Rowan and Martin's entire appearance. I know clearances can be difficult and expensive, but I was hoping that the $250 price would prevent this issue from plaguing the set.

Did TL place any kind of disclaimer anywhere on the box regarding edits?

Did you buy this from tl.com orfrom the infomercial runni g I n tv?

I ordered it from the phone number provided on Time Life/Star Vista's website.I couldn't find any disclaimers about editing. In fact, the package with the Savalas roast does use the word "complete" in describing the 17 roasts included.

I checked the other instances I could recall of music being sung or lyrics recited and found these edits:Lucille Ball: montage before her rebuttal (I've Grown Accustomed to Her Face)Jackie Gleason: montage before his rebuttal (That's A Plenty)Bob Hope: Film clip of Hope singing Thanks for the Memory with Shirley RossTelly Savalas: montage before his rebuttal (On the Good Ship Lollipop) and Rowan and Martin spot (I Remember It Well)Frank Sinatra: Part of Gene Kelly's spot including clips from their three movies togetherGeorge Burns: Part of Gene Kelly's spot where he sings Our Love is Here to Stay and a clip of Burns and Jack Benny on This Is Your Life (no music)Those were the edits I could find. It seems as though any film taken from elsewhere was not cleared. Beyond that, some songs were and some were not. (Orson Welles reciting That's Amore was left in, as was Peter Falk and Frank Sinatra's impromptu duet of Bye Bye Blackbird. Burns and Kelly's duets/recitations of Burns's old chestnuts are still included, but they are in the public domain.) Not a huge number, but still a shame. If anyone remembers any other musical performances or film clips from other roasts, let me know and I will check those also.

Yes, it's a pity that the roasts aren't complete on this ultimate set. The edits on the earlier releases weren't done by the distributor; they were edited that way for broadcast by Greg Garrison for either time or content. Ms. Rogers's spot on the Bob Hope roast for example has never been seen anywhere. So keep your Guthy Renker tapes, as they were all unedited. (Partly because they reportedly didn't clear any of the music or film clips...)

I picked up the set they sell at Costco, which has a good sampling. I didn't know or remember the roasts having musical numbers. I saw not all performers on the dais got up to talk but according to Rich Little, the not so famous stars were edited out if they bombed. According to him, many did (basically the actors). Very funny set but the humor is lost on those younger than baby boomers as much of the humor is relevant to that time and the people on the stage.

FanCollector said:

So keep your Guthy Renker tapes, as they were all unedited. (Partly because they reportedly didn't clear any of the music or film clips...)

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Do you know if the original Guthy Renker DVDs were unedited as well, or just the VHS? I have the Lucille Ball DVD and it still contains "I've Grown Accustomed to Her Face". Was wondering if any of the other old GR DVDs contained edits.

I had the old set on VHS, so I can't say for certain. It seems unlikely to me that the DVDs would be edited when the tapes from the same company were not, but I could be wrong.I did check one other spot I remembered: at the Bob Hope roast, Howard Cosell recites lyrics from several songs. The spot is intact on the Time Life set.

FanCollector said:

I had the old set on VHS, so I can't say for certain. It seems unlikely to me that the DVDs would be edited when the tapes from the same company were not, but I could be wrong.

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It's very likely since clearances for analog media were very different. Once digital media entered the scene, it was a whole new ballgame and publishers could ask for the moon...and often do.

John Karras said:

It's very likely since clearances for analog media were very different. Once digital media entered the scene, it was a whole new ballgame and publishers could ask for the moon...and often do.

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Why is there a difference between analog and digital media? (Apart from the far greater sales numbers for DVDs in general.) Wouldn't licensing for additional non-televised uses have to be renegotiated no matter what technological format?

FanCollector said:

Why is there a difference between analog and digital media?

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Mainly it stems from the introduction of the CD. Content owners screamed that they needed a whole new set of protections because digital media could be copied thousands of times without any noticeable generation loss (copy of a copy of a copy etc.). Analog media degraded with each successive generation. It was a case of "crying wolf", but passage of the Digital Copyright Act gave content owners a license (no pun) to renegotiate all agreements. We won't talk about how the industry immediately abused their new-found digital rights with a worldwide CD price fixing scam.

Bottom line: All content has to be renegotiated for any form of digital distribution, and (in North America at least), there are no industry rate sheets or rules. A 20-second song clip could be priced by the publisher at $2000 or $200,000. Take it or leave it. We've also seen cases where music can't be cleared at any price. It always amazes me how some content owners are unreasonable and would rather have nothing rather than something for their material.

Yes, the latitude for copyright holders to renegotiate music use in redistributing programs and movies is completely out of control. And you're right about some copyright holders not relicensing at any price; the Rodgers and Hammerstein company is especially uncooperative.The Guthy Renker roast DVDs should be OK, though. The VHS tapes were not offered for sale until after the Digital Millenium Copyright Act took effect, so the music licensing had to be renegotiated for them also. Since they are unedited, the DVDs probably are as well. The Lucy one checked out. Anyone have the Guthy Renker DVDs of Hope, Burns, Gleason, Savalas, or Sinatra?

Ginger Rogers did appear on the Lucy roast, both on the Guthy Renker VHS and the Time Life DVD. She was cut from the Bob Hope roast in all the versions including, I believe, the original broadcast. Could you have conflated the two roasts, or have you checked recently and found her missing from the Lucy roast?Demond Wilson appears on the first Redd Foxx roast, which was one of the three never released by Guthy Renker. His spot is intact on the Time Life DVDs, and it's very funny. He was not on the dais for the second Redd Foxx roast. He was also on the Jack Benny roast, and his spot is included in both releases.

Hello - i am looking for the second half of the Telly Savalas roast. (my copy skips, & will not play in any DVD player) Anybody interested in doing a trade ? I have nearly all of the 51 Roasts that were released by Guthy - PLUS i will have (later this week) the Collectors Edition (7 DVD set) which has lots of cool bonus features. Thanx !

I only have three of the roasts....(1) Jackie Gleason (2) Frank Sinatra and of course (3) Dean Martin. I gave all the others away after viewing them. I think the three kept are sufficient as much of this stuff is soooo redundant.

FanCollector said:

The Guthy Renker roast DVDs should be OK, though. The VHS tapes were not offered for sale until after the Digital Millenium Copyright Act took effect, so the music licensing had to be renegotiated for them also. Since they are unedited, the DVDs probably are as well. The Lucy one checked out. Anyone have the Guthy Renker DVDs of Hope, Burns, Gleason, Savalas, or Sinatra?

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I have the 12 disc GR set from about 10 years ago.

Are there any time markers for the edits mentioned? It would make it easier to check, as I don't really have time to watch the whole shows at the moment.

At one time, Guthy released the Sinatra Roast as a "Collectors Edition" - even though it only had 1 roast on it. But it also had interviews with Greg Garrison, Don Rockles & Rich Little. (which are completely different from the interviews released by Starvista)

Does anybody have an extra copy of these interviews, that they would be wiling to trade ?

Thank you !

Has anybody seen the DVD called Best of D. Martin Variety Show - Volume 20 ?
Does Red Buttons do his "Never got a Dinner" routine ? Or what exactly does he do
on that episode ? Thanks much !!

nietseoj said:

Has anybody seen the DVD called Best of D. Martin Variety Show - Volume 20 ?
Does Red Buttons do his "Never got a Dinner" routine ? Or what exactly does he do
on that episode ? Thanks much !!

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I'll check later tonight and let you know.