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Coming Soon From Olive Films


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#1821 of 2400 OFFLINE   bgart13

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Posted May 30 2013 - 02:16 PM

Bob has worked with many companies on releasing proper presentation of movies. Do not disregard him or his knowledge. Just because he posts on forums does not make him a fanboy -- it makes him an expert who likes to interact with fans online to discuss movies and share his knowledge.


Edited by bgart13, May 30 2013 - 02:17 PM.


#1822 of 2400 OFFLINE   David Steigman

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Posted May 30 2013 - 02:17 PM

Before this latest discussion gets nasty with people crossing the line with their comments, let me say a few words that all of us need to adhere to.  I want to remind members that spirited and constructive discussion is welcome on the HTF, but let's remain respectful as I can see this latest round of OAR discussion getting out of hand very quickly.  We've been there and done that, let's not repeat it again.  Please keep your emotions in check by sticking with the facts as we know them.  Personal shots across the bow, gets us nowhere as it degrades the discussion into a cesspool of personal bitterness. 

 

Please, take my warning seriously.  Thank you.

 

 

Well said Robert

I , for the life of me, cannot begin to fathom why a bitter argument would happen over a films aspect ratio...One person says "this", the other person says 'that" ...and while disagreeing is understandable, to take it to cases of insults and vicious arguing is ridiculous (and immature)There are more important things in this world to worry about, and have nothing to do with Fire Maidens of Outer (boredom) Space...or films for that matter :)


Edited by David Steigman, May 30 2013 - 02:18 PM.


#1823 of 2400 OFFLINE   MisterLime

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Posted May 30 2013 - 02:49 PM

A 1.66:1 image on a negative does not automatically equate to a 1.66:1 intended theatrical presentation.

 

While much information on the web is false and based on misinformation, the trades research by Mr. Furmanek and his associates is not just mere speculation. It's actual research with actual period documentation, much of it correcting internal studio misconceptions that are often (but by no means always) based on incorrect traditional assumptions.

 

I don't doubt that Olive & Paramount have good people on top of these matters; it's more a recent discovery in the last few years that in reality those individuals don't have access to the breadth of documentation that has newly been rediscovered.

Really, so you know everyone at Olive and Paramount - So no one at these companies who are involved in hundreds of re-mastering jobs per year know what they're doing, they need to talk to bloggers and get their expert opinions. I'm sorry, but the fact is that the intended ratio for this film is 1.66 and it has nothing to do with the aspect ratio of the negative. As I said before, They've released 1.78 and 1.85 versions of many titles that had negatives of 1.37 because the intended ratio was different. I guess they flip a coin and decide if it'll be 1.37 or 1.78 and take it from there. Also, these are the same non-film people who acquired these films for release.



#1824 of 2400 OFFLINE   Doug Bull

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Posted May 30 2013 - 02:59 PM

"Blowing Wild" has always been a favourite of mine.

Especially the rousing Dimitri Tiomkin score and the title song sung by Frankie Laine.  



#1825 of 2400 OFFLINE   John Hodson

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Posted May 30 2013 - 02:59 PM

Oh dear...
So many films, so little time...
Film Journal Blog
Lt. Col. Thursday: Beaufort; no preliminary nonsense with him, no ceremonial phrasing. Straight from the shoulder as I tell you, do you hear me? They're recalcitrant swine and they must feel it...


#1826 of 2400 OFFLINE   EddieLarkin

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Posted May 30 2013 - 03:02 PM

Okay, do you perhaps know the reasons as to why HELL'S HALF ACRE, THE ATOMIC KID and JOHNNY GUITAR ended up 1.37:1? I don't mean the subjective views of people at Olive and Paramount regarding how the films look at various ratios, but actual objective documentation. What documents or other objective evidence led them to believe the films were composed to 1.37:1?

 

Because in the case of all three films, production started after Republic made the studio wide change to widescreen shooting. Later, the trades instructed exhibitors to matte the screens to a wide ratio. All of this evidence is freely available here:

 

http://www.hometheat...ratio-research/

 

So what evidence do Olive or Paramount have that contradicts it?



#1827 of 2400 OFFLINE   John Morgan

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Posted May 30 2013 - 03:10 PM

Blu-ray.com has the cover art for Olive's upcoming blu ray of FIRE MAIDENS OF OUTER SPACE at a 1.75:1 ratio. I have been waiting for this corn-popper. The release date is July 30,



#1828 of 2400 OFFLINE   Brandon Conway

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Posted May 30 2013 - 03:54 PM

Really, so you know everyone at Olive and Paramount - So no one at these companies who are involved in hundreds of re-mastering jobs per year know what they're doing, they need to talk to bloggers and get their expert opinions. I'm sorry, but the fact is that the intended ratio for this film is 1.66 and it has nothing to do with the aspect ratio of the negative. As I said before, They've released 1.78 and 1.85 versions of many titles that had negatives of 1.37 because the intended ratio was different. I guess they flip a coin and decide if it'll be 1.37 or 1.78 and take it from there. Also, these are the same non-film people who acquired these films for release.

 

MisterLime, I implied none of the negative spin you are attributing to my statement. Olive & Paramount have done some quality work - no one is denying this. It's also true that many studio releases for this period have been incorrectly released open matte in the past, in particular DVD from the releases from the 2000s. Dial M for Murder is a specific example that can be pointed to: open matte on DVD, properly widescreen on the Blu-ray. Per Mr. Furmanek, his research of period documentation assisted Warner in discovering where their prior documentation was faulty. This isn't said to blame anyone at Warner from ~10 years ago (far from it - they've been doing great work for longer than that!), but only to say that their breadth of information was limited at the time and has since been expanded upon.

 

As for myself, I'm no rookie in regards to the home video industry from a professional angle. I've been part of the industry for nearly a decade.

 

As for Mr. Furmanek's credentials, he can speak for himself quite well as being anything but a mere blogger.


Edited by Brandon Conway, May 30 2013 - 05:13 PM.

"And now the reprimand, from an American critic. He reproaches me for using film as a sacred & lasting medium, like a painting or a book. He does not believe that filmmaking is an inferior art, but he believes, and quite rightly, that a reel goes quickly, that the public are looking above all for relaxation, that film is fragile and that it is pretentious to express the power of one's soul by such ephemeral and delicate means, that Charlie Chaplin's or Buster Keaton's first films can only be seen on very rare and badly spoiled prints. I add that the cinema is making daily progress and that eventually films that we consider marvelous today will soon be forgotten because of new dimensions & colour. This is true. But for 4 weeks this film [The Blood of a Poet] has been shown to audiences that have been so attentive, so eager & so warm, that I wonder after all there is not an anonymous public who are looking for more than relaxation in the cinema." - Jean Cocteau, 1932


#1829 of 2400 ONLINE   Bob Furmanek

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Posted May 30 2013 - 04:01 PM

Wow, the condescending attitude is quite surprising and a bit disappointing.

 

I guess they have not seen this article: http://www.3dfilmarc...n-documentation

 

FIRE MAIDENS is composed for 1.75:1 and protected for 1.66:1.

 

In short: 1.75:1 is the correct ratio.


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#1830 of 2400 OFFLINE   Thomas T

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Posted May 30 2013 - 04:14 PM

Here we go again indeed! Representatives from Warners and Fox used to contribute and interact with the HTF until contentious posters rendered their time here unpleasant and they simply stopped posting to the HTF's detriment.

 

Mr. Lime has taken his time to provide us with information regarding Olive's schedule and newest releases. It would be a pity if a certain badgering segment caused him to throw in the towel too.

 

With all due respect to both Mr. Furmanek and Mr. Lime, determining the intended aspect ratio for a near 60 year old film (1.66, 1.78, 1.85) can be difficult and I doubt a definitive answer is possible. One can only hope that everyone does the best they can with the information they have at hand and call me a philistine but while putting up with a P&S transfer for a Scope film is infuriating, I'm not going to lose sleep over the difference between a 1.66 and a 1.78 ratio or a film shot 1.37 but with the possible intention of masking it at a later date.

 

Bottom line: I'm grateful to have Hell's Half Acre on DVD and it looks just fine to me the way it is.



#1831 of 2400 OFFLINE   EddieLarkin

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Posted May 30 2013 - 04:26 PM

The intention to matte was a definite one. It's great that you won't lose any sleep over a widescreen film being presented open matte, but we are dealing with facts here. There are a few films where the aspect ratio is debatable; HELL'S HALF ACRE isn't one of them, nor are THE ATOMIC KID or JOHNNY GUITAR. Their presentation by Olive is the result of misinformation, not a difference in opinion.


Edited by EddieLarkin, May 30 2013 - 04:30 PM.


#1832 of 2400 ONLINE   Bob Furmanek

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Posted May 30 2013 - 04:33 PM

Republic, as a matter of studio policy, converted to 100% widescreen cinematography on May 15, 1953.

 

They were the last studio to announce their new widescreen policy to exhibitors. They did so by placing a full-page ad in the trades on August 1, 1953.


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#1833 of 2400 ONLINE   revgen

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Posted May 30 2013 - 04:42 PM

 If you watch JG, you'll see the actor's heads are sometimes touching the top of the frame and releasing it at 1.78 would've cropped off the tops of some key images and you see much more in the 1.37 version.

 

Republic Studios' house ratio at the time of Johnny Guitar's production and release was 1.66. Not 1.78. So cropping it at 1.78 would've cropped out key elements.


Edited by revgen, May 30 2013 - 04:46 PM.


#1834 of 2400 ONLINE   Bob Furmanek

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Posted May 30 2013 - 05:35 PM

*
POPULAR

I've worked in the industry since 1980. I'm a published author, film preservationist, award-winning producer and 3-D historian.

 

My credentials: http://www.hometheat...3-d-consultant/

 

I reached out to Olive on behalf of my long-time friend Jerry Lewis when they first released some of his Paramount films on Blu-ray.

 

I never got a reply...


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#1835 of 2400 OFFLINE   bgart13

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Posted May 30 2013 - 08:53 PM

Wow, Bob! Who knew that doing research and working with major film distributors would garner you the title of blogger? Cool! Be sure to add that to your resume!

#1836 of 2400 OFFLINE   David Steigman

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Posted May 30 2013 - 08:58 PM

Think we can move on now to something else now besides aspect ratio wars :D ?...

I really dont want to see Misterlime not post upcoming releases...


Edited by David Steigman, May 30 2013 - 08:59 PM.


#1837 of 2400 OFFLINE   bujaki

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Posted May 30 2013 - 09:10 PM

As a graduate student in the field of comparative literature, I had to conduct a lot of research. I believe in well-conducted research and research-based findings. Therefore, because of his impeccable credentials, I place a lot of stock in Mr. Furmanek's findings. I take these into consideration when making purchases. I have passed on a number of releases because they were, according to his research, released in a compromised aspect ratio. I shall continue to read his comments and will base my future purchases on his scholarship.



#1838 of 2400 OFFLINE   Keith Cobby

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Posted May 30 2013 - 11:51 PM

I think Olive are doing a great job in releasing many films for the first time on DVD/blu-ray.

 

Are there any more VistaVision films in the blu-ray pipeline?



#1839 of 2400 OFFLINE   Robert Crawford

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Posted May 31 2013 - 01:36 AM

Think we can move on now to something else now besides aspect ratio wars :D ?...

I really dont want to see Misterlime not post upcoming releases...

Dave,

 

I agree, the OAR points have been made here with some noted disagreement between MisterLime and some posters.  Bob has posted his credentials in regard to his film expertise.  Now, it's up to Olive to either contact Bob or they don't contact him.  Without question Bob is one of this forum's most valued resources.  Not only that, but he's a nice guy.  With that said, MisterLime has provided valuable upcoming release information.  I don't see a need to brow beat the matter any further as most companies do what they please anyway as we've seen so many times beforehand with these studios and the companies they contract out to release their video products.  I'm not saying people can't post their OAR comments any longer, but I wouldn't expect a continue dialogue that might result in people leaving the forum.  I don't think any of us want that.


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#1840 of 2400 OFFLINE   Robert Crawford

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Posted May 31 2013 - 01:39 AM

I think Olive are doing a great job in releasing many films for the first time on DVD/blu-ray.

 

Are there any more VistaVision films in the blu-ray pipeline?

That is true for the most part. 


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