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Star Trek: TMP Director's Cut

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#21 of 51 OFFLINE   Tom St Jones

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Posted July 14 2013 - 07:48 PM

The fact that next year marks Star Trek: TMP's 35th anniversary, is something that should by no means be lost on Paramount. Studios like high-profile new releases to time home media releases with, but they also like anniversaries.   



#22 of 51 OFFLINE   Joel Fontenot

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Posted July 15 2013 - 10:07 AM

Paramount does need to go back and redo the transfer on all levels and re-render the DC.  I still prefer the original theatrical cut because there are too many little things done to edit the film that bother me more than the new effects impress me.  That said, the added discussions near the end do help the story along better.

 

The only new effects that I never cared for was the new V'ger bridge walk scene - where the hexagonal block bridge forms in front of the crew walking from the Enterprise to the V'ger complex.  Dochterman's reasoning going into this was that the SFX crew would have "animated" it.  That's a fine idea, but then he assumes they would have done it in the traditional cartoon character movement style of using 2 frames for each still. Bullcrap. Even Disney in doing fine animated movement would occasionally do a single frame for each still.  The short amount of time this scene was dedicated to the screen would have called for a much smoother movement of the hexagonal blocks, and not the stuttering look Dochterman came up with.  Hopefully, if he does get the offer to redo his work in HD, he rethinks that scene.

 

Otherwise, I would love for this to have both the theatrical and DC cuts included in a re-issue.  And fix that one shot in the current BD of the Enterprise during the space-dock fly-around scene where the red pennant stripes down the secondary hull are briefly, and inexplicably, green (in that one wide low shot just before the pod backs up to the docking port).  This also needs a good film-like transfer that isn't DNR'd as much as the current BD.  It's not the worst, but it is still a bit too much.


Edited by Joel Fontenot, July 15 2013 - 10:08 AM.

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#23 of 51 OFFLINE   SilverWook

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Posted July 16 2013 - 01:22 AM

It depends on how much Paramount actually cares; the upgrades for the series work were done under the supervision of CBS, since they now control the series, while Paramount controls the movies. JJ Abrams ran into many headaches with merchandising for the new films, since CBS also holds the rights to the characters, which is one of many reasons why he has now moved on to Star Wars. All of this is to say, I would love a remastered TMP:DC, but unless Paramount is willing to pony up for the re-rendering costs for the special effects, it ain't gonna happen.

What sort of headaches? There was plenty of merchandise for the 2009 film, but a lot of it didn't sell. (Which also happened with TMP and resulted in very little TWOK stuff.) There doesn't even seem to be any STID toys.


Edited by SilverWook, July 16 2013 - 01:22 AM.


#24 of 51 OFFLINE   EnricoE

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Posted July 17 2013 - 10:47 PM

part 1 - 6 all need a proper remaster or even better a complete re-scan. then add the original theatrical mixes, drop the 7.1 mixes and to top it all, include the extended versions for part 2 - 6 via seamless branching. then add a proper re-creation of tmp d.c. :)



#25 of 51 OFFLINE   Moe Dickstein

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Posted July 17 2013 - 11:08 PM

I wouldn't want them to drop 7.1 mixes lol just include original stero tracks as an extra
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#26 of 51 OFFLINE   Paul_Warren

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Posted July 19 2013 - 09:42 PM

Sadly do not think Paramount will bother......ever but would love to be proven wrong. STV + STMPDC with 2013 VFX technology would be economical to produce for 1080P. But Paramount are very cheapskate with Star Trek always have been probably always wil be they look at how many copies the title sold in making their decisions.

 

I know people who approached Paramount about behind the scenes material on the TOS movies & were told point blank if its 100% free to us you can do it!! That tells you how likely this will happen as the STMPDC DVD VFX were produced for next to nothing. Foundation Imaging did most of the work for cost only ($90k budget for the entire project including the sound mixes, new docs etc etc this was leaked by someone who worked on it about 10 years ago via one of the old now closed Lightwave forums).



#27 of 51 OFFLINE   Jari K

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Posted July 20 2013 - 05:34 AM

They should take the TOS route (Blu-ray): include the original version (remastered) AND a new version with "upgraded" CGI in selected scenes. This worked great for TOS.

The problem with the "Lucas route" is simple: He hates those original versions and refuses (at least refused) to release in a proper form.
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#28 of 51 OFFLINE   wedgeworld1701

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Posted February 20 2014 - 07:20 PM

Hope I'm not repeating something. Be warned that the 2013 Blu Ray Release of TMP states in the Special Features "The newly restored, director's edition of the feature film" and one of the reviews (you have to search for "newest first" in the  reviews) says in the title "This magnificent Blu-ray disc IS the Robert Wise' Director's Cut!". his Purchase was an Amazon Verified Purchase.

 

So I purchased it. And it is not the directors edition. Just a heads up.


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#29 of 51 OFFLINE   Reggie W

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Posted February 21 2014 - 08:28 AM

This kind of situation is very disappointing because if they take the time and spend the money to create a new version of the film that "restores" or "improves" what the director prefers they should be willing to do what it takes to make that version available on blu-ray in such a way that honors that work.

 

Personally, I think because there is such a huge following for all things Star Trek this will eventually happen because it will be "worth it" to the studio to entice people to purchase this film again...and there is a large number of people that will do that the second it becomes available. You have a huge core group of buyers that is built in on this one.

 

I'm a bit more miffed about them doing this with a film like The Big Red One which to me was a big deal when they restored the work to something closer to what Sam Fuller was trying to accomplish...and I think Martin Scorsese found this restoration important as well...but when it came time to take it to blu-ray they could not provide the restoration work because they did not prepare it for HD. So we get the shortened version of the film  only and I doubt anything will be done about it for many years if at all. 


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#30 of 51 ONLINE   ROclockCK

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Posted February 21 2014 - 10:24 AM

As already noted in previous posts, even during the heyday of DVD when studios could think in terms of hundreds of thousands or even millions of units, the budgets to indulge special Director Cuts were often ridiculously tight given the creative ambition. That many of these legacy DVD projects (if not most) did not also shoot the moon in terms of high-def rendering and remastering is a tip right there that the golden era of fan-targeted special editions has very likely passed.

 

Realistically, what residual commercial interest remains in this 35 year old Star Trek film? Would a no doubt expen$$$ive reconstruction and rerendering of the late great Robert Wise's wish fulfillment cut even break 5k to 10k units in terms of hardcore sales? I mean, as one reviewer noted at the time about ST:TMP-DC's DVD release, after all of Wise's conceptual rework and finishing touches, in the end...well...the movie now "sucks less". Personally, I don't believe that evaluation is entirely fair...for all of its narrative flaws, ST:TMP remains one of my favourites among legacy Trek movies, in no small part due to Jerry Goldsmith's magnificent score.

 

But there's reel world...and there's real world. In the latter, I think we've already seen everything that Paramount is financially prepared to do with this niche-within-niche curiosity.

 

So hang onto your ST:TMP-DC DVDs...


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#31 of 51 OFFLINE   Worth

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Posted February 21 2014 - 10:45 AM

For all of its narrative flaws, ST:TMP remains one of favourites among legacy Trek movies, in no small part due to Jerry Goldsmith's magnificent score.

 

Goldsmith really outdid himself on this one. I think the film would be practically unwatchable without his music.


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#32 of 51 OFFLINE   Moe Dickstein

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Posted February 21 2014 - 10:58 AM

I gotta disagree Steve, in that Star Trek is its own vortex of rules where things happen due to the level of financial support within that fan base that don't happen anywhere else, or very few places.

I wouldn't be surprised to see this redone at some point, not only for Blu, but to allow for a DCP for theatrical showings. The DC in my opinion makes this more than just less sucky, it makes it a truly good film.
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#33 of 51 ONLINE   ROclockCK

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Posted February 21 2014 - 11:02 AM

Goldsmith really outdid himself on this one. I think the film would be practically unwatchable without his music.

 

I regard Goldsmith's work on this picture so highly that I even plunked down $25 bucks for the 2-Disc CD.

 

As you say, without that stunning score this movie would have floundered more than it did...Goldsmith sonically patched over a raft of structural and dramatic weaknesses.



#34 of 51 ONLINE   ROclockCK

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Posted February 21 2014 - 11:15 AM

I gotta disagree Steve, in that Star Trek is its own vortex of rules where things happen due to the level of financial support within that fan base that don't happen anywhere else, or very few places.

I wouldn't be surprised to see this redone at some point, not only for Blu, but to allow for a DCP for theatrical showings. The DC in my opinion makes this more than just less sucky, it makes it a truly good film.

 

I would never count that out Ted, and will happily be proven wrong. Especially in this case, since Wise and company took great pains to avoid the usual revisionist traps, choosing to focus on correcting the many panic-driven compromises made during their rush to a 'locked' theatrical release date. You can see by the original storyboards that this version is much closer to what was originally envisioned.

 

So I certainly hope you're right, but still hanging onto that Director's Cut DVD. ;)



#35 of 51 OFFLINE   Dave MJ

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Posted February 21 2014 - 12:23 PM

I'm probably in the minority, but while I liked most of the editorial changes, I didn't like the changes to the soundtrack.  The music is a different mix in many places and too many sound effects and computer voices were swapped out or toned down with more generic sounding effects. I realize the idea was to give it a "warmer" feel, but I liked the originals better.


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#36 of 51 OFFLINE   Moe Dickstein

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Posted February 21 2014 - 03:02 PM

Of course, I'd always keep the old around until the new is in hand, don't understand people selling on rumor to get a couple bucks extra used value.

The DC there is simply the film as it would have been finished had they not been rushed to meet the release date. All the other versions - to me - are inferior.
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#37 of 51 ONLINE   ROclockCK

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Posted February 21 2014 - 03:23 PM

Personally, I would give the edge to the Blu-ray Ted, simply because of its remastered audio. With such a music and sound-centric movie, that's gotta count for something. ;)



#38 of 51 OFFLINE   Moe Dickstein

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Posted February 21 2014 - 03:36 PM

I'm cut centric, can't stand the other versions anymore :) But glad it's there for you to enjoy =)
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#39 of 51 OFFLINE   Cinescott

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Posted February 21 2014 - 04:39 PM

Considering some of the schlock that does get released on Blu-ray, I find it difficult to believe that a Wise Cut TMP will never happen. 

 

I like the theatrical version and am happy to have it on Blu-ray, but I think the Wise Cut is a notch better. If the speculated budgets for updating the effects are accurate (maybe $10k?), it's tough to believe such a small amount would stop it for good. What about hi-def cable? There have to be some other revenue streams besides BR. Even if theoretically the title sold 10,000 units, that'd be $150k at a very affordable pricing point and would certainly make a small profit beyond the costs.

 

Maybe we should start a funding drive. 


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#40 of 51 OFFLINE   Neil S. Bulk

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Posted February 21 2014 - 07:53 PM

I regard Goldsmith's work on this picture so highly that I even plunked down $25 bucks for the 2-Disc CD.

 

It's since been supplanted by a 3-Disc version!

 

http://www.lalalandr...ds.com/STM.html







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