Symphonic Metal - Dutch (2 Viewers)

Jason Kirkpatri · Feb 10, 2009

Taken from the tribute to brunettes thread.

Sounds like Dutch would be up my alley, but I have not listened to Dutch, Epica, Sirenia, or After Forever.

Currently listening to Amon Amarth (great band), Callenish Circle (too bad they broke up) and Sienbenburgen (their comeback album isn't the greatest). Tristania is a great band and I'm interested to see what they can do with their new singer.

Any thoughts you can provide would be much appreciated, Don. Don't post too much here during the day, so might not get back to this until tonight.

Originally Posted by Don Giro:

"VERY similar to Nightwish, but I like WT better. Sharon doesn't give off any "diva" vibe like Tarja did in Nightwish. WT are a bit heavier, too. I HIGHLY recommend the "Black Symphony" CD/DVD. The US release only has half the concert on the CD, but the DVD half has the whole show, and, OH, what a show it is...I can't WAIT for the import Blu-Ray.

Check out that link in my last post, it's one of my all-time favorite songs (I have some lyrics in my sig).

Put it this way, I listened to Nightwish's "End of an Era" CDs CONSTANTLY over the last six months. Now I listen to "Black Symphony" over and over...

Maybe we should move this to the music thread, because something tells me that you don't know about Epica, Sirenia, and After Forever, either."

Don Giro · Feb 10, 2009

Jason, the band is called Within Temptation. Their nationality is Dutch...they're from Holland :laugh:

! A few songs on their last studio album "The Heart of Everything" veer into Evanescence territory, but Within Temptation's first album came out three years before them.
Sharon from Within Temptation may not have as great a voice as Tarja (ex-Nightwish) but whereas Tarja NEVER lets you forget she's a soprano, Sharon has a better range, as songs like "Hand of Sorrow" will attest. Sharon may be a soprano, but she can sing lower octaves as well.
Also, Tarja came off as rather "icy" in her personality while in Nightwish (the kind of singer who leaves the venue immediately after the lights come up), Sharon gives off a vibe like she wants to be your girlfriend (though you wouldn't think so from her promo pics).
On the "Black Symphony" DVD, a fan offers Sharon a stuffed frog, but can't reach the stage, so she bends down and says (words to the effect of) "Give it here, before I sing! C'mon, C'mon, C'mon, gimme! Then, with a huge smile on her face, she kisses it and says "I'm kissing a frog!" Tarja would never do anything like that. And from the concert videos I've seen, fans throw stuffed animals at Sharon all the time...
What it all comes down to is you need to buy "Black Symphony" ASAP.
Here's the math:
Great songs + Pink Floyd visuals + 35 piece orchestra + 12 voice choir + fire + steam + confetti cannons + lights + people on stilts + Sharon den Adel + 5.1 Surround Sound - diva attitude + 10,000 screaming fans + crying teenagers = 1 spectacular event.
OH, how I wish I had been there.
I can't understand why they aren't huge here, especially since the last Evanescence album wasn't very good.
If I'm not mistaken, Tristania has more male-driven, death metal-ish vocals, so they're not really like WT at all. I prefer Theatre of Tragedy to Tristania.
Epica is female vocal-driven, but there's some male-growling there as well. Sirenia are much more "commercial" than all those bands.

Aaron Silverman · Feb 10, 2009

Within Temptation is excellent. I've been considering paying the premium for the import Black Symphony BD, since it doesn't look like it's actually going to be released in the US.
They're not big here partly because until fairly recently their stuff was only available as imports. Some more domestic releases might increase their US exposure. I'm pretty sure they've played shows here, though.
Then again, a few years ago Nightwish got some press here but it didn't seem to do them much good.

James Lee · Feb 10, 2009

I got the Black Symphony BD import. Cost a pretty penny but worth every bit. Video quality is stunning, as expected. I am a huge WT fan and I think Sharon has an incredible voice. She recently did a track for Armin Van Buuren's latest dance/trance CD, the other genre of music I really like, so the combination of Sharon and trance is like heaven to me. I also love Nightwish, both with Tarja and Anette Olzon. I don't expect either band to ever become famous in the U.S. Metal just doesn't seem to have much of a broad appeal anymore, outside of Metallica.
Some other symphonic metal bands I listen to include:
After Forever- sadly they just announced that the band has broken up. The lead singer, Floor Jansen is another incredible vocal talent. She has the high soprano range of Sharon and Tarja, but also has a power metal voice. The older stuff has the death metal grunting, which I am not a fan of, but Floor's vocals are so good I can tolerate the grunting.
Epica- Another band with grunting, but Simone Simons voice is awesome. Mark Jansen (lead grunter) left After Forever to form Epica.
Sirenia- Just released a new CD, The 13th Floor this month. They have a new lead singer.
Kamelot- Tampa based band who are very popular in Europe. They have a male lead singer and Simone Simons from Epica does some vocals with them. I wasn't as thrilled with their last studio CD, The Ghost Opera, but their old stuff, particularly The Black Halo, is a masterpiece.
Edenbridge- Austrian metal band who has a sound nowhere as dark as stuff like Epica and they have a little more of a pop edge to them.
Visions of Atlantis- Another Austrian metal band similar to Edenbridge.
Elis- More of a gothic metal band from Liechtenstein. After 3 albums, their lead singer passed away from a cerebral hemorrhage. They have a new singer and are going to release a new CD soon.
Xandria- German metal band that has a more mainstream rock sound. They too are about to release a new CD with new lead singer.
Lunatica- Swiss metal band in the same vein as Edenbridge and Visions of Atlantis. They have a new CD coming at the end of this month.
I used to be a big metal fan back in my youth, then fell out of the scene as metal became less and less popular. I got back into it after a friend turned me on to stuff like Symphony X. Just from my own snooping around, I discovered all these symphonic metal bands from Europe and got hooked all over again. There's just some incredible music coming out of Europe and carrying on the metal genre.

Don Giro · Feb 10, 2009

For the record, this thread is a continuation of a conversation resulting from pictures I posted of Sharon den Adel yesterday over on the "Tribute to Brunettes" thread. I needed to show Sharon to the folks at HTF, much as I did with Simone Simons from Epica last year in the "Redheads" thread.
I STILL say Nightwish should have pilfered Simone after they fired Tarja. Don't get me wrong, I'm quite happy with the last Nightwish album, but Anette just doesn't have the right voice for the Tarja stuff. Maybe they should recruit Floor, since she's currently out of work. It also turns out that Anette is now managed separately from the rest of Nightwish, which was one of the issues surrounding Tarja's "departure."
My import "Black Symphony" set just arrived from Holland, and I've got the Blu-Ray coming.. Contrary to what I've read, the bonus concert/special extras disc plays just FINE on my PC. Whether it works in my DVD player or PS3 remains to be seen...I bought this because of the complete concert CDs and the bonus DVD, and it was well worth the $60 it cost me...
The Blu-Ray is supposed to have ASTOUNDING sound. I'll find out soon enough.
Aaron, there's no real "premium" to pay for the BD, I ordered through an Amazon affiliate for $32.99. I'll let you know how it sounds when I get it (and if it's actually the BD that I receive...)
I, too am a fan of After Forever. I'm sorry to hear they've broken up. I like the new Sirenia quite a bit, even if their sound is much more "commercial" than it used to be. I also enjoy Edenbridge and VOA, but I haven't gotten around to Elis, Lunatica, and Xandria yet (but I WILL). And I love Liv Kristine's work with Theatre of Tragedy (but the jury's still out on Leaves' Eyes, though I may pick up their forthcoming DVD if there's a US release).
Oh, yeah, can't forget The Gathering, even though Anneke has gone solo. Her duet with Sharon on "Somehwere" was alone worth the "price of admission."
But I love Within Temptation more than ANY of the aforementioned groups, and that's because they've got "Ice Queen," one of my all-time favorite songs. The "Black Symphony" version is knee-weakening when the horns kick in...
I think one of the reasons Within Temptation won't succeed here is the inevitable comparison to the completely overrated Evanescence ("The Howling" and "What Have You Done?" veer QUITE closely into Evanescence territory). It's hard to convince Americans that all these other bands were well-established in their homelands long before Evanescence dropped "Fallen" on us. It's one of the stumbling blocks Lacuna Coil have had to overcome (to some degree of success), and Lacuna Coil sound NOTHING like Evanescence.
But enough about me...

JohnRice · Feb 10, 2009

That was funny. I was reading that first post thinking "I've never heard of the band Dutch, even though I know all these others." LOL
Regarding Sharon, she is an excellent soprano. Though maybe not as operatic as some of the others mentioned, she more than makes up for it with versatility. She's also nearly as powerful a "rock" singer as Cristina Scabbia and she has great stage presence, plus as was already mentioned, she seems to be very personable and truly appears to enjoy performing.

Don Giro · Feb 11, 2009

Well, my regular DVD player (Toshiba SD8960--I think) had NO trouble playing either DVD. I almost CRIED when the menu came up!
The Bonus DVD is AWESOME! It's got four videos from "The Heart of Everything," a "making of" the videos segment, a COMPLETE concert video of WT in a smaller European venue: less songs, no orchestra, Sharon in the same costumes as "Black Symphony," but just as great! The other difference is Sharon's got straight hair. I've decided that I like her better with curls. She sometimes looks "hotter" with straight hair, but the curly hair adds to the charm. She looks AMAZING in the video for "The Howling." If you weren't familiar with the band, you'd think there were two "frontwomen" in the band.
My favorite bonus (other than the second concert) is the hour-long :"tour diary" of the band traveling throughout the world. It's almost surreal when they go from playing large venues and festivals throughout Europe and Japan, and then seeing them sound-checking in a TINY club in Knoxville, Tennessee. Their bus driver points out the small venue, and the band seem like they just don't care, because they FINALLY got to play in the U.S.
And, of course, Sharon is just adorable throughout. Any notions about her being some sort of "grand dame diva" should be dispelled when you see just how much of a "goof" she seems to be in real life. So's that extremely-intense looking bass player, believe it or not. And Sharon shot about half the tour diary herself. And though we already know that she's not a "tall" woman, you REALLY notice just how small she is.
Do you think I like Within Temptation much?
Now, where's my BD?

Jason Kirkpatri · Feb 11, 2009

Thanks for all the discussions. I don't have much to add as I've never listened to these bands before. Based on my experience with European metal (black, death, sypmphonic, etc), I've currently got these on order for blind purchases:

Within Temptation: The Heart of Everything; The Silent Force; Mother Earth; and Black Symphony

After Forever: After Forever

Epica: Divin Conspiracy

I'll give some feedback once I get them in from Amazon (hopefully next week).

Jason

Don Giro · Feb 11, 2009

Jason: All great choices. You ordered the ENTIRE Within Tempation catalog, with the exception of the debut "Enter," which I never really got into. And you'll get to experience the "Black Symphony" DVD.
"The Divine Conspiracy" is a great way to dive into Epica...if you like Tristania, you're going to LOVE Epica...
Seeing that my DVD player has no trouble with region-free PAL discs, I just ordered WT's "Silent Force Tour" DVD. I'd seen a crappy "DVD-Rip" a while back, but soon the DVD will be mine! MINE!

James Lee · Feb 11, 2009

I have the Silent Force Tour DVD. Video is not anywhere as good in quality as Black Symphony, but holy cow the concert itself was incredible.

Ron-P · Feb 12, 2009

Jason Kirkpatri said:
Thanks for all the discussions. I don't have much to add as I've never listened to these bands before. Based on my experience with European metal (black, death, sypmphonic, etc), I've currently got these on order for blind purchases:
Within Temptation: The Heart of Everything; The Silent Force; Mother Earth; and Black Symphony
After Forever: After Forever
Epica: Divin Conspiracy
I'll give some feedback once I get them in from Amazon (hopefully next week).
Jason

Jason, where did you order these from? I just caught, by accident, a post in the AH Lounge on Epica, and after a bunch of YouTube watching I bought one of their albums off iTunes.

Don Giro · Feb 12, 2009

Jason, where did you order these from?

They're ALL available on Amazon...
Simone's HOT, isn't she?
Everyone:
I just thought of a hypothetical situation that really cheesed me off, because I'm probably right on the money with this one:
Imagine, if you will, Within Temptation's "The Heart of Everything" CD falling into the hands of the people who handle the affairs of some useless diva (Celine Dion IMMEDIATELY springs to mind). I can see these people saying "Wow, there are at LEAST three songs on this album by this unheard-of band that we can water down for Ms. Dion to poison the masses with" (The songs I'm think of are "Forgiven," "Frozen," and especially "All I Need.")
I don't know how the music copyright laws work anymore, but I seem to remember that while you can't PARODY someone's songs without the artist's permission, you can sing ANYONE'S songs as long as you're willing to pay royalties.
Okay, for brevity's sake, lets say Celine gets a hold of the aforementioned songs through legal avenues (buying rights from Sharon and Co.). I am utterly CONVINCED those songs would be HUGE, and teenage girls (and their moms) would lose their MINDS over them. Meanwhile, WT can't find ANY real "footing" in America.
Doesn't sound too far-fetched now, does it?

Click to expand...

Ron-P · Feb 12, 2009

Thanks Don, and yes, Simone's is gorgeous.

Jason Kirkpatri · Feb 12, 2009

Hi Ron. Yes, I did order all of these off of Amazon. Most of my stuff I order from Amazon due to limited availability of the music I listen to at my local stores. Stuff like Dimmu Borgir, Amon Amarth, Nightwish, Siebengurgen, Trail of Tears, etc, etc.

That's Amazon.ca as I'm up here in Canada. Should be just as accessible with the .com site as well.

Jason

Aaron Silverman · Feb 13, 2009

Don Giro said:
I also enjoy Edenbridge

I could listen to Arcana over and over and over again. The Grand Design is great too (and the bonus cover of "For Your Eyes Only" is a real hoot!). I emailed Lanvall last year and he told me that if they put out a concert video there'll be an NTSC version for us Amerikaners. Here's hopin'!
BTW, Edenbridge's website lists a new live album that they're only selling via their website. Also, the bass player quit and they're taking applications for a replacement. Anybody?

Don Giro · Feb 13, 2009

I created myself a Within Temptation "station" on Pandora last night. One of the songs that came up was "Senses Capture" by Leaves Eyes, off their "Elegy" EP. I ordered it immediately.
The "station" also re-acquainted me with Sirenia (not the new one), so I've been listening to them all day...
EDIT: Aaron, apparently we were posting at the same time. I'll post redheaded Sharon if I can find pictures of her with red hair! But I DID find a picture of the new Sirenia vocalist, and she looks quite fetching (there are better photos of her in that black corset on their website, but I couldn't link to them):

Aaron Silverman · Feb 13, 2009

Don Giro said:
Everyone:
I just thought of a hypothetical situation that really cheesed me off, because I'm probably right on the money with this one:
Imagine, if you will, Within Temptation's "The Heart of Everything" CD falling into the hands of the people who handle the affairs of some useless diva (Celine Dion IMMEDIATELY springs to mind). I can see these people saying "Wow, there are at LEAST three songs on this album by this unheard-of band that we can water down for Ms. Dion to poison the masses with" (The songs I'm think of are "Forgiven," "Frozen," and especially "All I Need.")
I don't know how the music copyright laws work anymore, but I seem to remember that while you can't PARODY someone's songs without the artist's permission, you can sing ANYONE'S songs as long as you're willing to pay royalties.
Okay, for brevity's sake, lets say Celine gets a hold of the aforementioned songs through legal avenues (buying rights from Sharon and Co.). I am utterly CONVINCED those songs would be HUGE, and teenage girls (and their moms) would lose their MINDS over them. Meanwhile, WT can't find ANY real "footing" in America.
Doesn't sound too far-fetched now, does it?

Why does that cheese you off? That'd probably put more cash in the band's pockets than they could ever earn with their "real" versions of the songs.

Incidentally, you sure can parody someone's music without permission. (If the music isn't changed then you still have to pay royalties, of course.) Weird Al doesn't do it, but that's by choice.

Don Giro · Feb 13, 2009

Aaron, I edited my post above to show picture of Sirenia ^^^.
The money issue isn't what annoys me. I'd probably be the FIRST one to sell out if I got the chance. They sure could get rich by selling off their songs (IF anyone wanted them). I guess my point is that they're the creators, and they share in NONE of the glory.
I'm glad you brought Weird Al into it, because I remember the had to re-work the music of a "Jack and Diane" parody (about Prince Charles and Di) because John Cougar Mellencamp wouldn't allow it. And I know for a FACT that Type O negative had to re-do their cover of "Summer Breeze" because they had changed the lyrics and that was NOT allowed I used to know those guys, so, that's where I got my info from. I also said that I wasn't sure about the music laws.
Aaaah, doesn't matter anyway. It's not like I have any hit songs to pawn off on others... :laugh:

Oh, I've decided that "the jury is BACK" on Leaves Eyes (post #5). I'll be getting the DVD when it comes out in late March...

Ron-P · Feb 13, 2009

Nightwish's version of "The Phantom of the Opera" gave me the chills. I just watched it on YouTube.
I have to say, after listening to many of these bands, Simone Simon's has me captivated, I absolutely love her voice.

Jason Kirkpatri · Feb 14, 2009

Sirenia - any suggestions? I'm on their website and listening to "Path to Decay". Sounds good enough for me to purchase, but this is a new lead singer? If so, how does the previous singer stack up? Should I be looking at their past couple of albums, the whole catelogue, what do you think?

Edit: so I'm not too sure about the older vocalist. Kind of like the new one better.

Home Theater

Entertainment & Streaming Content

Physical Media

Home Theater Equipment and Hardware

Other Diversions

Bargains and Classifieds

Home Theater Forum

Archives

Symphonic Metal - Dutch (2 Viewers)

Second Unit

Supporting Actor

Stunt Coordinator

Supporting Actor

Bounded In a Nutshell

Supporting Actor

Second Unit

Supporting Actor

Stunt Coordinator

Supporting Actor

Second Unit

Supporting Actor

Supporting Actor

Second Unit

Similar threads

Users who are viewing this thread

Sign up for our newsletter

and receive essential news, curated deals, and much more

Forum statistics