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Gladiator Blu-ray - release date 09/01/2009 - Read before buying!


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#1 of 130 OFFLINE   Sergio

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Posted August 26 2009 - 08:03 AM

Hello,

For a long time I do not post in this forum and I hope everybody is fine. I only have one advise to give, the Blu-ray quality of this title (Gladiator, 2000) is from another world, do not buy until paramount fix the problems with the transfer.

Regards,


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#2 of 130 OFFLINE   Greg_M

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Posted August 26 2009 - 08:28 AM



"ATTENTION WALMART SHOPPERS"

"Now hear this"

#3 of 130 OFFLINE   Jeff Robertson

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Posted August 26 2009 - 08:47 AM

Wouldn't it be something if word of mouth got out on this and the public was convinced to hold back on purchasing? Maybe Paramount/Dreamworks/Universal would think twice before releasing new hi-def from old masters.

If we can't rely them giving us consistent quality at this stage in the game, I have no faith in future releases. I hope Galaxy Quest turns out well.




#4 of 130 OFFLINE   Brandon Conway

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Posted August 26 2009 - 09:08 AM

I think you vastly over-estimate the power of the internet screenshot analyst minority. Most people will see Gladiator on Blu-ray, and if they like the movie they'll buy it, and they'll never worry about it, and think it looks great.

Of course, from what I can tell (granted, with severe limitations) from the DVD Beaver screengrabs, this is hardly a horror-show. Imperfect? Sure. Unpleasing to the most disciplining eyes? Probably.Gonna be seen by the general public as "Awesome!", with only the tiniest of the internet minority saying otherwise? Certainly.

"And now the reprimand, from an American critic. He reproaches me for using film as a sacred & lasting medium, like a painting or a book. He does not believe that filmmaking is an inferior art, but he believes, and quite rightly, that a reel goes quickly, that the public are looking above all for relaxation, that film is fragile and that it is pretentious to express the power of one's soul by such ephemeral and delicate means, that Charlie Chaplin's or Buster Keaton's first films can only be seen on very rare and badly spoiled prints. I add that the cinema is making daily progress and that eventually films that we consider marvelous today will soon be forgotten because of new dimensions & colour. This is true. But for 4 weeks this film [The Blood of a Poet] has been shown to audiences that have been so attentive, so eager & so warm, that I wonder after all there is not an anonymous public who are looking for more than relaxation in the cinema." - Jean Cocteau, 1932


#5 of 130 OFFLINE   Jeff Robertson

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Posted August 26 2009 - 11:08 AM


True. Just wishful thinking on my part.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Conway 

I think you vastly over-estimate the power of the internet screenshot analyst minority. Most people will see Gladiator on Blu-ray, and if they like the movie they'll buy it, and they'll never worry about it, and think it looks great.

Of course, from what I can tell (granted, with severe limitations) from the DVD Beaver screengrabs, this is hardly a horror-show. Imperfect? Sure. Unpleasing to the most disciplining eyes? Probably.Gonna be seen by the general public as "Awesome!", with only the tiniest of the internet minority saying otherwise? Certainly.



#6 of 130 OFFLINE   Cassy_w

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Posted August 26 2009 - 12:52 PM

This one looks truly horrid, in regards to DVNR damage. I am just astonished at what' been done. I have it on our DVR and went to the scenes in question and foundno missing/vanished vfx. I'll not canel BRAVEHEART, but I guess my years old DVR recording stays put. How sad.
Death to PG-13! And now death to DVNR too!!

#7 of 130 OFFLINE   David_B_K

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Posted August 26 2009 - 02:39 PM


Quote:
Posted by Brandon Conway: Of course, from what I can tell (granted, with severe limitations) from the DVD Beaver screengrabs, this is hardly a horror-show.

Brandon, the DVD Beaver screen grabs are not that bad. I would probably buy it based on those grabs, for the DTS HD Master audio upgrade alone.

But others who have seen the disc, and have posted screenshots show much more going on. If it were merely a recycled old DVD master (which it is), I could probably take it. However, they apparently ran it through the DNR software for the BD and removed a lot of material that the software apparently interpreted as noise. Not just pores on peoples faces, but substabtial material.

The most talked about DNR transgression is the loss of many of the flaming arrows in the "Hell Unleashed" scene in the opening battle. In the impressive wide tracking shot of the almost entire Roman army, most of the flaming arrows appear to have been erased as noise; an effect similar to the missing rain on the window of Bernstein's office in the WB Citizen Kane DVD.

If, after people buy this disc and it can be confirmed that the arrows (and probably other stuff) is missing from the image, it will be a definite "no sale" for me. I fail to see how one can consider a BD an upgrade if important components of scenes have been erased. If these erasures ore not that egregious, and all this turns out to be hyperbole, I may pick up the disc on sale.

#8 of 130 OFFLINE   Jean-Michel

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Posted August 26 2009 - 06:38 PM

It's not only the arrows:

http://caps-a-holic....iator#vergleich

This is just absurd.

#9 of 130 OFFLINE   Oliver_A

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Posted August 27 2009 - 12:41 AM



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean-Michel 

It's not only the arrows:

http://caps-a-holic....iator#vergleich

This is just absurd.
/img/vbsmilies/htf/smiley_jawdrop.gif/img/vbsmilies/htf/smiley_jawdrop.gif/img/vbsmilies/htf/smiley_jawdrop.gif
Is this for real??? This is so ridiculous. I had Gladiator on my list for a possible purchase. But this abomination is... I... I have no words for it.

Paramounts needs to recall that title immediately, this is unbelievable! /img/vbsmilies/htf/eek.gif



#10 of 130 OFFLINE   Bleddyn Williams

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Posted August 27 2009 - 01:39 AM

I myself am not picking this up, but with Best Buy having both Gladiator & Braveheart for $22.99 each and a $10 rebate if you buy both, I think it'll still end up flying out the doors.

#11 of 130 OFFLINE   BIP

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Posted August 27 2009 - 01:44 AM


Let's see if Paramount has the same discretion as did Sony with regards to The Fifth Element. Because the cleaning here is way beyond what can be expected of a premium catalogue release as this.

cheers


#12 of 130 OFFLINE   Powell&Pressburger

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Posted August 27 2009 - 03:23 AM

I wonder if this is more of a DREAMWORKS issue than a PARAMOUNT one. Of all the Paramouont BDs I own I can't say they did this kid of work on them at all.

I bet anythign DREAMWORKS has a say and delievers the transfers etc or at least has their say.

Regardless it makes the moniker of Saphire Collection sort of tacky... you give the film great disc space etc and then spend money on ruining the transfer so the ignorant buyers out there who don't have any idea believe it looks clear and clean. (I say ignorant not as making fun, but for what some are over BD transfers regarding grain and texture because they are not educated on the issue)

I am sure the titles will sell well... my question is .... How is Braveheart which is fully a Paramount title... if it has no issues I would almost guess Gladiator = Dreamworks and it is a shame because I don't think Ridley Scott would be proud of the transfer. Let's hope FOX and Scott do ALIEN correctly.


Stop the Replacing of original Studio Opening / Closing logos! They are part of film history.

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#13 of 130 OFFLINE   Brandon Conway

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Posted August 27 2009 - 03:51 AM



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean-Michel 

It's not only the arrows:

http://caps-a-holic....iator#vergleich

This is just absurd.
OK, now THAT kind of stuff is unacceptable. I see the "Kane rain" comparisons. This is actually worse than that from the pictures I'm now seeing.


"And now the reprimand, from an American critic. He reproaches me for using film as a sacred & lasting medium, like a painting or a book. He does not believe that filmmaking is an inferior art, but he believes, and quite rightly, that a reel goes quickly, that the public are looking above all for relaxation, that film is fragile and that it is pretentious to express the power of one's soul by such ephemeral and delicate means, that Charlie Chaplin's or Buster Keaton's first films can only be seen on very rare and badly spoiled prints. I add that the cinema is making daily progress and that eventually films that we consider marvelous today will soon be forgotten because of new dimensions & colour. This is true. But for 4 weeks this film [The Blood of a Poet] has been shown to audiences that have been so attentive, so eager & so warm, that I wonder after all there is not an anonymous public who are looking for more than relaxation in the cinema." - Jean Cocteau, 1932


#14 of 130 OFFLINE   ahollis

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Posted August 27 2009 - 04:13 AM

I am not sure how much Dreamworks can say about their films made before September 2005.  Dreamworks sold all films to Viacom (Paramount) in Feb of 2006 in turn Paramount sold controlling interest in the Dreamworks live action film Library to Strategic Partners and Dune Entertainment II in March 2006.  This sale allowed Paramount to keep worldwide distribution of the films, sequel and re-make rights.  I understand that the video rights went to the investment firm with Paramount keeping the video distribution.  It might not be Dreamworks' or Paramount's fault that the transfer is so terrible. 
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#15 of 130 OFFLINE   Fabian Kusch

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Posted August 27 2009 - 04:17 AM

Someone here in Germany created two .gifs comapring the Blu-Ray to an HDTV version of that movie.

What you see is one of the catapults shooting a fireball - it's been deleted by automatic video mastering tools for most of it's screen time:


http://forum.cinefac...75-post216.html



#16 of 130 OFFLINE   Fabian Kusch

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Posted August 27 2009 - 04:25 AM



Quote:
Originally Posted by ahollis View Post

It might not be Dreamworks' or Paramount's fault that the transfer is so terrible. 

Actually, it's Universal's fault.

They own the movie outside of US territories and did all the mastering and prep on GLADIATOR (Jeff Kleist, The Digital Bits).

By the way, has Ridley Scott already reacted to this mess. He's said to be a perfectionist. I can't imagine he likes to see his hard work altered by automatic video mastering tools...

#17 of 130 OFFLINE   Powell&Pressburger

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Posted August 27 2009 - 04:28 AM

This is a huge mess .... I know others have said this too... but do these suits ever look over the transfers? Do they even like film? 

Stop the Replacing of original Studio Opening / Closing logos! They are part of film history.

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#18 of 130 OFFLINE   David_B_K

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Posted August 27 2009 - 04:34 AM


Quote:
Posted by Fabian KuschWhat you see is one of the catapults shooting a fireball - it's been deleted by automatic video mastering tools for most of it's screen time.

Those .gifs are small, but if you look closely, you can also see the flaming arrows in the top .gif and not see them in the bottom one. This .gif shows the loss of both the fireballs and arrows.

How anybody can consider this BD an upgrade over the DVD is baffling to me.


#19 of 130 OFFLINE   Sanjay Gupta

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Posted August 27 2009 - 05:45 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean-Michel View Post

It's not only the arrows:

http://caps-a-holic....iator#vergleich

This is just absurd.
Absurd is quite an understatement. Whoever is responsible for this should not only be embarassed but probably ought to loose their job over this. If Paramount is going to treat potentially huge selling titles such as this so poorly one can only imagine what to expect from them for other catalog titles. If I were Ridley Scott, I would be really pissed with the way Paramount/Dreamworks have treated my baby.

Bottom line: This Blu-ray needs to be recalled immediately and Paramount/Dreamworks ought to work on a new release from scratch.


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#20 of 130 OFFLINE   Brent M

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Posted August 27 2009 - 07:05 AM



Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabian Kusch 

Someone here in Germany created two .gifs comapring the Blu-Ray to an HDTV version of that movie.

What you see is one of the catapults shooting a fireball - it's been deleted by automatic video mastering tools for most of it's screen time:


http://forum.cinefac...75-post216.html

If that isn't enough to warrant a recall I don't know what is. Someone from Paramount or Dreamworks(whoever is responsible) needs to fall on their sword and admit this release is f***ed big time. If Warner allows an exchange for The Matrix Revolutions which was only screwed up for like three frames in a barely noticeable sequence it's more than warranted for this release.

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