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#21 of 67 OFFLINE   Cameron Yee

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Posted April 13 2013 - 04:57 PM

That's just it. So far there's been nothing conclusive that what we're seeing Hannibal prepare and eat is human. It's just been the writing and editing leading us to make those assumptions.
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#22 of 67 OFFLINE   Adam Lenhardt

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Posted April 14 2013 - 08:36 AM

Huh. Freddie Lounds has been womanized....

Also, Dr. Alan Bloom became Dr. Alana Bloom so that Bryan Fuller could cast his "Wonderfalls" vet Caroline Dhavernas in the role.

Another solid episode as Hannibal works his way into Graham's psyche. I'm also glad that the Jacob Hobbs case is not shut per se and more is being revealed about his motives through his daughter.

Me too. It's always driven me nuts that on procedurals the detectives have horrific encounters week after week and then are emotional reset for the next episode. The fact that there's bleed (if you pardon the pun) and overlap from case to case is one of the more compelling aspects of the show.

 

I'll refrain from a spoiler here, but if you've read "Red Dragon" you will know what happens to Lounds. Of course, that was a male Lounds so I suppose all bets are off and the show can change anything it wants. I like this woman Lounds. We'll have to see how she plays out.

I suppose it depends on the show's intent; does it just plan on using Thomas Harris's characters to tell its own story, or does it see itself as a prequel to Harris's story? If the former ist true, I'd say that Lounds is going to be toast sooner rather than later. If the latter is true, than we might see Red Dragon play out over season three or four, and they'll want to keep all of the players alive until it does.

It'd actually be interesting if the show follows Graham through the culmination of that story and then does a semi-reboot for season four or five with a new actress cast as Clarice opposite Mikkelsen.

This show has really impressed me over these 2 episodes. I wasn't expecting squat, so perhaps it is lowered expectations. But, I'm in for the remainder of these 13 for sure.

It's an interesting experiment, because NBC and Gaumont are basically approaching it like a cable series: 13 episode seasons, a big Hollywood name in David Slade as the producing director and a 10PM timeslot so that the show isn't subject to FCC decency rules.

 

That's just it. So far there's been nothing conclusive that what we're seeing Hannibal prepare and eat is human. It's just been the writing and editing leading us to make those assumptions.

I really enjoy the way they're playing this. Really it's the show playing on the audience's preconceived notions about the material that has us making those leaps, and editing just gives us a little bit a prod. I kind of wish they hadn't shown Lecter preparing the lungs in the first episode directly after the coroner talked about how the lungs had been removed from the victim of the copycat killer, because I don't think the audience needed that prod.



#23 of 67 OFFLINE   Walter Kittel

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Posted April 14 2013 - 10:33 AM

Yes, Hannibal so far has done an excellent job of toying with the viewers based on their knowledge of Lector from the books and films; in a very engaging and enjoyable way.

 

I really love the visual design of the series so far with splendid uses of reds and whites (colors associated with flesh and bone).  The bathroom scene in episode one with Graham and Crawford (in terms of visual design) would have been right at home in a Stanley Kubrick film (the Shining comes to mind.)

 

Really enjoying the series to date.

 

- Walter.


Edited by Walter Kittel, April 14 2013 - 10:34 AM.

Fidelity to the source should always be the goal for Blu-ray releases.

#24 of 67 OFFLINE   Adam Lenhardt

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Posted April 14 2013 - 11:02 AM

While the premiere ratings were on the low side of good, the second episode (airing against repeats on the other networks) actually slightly improved on the premiere's ratings. Given NBC's current situation, this one looks likely to be renewed. On the other hand, we're talking about the network that just basically fired the number one host in late night, so I'm never confident that they'll let the number dictate their decisions.



#25 of 67 OFFLINE   Stan

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Posted April 15 2013 - 12:44 PM

I think they're doing a great job with this show. The guy playing Lecter is incredibly creepy. Haircut, facial structure, accent, etc. Very good actor chosen for the part.


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#26 of 67 OFFLINE   Paul D G

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Posted April 15 2013 - 11:18 PM

I was going to skip but I scanned this thread and decided to give it a try. Glad I did. The mushrooms gave just the right amount of horror to creep you out.



#27 of 67 OFFLINE   Brett_M

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Posted April 19 2013 - 09:02 AM

So far, I love it.  There have been several direct lifts of text & dialog from Red Dragon and most of the Lecter stuff in that novel is background.  It's creepy and stylish and I love the main actors.  Utterly cool. 

 

P.S. The Following blows.  They lost me at the pilot.


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#28 of 67 OFFLINE   Walter Kittel

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Posted April 19 2013 - 09:49 AM

I loved the visual design of last night's episode with all of the fall foliage (and how it ties into the theme of death and decay) but in some ways this was the weakest episode of the three so far with too many improbable elements (particularly in the final act).

 

How did Lounds get in to see Abigail Hobbs at the hospital?

How did Lounds get behind the police tape?

How did they dispose of the body of the brother?

 

Still loving the surreal, dreamlike aspects of the show with its languid tempos in select scenes, such as some of the conversations between Will and Abigail but I hope they don't start playing idiot ball with the plot lines.

 

- Walter.


Fidelity to the source should always be the goal for Blu-ray releases.

#29 of 67 OFFLINE   Quentin

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Posted April 19 2013 - 03:02 PM

Yeah, I'm getting annoyed at the almighty powers of Lounds to show up any time, anywhere.

 

I'm slightly ok with chalking up the disposal of the body to "Lecter is a mad genius", but don't make a habit of it.



#30 of 67 OFFLINE   NolanJ

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Posted April 19 2013 - 10:57 PM

Anybody else feel distracted with the background music that plays through the entire episode? I am not a fan.



#31 of 67 OFFLINE   Adam Lenhardt

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Posted April 20 2013 - 10:56 AM

It's creepy and stylish and I love the main actors.  Utterly cool.

I'm really impressed by how well-defined the main characters are after three episodes. Particularly Jack Crawford. We're used to the great leader on procedurals whose moral compass sets true north and leads by example. Laurence Fishburne's Jack Crawford isn't that guy at all. He sets an objective, and he's a master at manipulating his subordinates to achieve the desired outcome. And he makes no apologies for it. Dr. Bloom is nice and decent and well-adjusted, but she's not naive. Freddie Lounds is like Loki, stirring up the pot to have something to write about. And Dr. Hannibal Lecter is Satan, mixing truth with lies to convince you to trade away your soul. That he offers a choice, as he did to Abigail after manipulating her perception of the situation so it no longer really seemed like a choice, is so much worse than forcing.

How did Lounds get in to see Abigail Hobbs at the hospital?

When I was a journalism student, it always amazed me the places you can get into if you frame things the right way and proceed with absolutely no shame. Lounds probably found the name of another patient with no visitor restrictions, and gained access to the halls by presenting herself as that patient's guest. Once inside, it's a small matter to venture into another room. The doors in a psychiatric facility lock the opposite way, so that you're locked in instead of locked out. And it should be noted that this hospital wasn't exactly Arkham Asylum; there was a very low level of security present.

How did Lounds get behind the police tape?
How did they dispose of the body of the brother?

These were the things that bothered me. Particularly with regard to the body. Dr. Bloom wouldn't have been unconscious for more than a couple of minutes. Not a lot of time to move a body, especially if you need to keep the blood from getting on you as Hannibal did.

#32 of 67 OFFLINE   Cameron Yee

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Posted April 20 2013 - 02:14 PM

Not sure if this set off anyone else's radar, but in last week's mushroom episode, the blonde who went to the pharmacy seemed familiar. Turns out it's not just the actress but the character she plays, Gretchen Speck, who was a character from Bryan Fuller's Wonderfalls series. Google says the character will turn up again, which should be interesting if she crosses paths with Alana Bloom!
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#33 of 67 OFFLINE   Stan

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Posted April 20 2013 - 06:35 PM

Read a couple of websites and articles where this is already pretty much guaranteed a second season. I hope so, certainly enjoying it so far.


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#34 of 67 OFFLINE   Joe_H

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Posted April 21 2013 - 02:04 PM

Unfortunately, they're not going to be airing episode 4 of this, though.  They'll just skip it and assume that we can catch up.  Because that's great, just alienate a slowly growing audience of what is a surprisingly good show by jumping forward and confusing everyone.

 

http://www.hitfix.co...-boston-tragedy

 

I hope it's aired in other countries so that it can be found elsewhere, because I'm not going to watch episode 5 unless I can watch episode 4.


Edited by Joe_H, April 21 2013 - 02:08 PM.


#35 of 67 OFFLINE   Stan

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Posted April 21 2013 - 03:02 PM

Yeah, I'm getting annoyed at the almighty powers of Lounds to show up any time, anywhere.

 

I find her incredibly annoying. Read Red Dragon probably 13-14 years ago, so don't remember to much if that's what a lot of this is based on. Still have the book, but haven't glanced at it in years. Since this is all apparently fresh to me, I'll leave the book alone a while longer.

 

Already confused as I thought Graham was possibly a major reimaging of the "Clarice" character.

 

I hope Lecter takes care of Lounds and serves her up for dinner sometime. She's the one negative in this show I don't care for.


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#36 of 67 OFFLINE   Cameron Yee

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Posted April 21 2013 - 03:18 PM

Lounds is definitely meant to be reviled, but she is strangely more likable than the pathetic slob version done by Philip Seymour in Red Dragon.

 

By my count this is the third iteration of Graham. William Petersen in Manhunter and Edward Norton in Red Dragon preceded him.


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#37 of 67 OFFLINE   Adam Lenhardt

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Posted April 21 2013 - 04:39 PM

Unfortunately, they're not going to be airing episode 4 of this, though.  They'll just skip it and assume that we can catch up.  Because that's great, just alienate a slowly growing audience of what is a surprisingly good show by jumping forward and confusing everyone.
 
http://www.hitfix.co...-boston-tragedy
 
I hope it's aired in other countries so that it can be found elsewhere, because I'm not going to watch episode 5 unless I can watch episode 4.

Showrunner was uncomfortable with some of the particular violence in the episode in light of what happened in Boston last Monday, and asked NBC to pull the episode. Apparently it was a pretty stand-alone procedural episode so we really won't be missing much of the ongoing plot. I agree that it's frustrating.

#38 of 67 OFFLINE   Joe_H

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Posted April 21 2013 - 05:02 PM

Showrunner was uncomfortable with some of the particular violence in the episode in light of what happened in Boston last Monday, and asked NBC to pull the episode. Apparently it was a pretty stand-alone procedural episode so we really won't be missing much of the ongoing plot. I agree that it's frustrating.

 

I know that's the reason they're giving (and maybe not even your actual position on it), but in my mind, it's just not a good reason.  The show is just as violent no matter what episode they air, so if they really wanted to take it off the air because of the bombing and making people uncomfortable, then don't air the show for a week or two.  Secondly, with a show like this, you know what you're getting into.  People who don't want to see violence right now aren't going to accidentally tune in to Hannibal.  And then also, while they didn't know this when they made the decision, by the time the episode airs, the ordeal will have been over for nearly a week.  Lastly, even in more procedural episodes, a show like this builds on the relationship and manipulations between Graham and Lector, and so to skip an episode is to skip a portion of that.

 

I mean, I live only a few miles from where everything went down, my town was recommended (but not ordered like some other nearby towns) to shelter in place, and I work in Cambridge, which was entirely shut down on Friday.  I understand the sensitivities in play here.  At the same time, it's supposed to be a form of art.

 

At the very least, they should host the episode on their website in entirety for those who want to see it.  Like I said, if I can't watch it through SOME method, they're going to lose me as a viewer.  I know it's just one person, but I'm sure I'm not the only one bothered by something like that.  And for the regular public, who knows if its going to be enough of a jump forward to be confusing.  According to Sepinwall's article, you definitely will feel like something is missing:

 

Instead, we got episodes 1, 2, 3, 5 and 6, with 4 skipped. And it was clear in watching the fifth episode (and the "Previously, on 'Hannibal'" clips before it) that some notable character and plot arc things had happened in between the hours I'd seen. It's not enough that you'll feel lost in what happens — particularly since the fifth episode is one of the strongest NBC sent — but you'll definitely feel like you're missing out on a few notable beats, particularly in the relationship between Will Graham and Jack Crawford.


Edited by Joe_H, April 21 2013 - 05:03 PM.


#39 of 67 OFFLINE   Stan

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Posted April 21 2013 - 05:15 PM

Showrunner was uncomfortable with some of the particular violence in the episode in light of what happened in Boston last Monday, and asked NBC to pull the episode. Apparently it was a pretty stand-alone procedural episode so we really won't be missing much of the ongoing plot. I agree that it's frustrating.

 

What's odd is that TNT showed a "Castle" repeat last week that was very much like the Boston issue. A bombing in a public place against Wall Street protestors. The similarities were eerie, backpack, etc., although not nearly as graphic as "Hannibal" probably would have been. Yet they didn't pull it.

 

I think people can separate fact from fiction, but maybe this "Hannibal" episode was just to soon.


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#40 of 67 OFFLINE   Adam Lenhardt

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Posted April 24 2013 - 05:27 AM

At the very least, they should host the episode on their website in entirety for those who want to see it.  Like I said, if I can't watch it through SOME method, they're going to lose me as a viewer.

Good news: NBC has reedited the fourth episode into a multi-part web series that will bridge the gap between episodes three and five.
 

What's odd is that TNT showed a "Castle" repeat last week that was very much like the Boston issue. A bombing in a public place against Wall Street protestors. The similarities were eerie, backpack, etc., although not nearly as graphic as "Hannibal" probably would have been. Yet they didn't pull it.

It aired automatically as part of TNT's syndication package of the show. TNT released a press release apologizing for airing it.




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