TCM Dark Crimes: The Glass Key, Phantom Lady and The Blue Dahlia (1 Viewer)

I viewed all three titles in their entirety today released through TCM Vault Collection which contain two Paramount titles that are now controlled by Universal and Universal's Phantom Lady. I was very happy with the video presentation results especially with Phantom Lady which hasn't really looked good on prior TV showings. The Blue Dahlia was very good too, but didn't seem to be derived from the OCN. While The Glass Key looked very fine too. I wished all titles contain an audio commentary from Eddie Muller, but all three did contain some short segments from Mr. Muller.






Crawdaddy

Thanks for the report. I really like all of these movies and hope to add this release to my collection at some point.

Frankly I was very disappointed with the visuals and sound on these three films. I believe they were all touted as restored. Looks like old masters or worn prints. Reel change marks, spots, speckles, not great contrast and a bit dupey looking....even the Universal title. I think this is the first time they are officially on DVD. And just a couple of years ago we got that horror set with MAD DOCTOR OF MARKET STREET, STRANGE CASE OF DR. Rx, etc, and they looked like BluRay quality in comparison. If all the Paramount's look like this, we are in trouble. But I was surprised PHANTOM LADY looked so lackluster.

Originally Posted by John Morgan /t/325873/tcm-dark-crimes-the-glass-key-phantom-lady-and-the-blue-dahlia#post_4011405
Frankly I was very disappointed with the visuals and sound on these three films. I believe they were all touted as restored. Looks like old masters or worn prints. Reel change marks, spots, speckles, not great contrast and a bit dupey looking....even the Universal title. I think this is the first time they are officially on DVD. And just a couple of years ago we got that horror set with MAD DOCTOR OF MARKET STREET, STRANGE CASE OF DR. Rx, etc, and they looked like BluRay quality in comparison. If all the Paramount's look like this, we are in trouble. But I was surprised PHANTOM LADY looked so lackluster.

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Wow! I don't know what to say to that criticism except I disagree with it. By the way, what display did you view your set on? I viewed mine on the Panny 65VT50 with the THX Cinema setting and in a darken room.

Pioneer Elite BDF-05FD
Denon AVR3808CI
JVC DLA-HD1 1080p Projector
103 inch screen
These films just didn't look as good as other DVDs I have. All of them seem to have spots flickering by, and they just don't look nearly as sharp as other DVDs of the era that are supposed to be new masters. I kind of expected it from the Paramount films, but not the Universal title as Universal has original negs as well a fine grains mostly in great shape. Maybe PHANTOM LADY has some problems with the material. I guess I got kind of spoiled with the initial TCM archives (I think it was the initial one) with the B horror films. They didn't seem to have a blemish on them. I just have a suspicion that these were either some oldish transfers or done quickly from prints. I felt the same way about the negative quality of the two versions of BACK STREET release. For all the great stuff they can do (like the BluRay monster sets), I really feel their standard DVD releases have really hit bottom. That Marjorie Main double disc with MURDER, HE SAYS (looks okay), but FEUDIN', FUSSIN', AND A-FIGHTIN' Iooks like a bootleg.
I was just hoping for better since all three of these noirish films deserves great contrast, deep blacks and sharp images.

Robert Crawford said:

Wow!  I don't know what to say to that criticism except I disagree with it.  By the way, what display did you view your set on?  I viewed mine on the Panny 65VT50 with the THX Cinema setting and in a darken room.

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Sorry Robert, but I have to agree with John.
I'll go even further and say that Glass Key (the only one I've looked at so far) looks like it's been mastered from something intended for analog display (like Laserdisc, though I could have sworn the old LD of this looked superior to what is here).
This is abysmal quality for 2012.
On the one hand I'm happy to finally cross these two Ladd/Lake films off my 'most wanted on dvd' list after all these years- but at the same time, the basic A/V quality of the release is so bottom of the barrel and unsatisfying, it's almost like still not having them.
In the same order I got another Universal TCM set "Women In Danger" and was irked to see at least one of the widescreen films presented in 4:3 letterbox- again from what looks like an analog era master- smeary, soft,...UGH.
I'm viewing these on a Pioneer Kuro projector (JVC RS2 clone).

Originally Posted by Paul_Scott /t/325873/tcm-dark-crimes-the-glass-key-phantom-lady-and-the-blue-dahlia#post_4011539
Sorry Robert, but I have to agree with John.
I'll go even further and say that Glass Key (the only one I've looked at so far) looks like it's been mastered from something intended for analog display (like Laserdisc, though I could have sworn the old LD of this looked superior to what is here).
This is abysmal quality for 2012.
On the one hand I'm happy to finally cross these two Ladd/Lake films off my 'most wanted on dvd' list after all these years- but at the same time, the basic A/V quality of the release is so bottom of the barrel and unsatisfying, it's almost like still not having them.
In the same order I got another Universal TCM set "Women In Danger" and was irked to see at least one of the widescreen films presented in 4:3 letterbox- again from what looks like an analog era master- smeary, soft,...UGH.
I'm viewing these on a Pioneer Kuro projector (JVC RS2 clone).

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No need to be sorry. However, on my display I'm not seeing to the degree what you guys are seeing with this boxset. Maybe, it's because I have a 65" display compared to your projector screens.

Paul_Scott said:

In the same order I got another Universal TCM set "Women In Danger" and was irked to see at least one of the widescreen films presented in 4:3 letterbox- again from what looks like an analog era master- smeary, soft,...UGH.
I'm viewing these on a Pioneer Kuro projector (JVC RS2 clone).

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I assume you're referring to The Unguarded Moment. That disc is a total abomination and has received universal (!) condemnation.

Eh, I don't think they look too bad and are overall acceptable if not outstanding. The Glass Key is definitely an older transfer, but looks like a very good analog transfer. Could have used a remaster, but still looks okay enough on DVD with good contrast and B&W levels. The Phantom Lady looks like a recent transfer so no problems there outside of light flaws in the film itself like a few lines here and there.
These two aren't cleaned up digitally and show dirt and other anomalies, but they were pretty easy to ignore. It's small potatoes as far as I'm concerned as long as the transfer itself is good.
I do agree they don't look as good as the DVD release of This Gun For Hire, though. That one looked great and was digitally polished up to boot. I haven't watched The Blue Dahlia yet.

I have to chime in with those who are disappointed with this release.
I had hoped that this set would let me finally ditch my unspectacular, PAL-sped up, R2 DVDs of The Blue Dahlia and The Glass Key. I had feared they might have simply used the same masters as the R2 release rather than giving the films the treatment they deserve -- Imagine my surprise when I discovered that not only are these old masters, but they appear older, and markedly inferior to the ones on the R2 DVDs! Both films appear to be sourced from analog masters. This is just unacceptably lazy, and these TCM sets have been plagued with this kind of thing lately -- not only the non-anamorphic title on the Women In Danger set, but Leo McCarey's Belle of The Nineties on the Universal Rarities set was also from an old, deficient transfer.
I'm going to return this set and get my money back. Then I'll buy a region 2 disc of Phantom Lady.

I haven't had the R2 discs to compare them to, so I assumed they were the best available, but if these are indeed inferior to the R2 discs that have been floating around for many years then the complaints are pretty well justified. It also seems to suggest that Universal isn't even researching existing transfers and just using the ones more convenient. I'll hold on to mine, but it's a good warning for those who already bought the UK discs not to double-dip.
However, still think The Phantom Lady is alright and is clearly a more recent remaster.
I might have to agree with the lashing Universal is getting in these more recent sets. While the Sony titles are generally of a high quality standard, these Universal titles are pretty much a grab bag. I haven't watched all of the Joel McCrea Western titles yet, but including the inferior transfers of certain titles mentioned in the "Woman in Danger" and "Universal Rarities" set, the Billy Wilder set also had a more analog-looking Foreign Intrigue with some unusual "ghosting" (for lack of a better word) that did clear up halfway through the movie.
I mentioned it before in that thread, but I've noticed the most recent wave of Universal MOD titles are have a lot of decent-to-lackluster old, analog-era transfers which is in contrast to earlier releases that looked more recently remastered and generally high quality.

I agree that the transfers in the TCM/Universal sets have gotten worse as the program has been progressing. Looking at the 1930s Rarities Set and this Film Noir set, no way do these transfers even come close to the clarity and crispness seen in the transfers that Universal did for sets that were sold at retail. I watch these MOD sets on a SD-TV, and I find the transfers to be just about acceptable; nothing really great; the picture could be clearer, with less noise; the contrast is usually poor, with no detail in the blacks. I can image what people who watch these on HD-TVs feel!
Maybe those early transfers in the program were originally meant for retail releases? Now that these sets are just MOD, they don't have to go all out. Going on four years now in the MOD era, there are still different standards for MOD and retail releases. MOD releases continue to have a lower overall picture quality than retail releases had; just look at the Fox Cinema Archives and these TCM/Universal sets. Yet MOD continues to be sold at premium prices. It doesn't seem that there is much we consumers can do about it, as these companies seems to have a "take it or leave it" type of attitude. It's a sad state of affairs.

JoHud said:

I haven't had the R2 discs to compare them to, so I assumed they were the best available, but if these are indeed inferior to the R2 discs that have been floating around for many years then the complaints are pretty well justified.

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II know caps only give an incomplete approximation of what a DVD looks like in motion, but if you look at the comparisons on DVDBeaver, you'll see what we're talking about.
What adds insult to injury is that the superior R2 DVDs of the two Ladd films are available at Amazon US for little more than $3.00 each plus shipping.
I do agree that Phantom Lady's transfer looks newer and better.

jdee28 said:

I agree that the transfers in the TCM/Universal sets have gotten worse as the program has been progressing. Looking at the 1930s Rarities Set and this Film Noir set, no way do these transfers even come close to the clarity and crispness seen in the transfers that Universal did for sets that were sold at retail. I watch these MOD sets on a SD-TV, and I find the transfers to be just about acceptable; nothing really great; the picture could be clearer, with less noise; the contrast is usually poor, with no detail in the blacks. I can image what people who watch these on HD-TVs feel!
Maybe those early transfers in the program were originally meant for retail releases? Now that these sets are just MOD, they don't have to go all out. Going on four years now in the MOD era, there are still different standards for MOD and retail releases. MOD releases continue to have a lower overall picture quality than retail releases had; just look at the Fox Cinema Archives and these TCM/Universal sets. Yet MOD continues to be sold at premium prices. It doesn't seem that there is much we consumers can do about it, as these companies seems to have a "take it or leave it" type of attitude. It's a sad state of affairs.

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I thought (and I still hope) that the initial/early runs of these sets were pressed.

Dave B Ferris said:

I thought (and I still hope) that the initial/early runs of these sets were pressed.

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You are correct.

Yes, mine was pressed.

The Blue Dahlia and The Glass Key are among last few titles from my original wishlist (made over a decade ago) to finally make it to DVD. I can't believe it took almost 15 years since the advent of the DVD format for these to see the light of day (while a lot of obscure stuff has made it not only to DVD but BD as well). Too bad these apparently don't look as good as the other Lake/Ladd noir This Gun for Hire but something is better than nothing I guess. I can't wait to get my own copy in the next day or two.
-D

John Morgan said:

Frankly I was very disappointed with the visuals and sound on these three films. I believe they were all touted as restored.

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Well, at least one standard is maintained: nowhere are the films advertised as restored.
http://shop.tcm.com/detail.php?p=382488

Well, at least Uni is issuing 3 good noirs. That said, all have been aired on AMC and/or TCM, and/or been issued on VHS or R2 DVD. So I'm left to wonder if Uni literally has unearthed any and every classic Universal and Paramount film to which it has active rights (?)
I'm guessing this means we'll never see Danger Woman (1946), Mystery of Marie Roget (1943), Among the Living (1941), Man in Half Moon Street (1944), Girl in the Kremlin (1957), or the Universal Crime Club titles (on another thread someone wrote these may be in rights tie-ups... would be nice to officially hear from Uni Home Video on this...)

Traveling Matt said:

Well, at least one standard is maintained: nowhere are the films advertised as restored.
http://shop.tcm.com/detail.php?p=382488

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More "Off the Shelf" releases.