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Will This Setup Work?


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#1 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 05:07 AM

I've received the OK from the wife to buy a projector and setup a HT.  The only problem is I don't have a room ideally suited to be a HT.  I really only have 1 option:

 

1) Game room (14x18): This room is on the 2nd floor but is open on 2 sides to the 1st floor.  It gets a good amount of ambient light from living room and entry windows.  This could be controlled somewhat with motorized blackout shades (windows are 16 ft high).  I will never be able to achieve pitch black during the day however.  The walls are beige, the ceiling is white.  The wall I would have the screen on is only 91" inches wide so it limits me to a 92" fixed frame screen.  

 

I am considering a Panny AT-AR100u to battle the ambient light problem.  The room is 14' wide, so with the 2' wide AR100u, I could have a max throw distance of 12', probably a little less.  Seating distance can be adjusted to fit with screen size.  I am also considering an Elite fixed frame 92" screen.  The question is, should I go with a 1.8 gain screen or CineWhite?  Or should I go with a DIY painted screen?  I could achieve a slightly larger screen size this way.  Sound is not a priority at the moment, I will upgrade in the future.  For now I was just going to pick up a sound bar to hold me over.

 

I will be hooking up a PS3, Dish box and sound bar.  Will I need a receiver to hook up all three devices?

 

I will be using the room more as a multipurpose room, rather than a dedicated HT.  It will be used for watching sports and playing video games, with the occasional movie.  I really want to make this work, but don't want to spend the money and not get a good result.

 

Any advice?  Do you think this setup will work? 



#2 of 21 OFFLINE   Jason Charlton

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Posted May 30 2013 - 08:09 AM

I think you'll be much better off going with a top of the line Plasma display and beefing up the sound system (a sound bar with a 92" screen?!?!) to produce a more balanced solution.

 

Trying to shoehorn a projector setup in a room that is ill-suited for it is a recipe for frustration and blown budgets.


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#3 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 10:04 AM

+1

#4 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 10:43 AM

I think you'll be much better off going with a top of the line Plasma display and beefing up the sound system (a sound bar with a 92" screen?!?!) to produce a more balanced solution.

 

Trying to shoehorn a projector setup in a room that is ill-suited for it is a recipe for frustration and blown budgets.

 

So you don't think the Panny AT-AR100u would work?  From the reviews I've read, it does very well in rooms with ambient light.  

 

My only other option would be to convert my dinning room into a HT.  I'm not sure it's big enough however (12x12), limiting my throw distance to max of 10'.  I would want a minimum of 92" screen, preferably 100" +.  10' throw distance would be pushing it.

 

Dream is slowly being crushed. 



#5 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 11:26 AM

The dream doesn't need to die. I just checked PC.com and using their calculator, you can do a 100"-ish screen(how you came up with 91" wall limits you to 92" screen is beyond me) and still do the AR100 with a 10' throw.

 

But.

 

Seriously a sound bar with a 100" screen?

 

The limiting factor here is the ambient light. You do know(or you should "read up") that the higher the gain the screen is, the less viewing angle you get. A 1.8 screen gain will look like crap to everyone outside the sides of the screen. Not to mention you probably will need to do two screens(painted wall for daytime and a roll down for nighttime...etc).

 

What is your budget? I would not spend less than $3000 on an "ambient light room". Any less and it is money wasted. Period.

 

Edit:

Forgot to include the calculator...

 

http://www.projector...culator-pro.htm



#6 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 11:43 AM

The dream doesn't need to die. I just checked PC.com and using their calculator, you can do a 100"-ish screen(how you came up with 91" wall limits you to 92" screen is beyond me) and still do the AR100 with a 10' throw.

 

But.

 

Seriously a sound bar with a 100" screen?

 

The limiting factor here is the ambient light. You do know(or you should "read up") that the higher the gain the screen is, the less viewing angle you get. A 1.8 screen gain will look like crap to everyone outside the sides of the screen. Not to mention you probably will need to do two screens(painted wall for daytime and a roll down for nighttime...etc).

 

What is your budget? I would not spend less than $3000 on an "ambient light room". Any less and it is money wasted. Period.

 

Edit:

Forgot to include the calculator...

 

http://www.projector...culator-pro.htm

 

I got the 92" screen limit from this http://g-ecx.images-...mensions_lg.jpg.  With a fixed frame Elite screen a 100" screen has an overall width of 91.9".  I am not married to Elite screens though, that's why I am looking for alternatives.

 

I'm glad you mentioned 1.8 gain screen looking like crap.  I had read about this but good to get confirmation.

 

I was planning on doing this in steps.  Not all at once.  I wanted to start with the right projector and work from there.  Budget over time is not a big concern.  For step 1, my budget would be around $3000.  I want to start with a good, quality picture and worry about sound down the road.  That's why I was wondering about sound bars.  What is a cheap alternative to start with?

 

The room doesn't get direct light from any windows.  It leaks in from living room and entry.  I think with the proper shades, I could control the light in the room during the day.  There would be no issue with light at night.  I will try to post a few pics when I get home from work.



#7 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 12:45 PM

I design "stupid expensive" AV for a living. Used to sell AV wholesale, which is why I now design...instead of sell retail. When I left my job(voluntarily with an 18mo severance) I wasn't allowed to directly work for a former client...

Anyway. I know what I speak of, and so do many others here. Rooms with un-controlled light are a PITA. I've designed great rooms with dual projectors and screens. What works during the day, no longer works when the sun goes down(the reviews of the 100 say that..."not the greatest when dark")

TV are a different story. And yes, in my great room...my Hitachi plasma has been calibrated for both night and day. It has a timer to switch visual profile so it doesn't rely on the light sensor(which is off).

So the 100 will work...but I'd make a dual screen situation...

#8 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 12:53 PM

I design "stupid expensive" AV for a living. Used to sell AV wholesale, which is why I now design...instead of sell retail. When I left my job(voluntarily with an 18mo severance) I wasn't allowed to directly work for a former client...

Anyway. I know what I speak of, and so do many others here. Rooms with un-controlled light are a PITA. I've designed great rooms with dual projectors and screens. What works during the day, no longer works when the sun goes down(the reviews of the 100 say that..."not the greatest when dark")

TV are a different story. And yes, in my great room...my Hitachi plasma has been calibrated for both night and day. It has a timer to switch visual profile so it doesn't rely on the light sensor(which is off).

So the 100 will work...but I'd make a dual screen situation...

 

What are your suggestions for painted screen for daytime and roll down for nighttime?  



#9 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 01:20 PM

Go to your neighborhood Sherwin Williams. They've been doing this rodeo awhile. One of their paints is a dead ringer for a CineWhite. Projector Central has an article about DIY paint. MaxxMudd is a formulation(recipe) I've used before.

Recommendations are tempered with your skill level. Can you paint the wall smooth? Will you instead need a piece of plastic or MDF to create your smooth surface to paint?

As for screen...want acoustically transparent?

I have a friend who did a combination painted wall/in-wall speakers. Took lots(and I mean LOTS) of trial and error to get paint and AT fabric that was close. He did that cause his wife runs a daycare and the paint is chalkboard paint. So his wall is kid friendly...and midnight on a Saturday friendly.

#10 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 01:41 PM

Go to your neighborhood Sherwin Williams. They've been doing this rodeo awhile. One of their paints is a dead ringer for a CineWhite. Projector Central has an article about DIY paint. MaxxMudd is a formulation(recipe) I've used before.

Recommendations are tempered with your skill level. Can you paint the wall smooth? Will you instead need a piece of plastic or MDF to create your smooth surface to paint?

As for screen...want acoustically transparent?

I have a friend who did a combination painted wall/in-wall speakers. Took lots(and I mean LOTS) of trial and error to get paint and AT fabric that was close. He did that cause his wife runs a daycare and the paint is chalkboard paint. So his wall is kid friendly...and midnight on a Saturday friendly.

 

I was actually fired once from a painting job because I am that awful at it.  I would prefer to buy a screen.  However, if I were to paint one I would use a plastic or MDF.  Smoothing the wall is not an option, per my wife.  

 

Most of my viewing would be at night, except for the occasional midday NFL game.  So I'm still leaning towards the 92" CineWhite Elite screen.  Are there any other brands I should be considering?  I am not interested in an AT screen.  

 

I think my biggest issue so far is figuring out what to do about sound.  7.1 is not an option as there are no side walls in this room.  I would have to go with 5.1 or a sound bar.  Sounds like a sound bar is a bad idea.  I do not want to blow my budget on audio upfront.



#11 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 02:06 PM

Shockingly...when there are no walls...

4 tower speakers. There is a picture on here(somewhere) showing a pair of Altec Lansing Model 96 sitting on both sides of a recliner. The room is 40x40 with the viewing area 12x10. The speaker wire running to them is adhesive flat, covered by a rug. That speaker was chosen cause it is veneered on all 4 sides.

Speaker placement won't be a problem...cause I assume you'll have places to sit...and places to sit a beer.

#12 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 02:11 PM

By the way, go to Amazon and look at the Mirage Omni 350. I bet 4 of those would work very nicely.

Using my phone...so posting links is not something I've figured out yet.

#13 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 03:05 PM

IMG_0034.JPG IMG_0033.JPG IMG_0032.JPG IMG_0035.JPG

 

Glad to see my ignorance on this subject is not lost on you.

 

Anways, I have added 4 photos of the room in question.  This should help you understand what I am talking about.  These photos were taken approximately at 5:15 pm central time.

 

As you can see from the photos I have 4 windows to contend with.  3 from the living room and 1 from the entry.  My thought was to put remote controlled shades over those 4 windows to help with the ambient light.

 

My current idea is to put the screen on the wall behind the TV laying on the ground.  That wall is 91" wide.

 

Now that I'm looking at the photos I got a crazy, maybe stupid, idea.  Do you think it would be possible to put a roll down screen centered between the 2 arches in the 4th photo?  I'm not sure how it would work as there would be no wall behind the screen.  

 

Take a look at the photos and let me know if you have any suggestions on how to optimize the space.

 

And thanks for all the advice.  It has really helped getting some ideas from someone who actually knows what they are talking about.



#14 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 03:19 PM

You could use the double arch, yes(Ive designed tougher rooms than this).

You could, eventually, get something like the Pinnacle QP15 or Def Tech Mythos(forget the model number, but your LCR in one speaker like the QP15) and mount it to the bottom of a pull down screen.

Get blinds to cover the arches where the
blinds and screen(with speaker attached) roll down in unison.

#15 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 03:26 PM

You could use the double arch, yes(Ive designed tougher rooms than this).

You could, eventually, get something like the Pinnacle QP15 or Def Tech Mythos(forget the model number, but your LCR in one speaker like the QP15) and mount it to the bottom of a pull down screen.

Get blinds to cover the arches where the
blinds and screen(with speaker attached) roll down in unison.

 

Ha, that sounds expensive.  So you would go with roll down in front of the double arch over the 92" fixed frame on the 91" wall?

 

My throw distance could go up to 16' for the double arch, which means I could increase screen size significantly.  

 

Any suggestions on an electric roll down screen and blinds?



#16 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 03:36 PM

The screen/blinds don't have to be electric. I'd stick with Elite for a pull down. As for blinds...start hitting up Home Depot/Menards/Jo-Ann Fabrics and buy whats on sale or clearance. Thick and dark. If you had a $20k budget, I'd start out with brands...but we don't have that luxury. Look up Radiance 0216300 on Amazon. Not big enough, but the idea of what works.

#17 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 03:52 PM

If I were to hold off on the blinds over the double arch for now, and just put blinds on the 4 windows, do you think the screen would still work in that location?  



#18 of 21 ONLINE   schan1269

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Posted May 30 2013 - 04:00 PM

Some screen with the 100 will work, yes. Or move to a different projector.

One of my favorite "tough room" projectors is the Knoll HDP2100 mkii.

#19 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 30 2013 - 05:51 PM

Alright, I think I'm gonna go with the 100u and this screen http://www.amazon.co...s/dp/B000Q87LM6.  I believe with a throw distance of roughly 16' I shouldn't have a problem lighting up the 125" screen.  If that is pushing it, I could go with the 100".

 

All I need now is to pick out an audio system.



#20 of 21 OFFLINE   johnnyFTWedge

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Posted May 31 2013 - 04:42 AM

I'm thinking about picking this up http://www.amazon.co...nd sound system for my initial audio system.

 

Mixed reviews, but it is pretty cheap and will get me started.






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