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Last of the Mohicans - Different Releases


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14 replies to this topic

#1 of 15 OFFLINE   Currie

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Posted September 18 2009 - 01:42 PM

I haven't seen any discussion of this topic in a number of years but I just recently became interested in it.  I am looking for the original theater edition; this is NOT the one with the patronizing speech by Russell Means at the end.  I have been told that it was only available on DVD in a "Region 4" edition.  I don't understand regions as applied to DVD players but I would very much like to own the original theater edition.  Can anyone help me?


#2 of 15 OFFLINE   Bob Gu

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Posted September 18 2009 - 03:30 PM

Tricia,amazon.co.uk has the Region 2 edition of the theatrical release on DVD. (It was released by Warner Brothers in the UK) I bought a copy last month.

At amazon.co.uk, today, The Last Of The Mohicans theatrical release is on sale for 3.98 pounds and 3.98 pounds shipping which is $13.08 in US currency.

If you are already an amazon.com customer, you just log in with you regular information at the amazon.co.uk site and order as you would normally.

To find out if your DVD player can be hacked with your remote control, put your player's make and model number and the words "Region 0 Hack Unlock Code" into your search engine and you should get some llinks that will give you it's code if one is known.
If you find a code that works, set your player to Region 0. That way the player with play both the Region 2 DVD and your US Region 1 DVDs, with out having to keep switching back and forth.

If you have a DVD player in your computer you can set it to Region 2 from the player's properties menu. But be careful because you can only change regions a few times before it locks on the last region set. 

The original Fox US VHS release of the theatrical version is still available from amazon.com resellers. 

#3 of 15 OFFLINE   Richard--W

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Posted September 18 2009 - 04:13 PM

Currie should make every effort to become multi-region ena bled.
The world of cinema opens up when you can play region 2 PAL's that aren't released in the USA.
I have the original theatrical release from the U.K. as well as the re-edit on American DVD.
The re-edit is a better film, but I miss some of the little things that were cut from it.
So I bought both.

There was also a widescreen VHS in the USA that is easily found on ebay and amazon marketplace and quite cheap.
It looks fine, but the DVD's look and sound infinitely better.

Richard


#4 of 15 OFFLINE   Jeff Willis

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Posted September 18 2009 - 05:35 PM

Here's a couple of links to online stores that sell hard-chipped R-free players.  I've used both stores with sucessful results.  I went this route (vs hack-codes) since I wanted one model that doesn't have a hack code (best of my knowledge) available.  The other reason I went with a chipped std player is to avoid, albeit infrequent, possible playback issues with some RCE-encoded movie DVD's in the future.  I also was interested in spec info for the internal PAL/NTSC Converter in the player that I bought from one of the online stores.  Both stores have a lifetime guarantee for the players that cover the internal mod.

One store link is here .  I have found that this site has good customer communications, ie, e-mail replies with specific technical info that I was wanting before the purchase.

Another store is here .  I bought my 1st R-free player from this store.  My experience was that this site didn't have the best customer communication at the time I used them but they are probably improved since then.  That was a few years ago.

Something that you might want to check in the event you aren't able to hack your present player: Most, but not all, std DVD players include an internal PAL/NTSC Converter so once they're hacked, you're good to go.  If your player is a Sony, most of the earlier models sold in the U.S. didn't have the converter inside them so you couldn't playback any PAL DVD's on an NTSC TV regardless of a sucessful hack.  Sony's are reputed to be one of the more difficult (std) players to hack with codes.  Phillips brands are one of the easiest to hack.

Blu-rays with the internal mod have recently become more available.  I've been looking at those lately.

For maps of both std & Blu-ray player region code maps, a good site is here .  This page also has a good expl of the frame rate diffrences between PAL & NTSC and why it needs to be considered with the newer HDMI TV displays.

Hope this info helps. 

Back on-topic: I have the "Directors Expanded Ed (2001)" R1 release.  I bought it for an anamorphic release before realizing that the R2 version had been released in the UK.  However, I'm not familiar enough with the film to identify the differences between the one that I currently have vs the original theatrical version.  I'm thinking about the R2 UK version but not sure what I'd get with that one vs the one that I have now.

One thing I thought I remembered after realizing that the US release was not the original theatrical version, was something that I read on an Amazon review.  The reviewer mentiond this in his review:

Quote=excerpt from an Amazon review:
and with my favorite line back in -- "My father warned me about people like you. He said do not try to understand them, and do not try to make them understand you." 
 

 II might be mistaken, but I thought that this dialog was also included in the US ('01) release.  Maybe not but I sure seem to remember that line when Daniel-Day-Lewis was talking to Madeline Stowe in that forest scene.

ml1fyo.jpg  "Checkmate King Two, 'Out'" "Combat! A Selmur Production"

 

TV/DVD Collector, mainly 50's thru 90's with a few 2000+ shows.
My 2 all-time favorite TV shows:
"Combat!" & "The Fugitive"
My 2 all-time best blind-buys: "The Fugitive"   "The Donna Reed Show"


#5 of 15 OFFLINE   James Luckard

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Posted September 18 2009 - 06:19 PM


Originally Posted by Jeff Willis 

One thing I thought I remembered after realizing that the US release was not the original theatrical version, was something that I read on an Amazon review.  The reviewer mentiond this in his review:

Quote=excerpt from an Amazon review:

and with my favorite line back in -- "My father warned me about people like you. He said do not try to understand them, and do not try to make them understand you." 

 II might be mistaken, but I thought that this dialog was also included in the US ('01) release.  Maybe not but I sure seem to remember that line when Daniel-Day-Lewis was talking to Madeline Stowe in that forest scene.

That Amazon reviewer is me. I only watched the recut DVD that I bought once before I sold it, so I suppose it's possible I was just so horrified by all the other changes that I was wrong about that quote, but I'm 99.99% sure that particular line was cut out of the fence dialogue scene in the "Director's Expanded Edition".

The line is featured prominently in the trailer as well, perhaps that's where you remember it from.


#6 of 15 OFFLINE   Jeff Willis

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Posted September 18 2009 - 11:21 PM

James,

Thanks for the info.  My memory's probably out of order on that line; it's most likely not in the "dir exp ed" that I have.

What are the main diffrences between the 2 releases?  I don't mind double-dipping on this one for the R2 if there's enough of a reason, bearing in mind that I don't know this film like I do others in my collection.

Just to check me out, is the correct link to the Amazon UK R2 release here

I noticed that at EZDVD in Australia, there is a note on the R4 version page that says:

"Please note: This is not the theatrical version."

I guess this is the same as the "dir exp ed" that I have but the box cover doesn't indicate that as mine does. 

Am I glad that I went "region-free" a few years ago   Best DVD player purchase that I made....have been able to enjoy several TV/DVD releases and movies from R2/4.

ml1fyo.jpg  "Checkmate King Two, 'Out'" "Combat! A Selmur Production"

 

TV/DVD Collector, mainly 50's thru 90's with a few 2000+ shows.
My 2 all-time favorite TV shows:
"Combat!" & "The Fugitive"
My 2 all-time best blind-buys: "The Fugitive"   "The Donna Reed Show"


#7 of 15 OFFLINE   Bob Cashill

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Posted September 19 2009 - 12:48 AM

I still have my theatrical cut laserdisc. 

#8 of 15 OFFLINE   Bob Gu

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Posted September 19 2009 - 02:32 AM

Yes, Jeff, you have posted the correct amazon.co.uk link for the theatrical release.

There are  discussions of the changes in the director's cut vs the theatrical releases at IMDB, amazon US and UK and probably at HTF somewhere.

The two biggest changes were the removal of a song called "I WIll Find You", and the extra speech,  Tricia mentions in post number one.  There are other deletions and some added scenes. 

I may get the Director's edtion soon as it has come way down at amazon, $9.99,(deepdiscount has sold out on it). (I am kind of a "Last Of The Mohicans" film buff and recently even purchased the two Steve Forest TV Last Of The Mohicans movies, which were released on dodgy LP VHS.  The second Forest movie "The Pathfinder" even featured young Madeline Stowe in the cast, although her voice was dubbed by Anne Lockhart.) 

The full screen version that was on ABC TV had some of the addtional scenes and monkeyed with the sound effects and action scenes to make them less intense.

#9 of 15 OFFLINE   James Luckard

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Posted September 20 2009 - 10:48 AM

The two biggest differences are mentioned by Bob - a clumsy, overly-literal monologue about the plight of the Indians by Russell Means is inserted into the final mountaintop scene which, to my mind, decreases its impact immeasurably. - the Clannad song "I Will Find You" is removed from the film. It appears in the film first during a travelling montage, when Cora and her sister have been taken and Day-Lewis tracks them. As I remember, it is replaced in the new version with score. It plays again over the end credits. Here, nothing is put in to replace it, leaving dead silence for a couple of minutes. The deletion of this pop song seems to lead into my next point: - throughout the film, a number of more Hollywood-style lines are removed (one-liners and the like). This seems to reflect Mann's style shifting from mainstream crowd-pleasing to more personal, quasi-arthouse. This means that my line mentioned above is gone, also excised is Day-Lewis's line "Someday I think you and I are going to have a serious disagreement", and many more. - the entire film has been almost completely re-edited. You'll only notice this if you're really familiar with the old version, as I am, but there's hardly a scene that's not touched. Lines come and go, shots are exchanged, added and deleted. There are one or two entirely new scenes, but mostly Mann went into the film and fiddled with the details. It becomes maddening if you know the old version. As I remember, from my one viewing of the thing, you could sometimes even pick out the new material and changes because the new bits didn't match the quality of the finished film. He did the same thing with "Manhunter". His "Director's Cut" has some scenes where the new material he wanted to put in was only found on videotape, so you'll have dialogue scenes where you cut back and forth between one person in pristine quality 35mm film and the other in fuzzy, desaturated 1980s videotape. Someone really needs to take away the man's scissors.

#10 of 15 OFFLINE   Walter Kittel

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Posted September 20 2009 - 11:12 AM

The region 1 director's cut of Last of the Mohicans on DVD is probably the most disappointing release of a favorite film in my collection.  I fell in love with the theatrical version instantly upon first viewing and the new cut simply does not represent that experience.

I can tolerate most of the changes, but the new soliloquy at the finale completely undermines the film.  The spare elegance of the original dialog is replaced by a ham fisted speech that dumbs down the ending to a degree that I would have not thought possible.  Could the new speech be any more obvious and lacking in subtlety?  I doubt it.  It is just a horrible way to conclude the film.

I sincerely hope that when this film makes it way to Blu-ray that the theatrical cut is made available.

- Walter.
Fidelity to the source should always be the goal for Blu-ray releases.

#11 of 15 OFFLINE   Jeff Willis

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Posted September 20 2009 - 04:16 PM

Guys,

Thanks for the info.  It looks like I'll include that R2 version in my next order from Amazon UK.

ml1fyo.jpg  "Checkmate King Two, 'Out'" "Combat! A Selmur Production"

 

TV/DVD Collector, mainly 50's thru 90's with a few 2000+ shows.
My 2 all-time favorite TV shows:
"Combat!" & "The Fugitive"
My 2 all-time best blind-buys: "The Fugitive"   "The Donna Reed Show"


#12 of 15 ONLINE   David_B_K

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Posted September 21 2009 - 04:02 AM

I only watch the R2 Theatrical version. I think there was a R1 version, but it was horrible quality and non-anamorphic, so avoid it. The thing I hated most about the re-edit was:

the death of Magua. In the original, Chingachgook spins around and that weapon of his actually goes through Magua with great force. In the DC, that shot has been removed, and replaced with a  slow-motion version of Magua reacting to the blow. I think the audience cheered when the weapon went through Magua when I saw it in the theater.





#13 of 15 OFFLINE   Jeff Willis

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Posted September 21 2009 - 09:42 AM



Originally Posted by David_B_K 

I only watch the R2 Theatrical version. I think there was a R1 version, but it was horrible quality and non-anamorphic, so avoid it. The thing I hated most about the re-edit was:

the death of Magua. In the original, Chingachgook spins around and that weapon of his actually goes through Magua with great force. In the DC, that shot has been removed, and replaced with a  slow-motion version of Magua reacting to the blow. I think the audience cheered when the weapon went through Magua when I saw it in the theater.


 

Thanks for the info.

I think the orignal R1 release was non-anamorphic and the dir expanded ed is anamorphic.  I got that one to get the anamorphic upgrade but forgot to check for an R2 release first. 

ml1fyo.jpg  "Checkmate King Two, 'Out'" "Combat! A Selmur Production"

 

TV/DVD Collector, mainly 50's thru 90's with a few 2000+ shows.
My 2 all-time favorite TV shows:
"Combat!" & "The Fugitive"
My 2 all-time best blind-buys: "The Fugitive"   "The Donna Reed Show"


#14 of 15 OFFLINE   James Luckard

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Posted September 21 2009 - 08:14 PM

I think the orignal R1 release was non-anamorphic and the dir expanded ed is anamorphic.  I got that one to get the anamorphic upgrade but forgot to check for an R2 release first. 
The original 1999 R1 release was non-anamorphic, but it was also the "Director's Expanded Edition". The DVD currently on the market is just a remastered anamorphic version of it. The theatrical cut has been unavailable in the US since the days of laserdisc and VHS. By the way, the reason for the two versions both being on DVD, as I explain in my Amazon review, is that the film was produced by Morgan Creek and released by different studios in different territories. In the US, and some other countries, it was a Fox film. They chose to allow Mann to reedit the film for DVD and released his new cut in Fall 1999, to coincide with the release of THE INSIDER in theaters. Warner Bros has the rights in much of the rest of the world, including the UK. They chose to simply release the original theatrical cut.

#15 of 15 OFFLINE   Jeff Willis

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Posted September 22 2009 - 06:02 AM

James,

Thanks for the info on this.  I knew my R-free player would be useful

ml1fyo.jpg  "Checkmate King Two, 'Out'" "Combat! A Selmur Production"

 

TV/DVD Collector, mainly 50's thru 90's with a few 2000+ shows.
My 2 all-time favorite TV shows:
"Combat!" & "The Fugitive"
My 2 all-time best blind-buys: "The Fugitive"   "The Donna Reed Show"





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