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The Universal Fire


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#21 of 37 John Karras

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Posted September 11 2013 - 09:07 PM

Even if 16mm prints of the color Laramie were to be re-issued at some point by Timeless, I wouldn't expect a major upgrade. Certainly they'd be better than what Timeless released, but if you watched the color Laramie run on CBN in the mid-80's the 16mm prints they got from Universal were not in great shape.



#22 of 37 Ron1973

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Posted September 11 2013 - 09:09 PM

Actually, Timeless was/is supposed to be rereleasing seasons 3 & 4 in the better prints.  Not sure if it's indefinitely on hold or what, but that has been the plan for some time now.  Frankly, I'm shocked it hasn't already happened.  Might mean something changed and we won't get the upgrade after all.  But it was definitely on the schedule.

 

 

Gary "hope we see The Rebel happen - that's one I'd really like to add to my collection" O.

Okay, I've heard of the show, Gary but is this "The Rebel" as in the Johnny Cash song about Johnny Yuma? Dumb question I guess but I've never watched it.


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#23 of 37 John Hermes

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Posted September 11 2013 - 09:57 PM

Okay, I've heard of the show, Gary but is this "The Rebel" as in the Johnny Cash song about Johnny Yuma? Dumb question I guess but I've never watched it.

Yep.


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#24 of 37 Randy Korstick

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Posted September 12 2013 - 07:15 AM

They would not be restored and won't look great but the 16mm prints would/should at least be uncut and definately more watchable than the old VHS recordings that are currently released. After sampling a couple I cannot bring myself to buy the current releases of Season 3 and 4 and I like the show alot so I would be the 1st in line for a new release from the 16mm copies. If they do a quick digital cleanup on them they would look better than what was shown on TV in the 80's.

 

Even if 16mm prints of the color Laramie were to be re-issued at some point by Timeless, I wouldn't expect a major upgrade. Certainly they'd be better than what Timeless released, but if you watched the color Laramie run on CBN in the mid-80's the 16mm prints they got from Universal were not in great shape.


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#25 of 37 smithbrad

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Posted September 12 2013 - 07:44 AM

Okay, I've heard of the show, Gary but is this "The Rebel" as in the Johnny Cash song about Johnny Yuma? Dumb question I guess but I've never watched it.

 

The show currently airs on Saturday mornings at 11:00 if you get ME-TV. I've seen about 10 episodes so far. This is one I very much hope Timeless is able to release (as the rumors have suggested).



#26 of 37 Lromero1396

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Posted September 12 2013 - 07:53 AM

I read in another thread that some preservation elements were destroyed. That's all I know about this. I hope that Universal's motion picture archive for their Paramount acquisitions and old Universal titles wasn't damaged...



#27 of 37 gogo.there

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Posted September 12 2013 - 08:38 AM

I read in another thread that some preservation elements were destroyed. That's all I know about this. I hope that Universal's motion picture archive for their Paramount acquisitions and old Universal titles wasn't damaged...

wonder if teh fire was accidental or on purpose ?  Seems shifty, having combustile elements stores so poorly.

 

note - that is a question, not an accusation - the part questioned on how they stored them, leads to the speculation


Edited by gogo.there, September 12 2013 - 10:39 AM.


#28 of 37 ahollis

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Posted September 12 2013 - 12:13 PM

wonder if teh fire was accidental or on purpose ? Seems shifty, having combustile elements stores so poorly.

note - that is a question, not an accusation - the part questioned on how they stored them, leads to the speculation


The fire did not start at the Video Storage Vault. It started on the backlot from a workers welding touch while working on one of the sets. The Video Vault was not the only thing combustible, every one of those backlot sets are nothing but dry wood.

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#29 of 37 gogo.there

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Posted September 12 2013 - 01:53 PM

The fire did not start at the Video Storage Vault. It started on the backlot from a workers welding touch while working on one of the sets. The Video Vault was not the only thing combustible, every one of those backlot sets are nothing but dry wood.

Conspiracy theories can be very funny.

never did i state the fire started in the video storage area - what is pathetic, they did not have the film off-site and nowhere near the backlot

 

 

also people love to slam people saying conspiracy theory etc -  bet you thought the recording of all internet traffic and all phone calls for last 12-30 years was a conspiracy theory too huh - wwhen anyone with a brain cell did not need a leak to know that was going on - while people like you called people who knew it were called conspiracy theory nuts.



#30 of 37 ahollis

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Posted September 12 2013 - 10:31 PM

never did i state the fire started in the video storage area - what is pathetic, they did not have the film off-site and nowhere near the backlot


also people love to slam people saying conspiracy theory etc - bet you thought the recording of all internet traffic and all phone calls for last 12-30 years was a conspiracy theory too huh - wwhen anyone with a brain cell did not need a leak to know that was going on - while people like you called people who knew it were called conspiracy theory nuts.


Mercy, to me it seemed you thought that the fire started ad the Video Vault. If you don't then there was no meaning putting out the conspiracy theory that it was started on purpose to rid thousand of dollars of video tape and music tapes.

It did not matter where you kept the vault, there could always be a danger of fire, earthquake, tornadoes or flood

Not going to respond to your personal remark on my beliefs for you don't know me and that scratches the rule of no politics discussed.

Edited by ahollis, September 12 2013 - 10:41 PM.

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#31 of 37 Richard V

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Posted September 13 2013 - 06:31 AM

Actually, Timeless was/is supposed to be rereleasing seasons 3 & 4 in the better prints.  Not sure if it's indefinitely on hold or what, but that has been the plan for some time now.  Frankly, I'm shocked it hasn't already happened.  Might mean something changed and we won't get the upgrade after all.  But it was definitely on the schedule.

 

 

Gary "hope we see The Rebel happen - that's one I'd really like to add to my collection" O.

 

If they ever DO, re-release the upgraded S3&4, then I'm all over that.


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#32 of 37 oldtvshowbuff

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Posted September 13 2013 - 06:32 AM

Mercy, to me it seemed you thought that the fire started ad the Video Vault. If you don't then there was no meaning putting out the conspiracy theory that it was started on purpose to rid thousand of dollars of video tape and music tapes. It did not matter where you kept the vault, there could always be a danger of fire, earthquake, tornadoes or flood Not going to respond to your personal remark on my beliefs for you don't know me and that scratches the rule of no politics discussed.

Now if some young punk execs at Fox had their way, they would set their vintage TV archives on fire just to get rid of it all!!!


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#33 of 37 Neil Brock

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Posted September 13 2013 - 06:49 AM

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So much misinformation gets spread about the fire. Here is what I'm led to believe.

 

No 35mm masters, fine grains or camera negatives were destroyed. The only original, masters that went would be shows that were shot on videotape, either 2 inch or 1 inch. As 95% of the shows Universal produced were on film, this does not involve a great amount of material. Some 70s and 80s sitcoms, some TV specials, the previously mentioned Don Adams Screen Test series. Also, prints of movies that Universal would send out to festivals, schools and the like.

 

The biggest losses on the TV side (the losses to the music library were 100 times greater) were to the transfered tapes of shows from the TV catalogue. While they could always be re-transfered, Universal is not going to do so for shows that are not worth it to them. In other words, what some little company like Timeless or Madman is going to pay isn't going to cover the exhorbitant in-house costs they have to re-transfer a show. So if a show's existing tapes are gone and there are no 16mm prints around, barring a major cable sale, you won't see those shows again. The one good thing that came out of the fire was that Universal did a complete inventory of all of their vaults around the world and that was how they uncovered 16mm prints on many series. That is why after the fire took place, Timeless was able to obtain prints directly from Universal and no longer had to scrounge around the collectors world for material.


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#34 of 37 ahollis

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Posted September 13 2013 - 11:31 AM

So much misinformation gets spread about the fire. Here is what I'm led to believe.

No 35mm masters, fine grains or camera negatives were destroyed. The only original, masters that went would be shows that were shot on videotape, either 2 inch or 1 inch. As 95% of the shows Universal produced were on film, this does not involve a great amount of material. Some 70s and 80s sitcoms, some TV specials, the previously mentioned Don Adams Screen Test series. Also, prints of movies that Universal would send out to festivals, schools and the like.

The biggest losses on the TV side (the losses to the music library were 100 times greater) were to the transfered tapes of shows from the TV catalogue. While they could always be re-transfered, Universal is not going to do so for shows that are not worth it to them. In other words, what some little company like Timeless or Madman is going to pay isn't going to cover the exhorbitant in-house costs they have to re-transfer a show. So if a show's existing tapes are gone and there are no 16mm prints around, barring a major cable sale, you won't see those shows again. The one good thing that came out of the fire was that Universal did a complete inventory of all of their vaults around the world and that was how they uncovered 16mm prints on many series. That is why after the fire took place, Timeless was able to obtain prints directly from Universal and no longer had to scrounge around the collectors world for material.


Ah. Finally calm and correct information. Speculation can be controversial. Thanks.
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#35 of 37 Vahan_Nisanain

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Posted September 13 2013 - 11:35 AM

Neil, I thought Fine Grains and Camera Negatives were the same.



#36 of 37 Lromero1396

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Posted September 13 2013 - 01:04 PM

Neil, I thought Fine Grains and Camera Negatives were the same.

Incorrect. A camera negative (OCN) is different because 'Fine Grain' is used to refer to a fine grain master positive or fine grain master negative (when dealing with black and white). This is not to be confused with IP (Inter-positive), which refers to a positive element of a color production. This is official terminology as to what they are called and a camera negative would never be referred to as a 'fine grain', no matter what the grain structure would be like.



#37 of 37 MishaLauenstein

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Posted September 14 2013 - 07:07 PM

Why wouldn't the insurance pay for retransferring?

While they could always be re-transfered, Universal is not going to do so for shows that are not worth it to them.


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