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Writing a letter to Warner about lack of lossless audio on their BRD


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86 replies to this topic

#1 of 87 OFFLINE   carpenterfan

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Posted September 19 2008 - 06:19 AM

I AM GOING TO BE WRITING A LETTER OF COMPLAINT TO WARNER ABOUT THESE RECENT BLU RAY RELEASES AND THE LACK OF LOSELESS AUDIO. IF ANYONE ELSE CARES TO WRITE HERE IS THE ADDRESS.

WARNER BROS.
4000 WARNER BLVD.
BLDG # 154 , RM # 3104
BURBANK , CA. 91522
ATTN: BLU RAY DEPT.

not having loseless audio again now on journey was the last straw for me. something has to be done about this. in my opinion if they have a problem with the HD audio , then sell your films to another studio who will use the proper audio, case closed.

#2 of 87 OFFLINE   Ron-P

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Posted September 19 2008 - 06:27 AM

I sent an email several days ago sharing my disappointment with them after I'd heard that Journey to the Center of the Earth would not be getting a lossless audio track. I stated that I will not buy any Blu-ray disc that does not have a lossless track and that I will encourage others to do the same.

Thanks for the addy, I'll copy my email and send off a hard copy.
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#3 of 87 OFFLINE   willh51

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Posted September 19 2008 - 07:19 AM

I think this is actually a really good idea. Warner is generally pretty good about listening to fan concerns, which is why this whole thing is surprising. I would be all for getting a letter together and having a bunch of electronic signatures, too.

And hey, what are online forums for if not to scheme about complaining to big companies. (I'd also add in a where the hell are the features on the Beetlejuice SE?)

#4 of 87 OFFLINE   Patrick Mason

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Posted September 19 2008 - 08:00 AM

This has been a very disappointing practice from Warner.

Their home video division has long been the example that the industry has followed, yet in this they have managed to fall behind every single other studio. Lossless audio has become the standard, with only Warner standing stubbornly as the exception.

Just this week, I purchased Pushing Daisies: Season 1 from Warner. TrueHD audio was clearly listed on the back of the box, yet as I popped in the first disc I was treated to a standard 640kbps Dolby Digital track. Not only do they announce title after title without lossless, but now even if their packaging lists lossless audio it may not be there.

Not to mention their infuriating practice of labeling so many lossy discs with the "High Def Picture, High Def Sound" banner at the top of the packaging.

I hate to sound so negative about a studio that usually provides such loving attention to its catalog, but this needs to stop. Going forward I will be checking reviews to confirm the presence of lossless audio before I purchase any Warner blu-ray titles.

#5 of 87 OFFLINE   Stephen_J_H

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Posted September 19 2008 - 10:56 AM

Patrick, I'm curious: did you check the menus to see if there is a TrueHD option available? I know that any TrueHD titles I have on HD DVD defaulted to the DD+ track and you have to manually select the TrueHD track. This is true of both Warner and Uni titles with TrueHD on HD DVD.
"My opinion is that (a) anyone who actually works in a video store and does not understand letterboxing has given up on life, and (b) any customer who prefers to have the sides of a movie hacked off should not be licensed to operate a video player."-- Roger Ebert

#6 of 87 OFFLINE   TonyD

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Posted September 19 2008 - 01:08 PM

it's been reported by others on at least one different forum that the
Daisies is missing the truehd track.

Brian this is a good idea.
just be polite and don't use bad language or call them idiots or
any names because they will discount you note otherwise.

plus isn't lossless spelled "lossless" or is
'loseless" correct?
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#7 of 87 OFFLINE   ScottR

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Posted September 19 2008 - 01:49 PM

it's "lossless", although right now we are losing lossless..lol.

#8 of 87 OFFLINE   Dave Moritz

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Posted September 19 2008 - 02:00 PM

I will be sending WB an email as well. There are a number of Bluray releases that I wanted but they had lossy audio track. So I did not buy them and I will not buy any future Blu-ray releases that do not include a lossless audio track! If I didn't care about audio/video quality I would just buy the SD-DVD, why would I want the same lossy track on Bluray? I hope that WB hears this and corrects it by offering lossless audio on there Blu-ray releases.
Supporter of 1080p & 4K video / Supporter of Lossless PCM, Dolby True HD and DTS HD Master Audio / Say No To MP3 & WMA / Say no to Bose & LG!
 

 


#9 of 87 OFFLINE   Cees Alons

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Posted September 20 2008 - 05:32 AM

Perhaps a copy of that letter should be sent to Sony, to urge them to make more BD50 slots available.
That would help the studios to plan more releases that can carry the lossless tracks when 25Gb isn't enough.


Cees

#10 of 87 OFFLINE   Peter Neski

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Posted September 20 2008 - 05:58 AM

The only thing I can think of why no Loseless is price,maybe it would
rasise the price ,don't see how this could be,but I ratter not have titles
list for 40$ Loseless or not

#11 of 87 OFFLINE   Brendan Surpless

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Posted September 20 2008 - 06:42 AM

The funniest aspect of this whole lossless situation is that Warner includes lossless tracks on titles that don't even call for it (for example I received in 'Rest Stop' on Thursday and that has a TrueHD track) but doesn't include a lossless track on titles that cry for it ('Speed Racer' anyone)???

Makes absolutely zero sense to me.

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#12 of 87 OFFLINE   ATimson

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Posted September 20 2008 - 09:31 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by HighDefDiscNewsB
The funniest aspect of this whole lossless situation is that Warner includes lossless tracks on titles that don't even call for it (for example I received in 'Rest Stop' on Thursday and that has a TrueHD track) but doesn't include a lossless track on titles that cry for it ('Speed Racer' anyone)???
Was Rest Stop single-layer or dual-layer?

Given that to WB Speed Racer's theatrical intake only justified a BD-25, it seems like they basically went with a 5.1 track so they could go balls-to-the-wall with making the video look as great as it possibly can; they chose to sacrifice those extra ~3.5 Mbit/s to the picture quality.

Was only going with a BD-25 the ideal solution? Not as consumers. But if that was WB's business choice, I think that the disc is the best possible compromise given the situation.
"Niceness is the greatest human flaw, except for all the others."
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#13 of 87 OFFLINE   Xylon

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Posted September 20 2008 - 09:44 AM

Double dip Posted Image

#14 of 87 OFFLINE   Michael Reuben

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Posted September 20 2008 - 09:49 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ATimson
Given that to WB Speed Racer's theatrical intake only justified a BD-25, it seems like they basically went with a 5.1 track so they could go balls-to-the-wall with making the video look as great as it possibly can; they chose to sacrifice those extra ~3.5 Mbit/s to the picture quality.

Was only going with a BD-25 the ideal solution? Not as consumers. But if that was WB's business choice, I think that the disc is the best possible compromise given the situation.
I agree, but there are other approaches.

When Universal released U-571 on Blu-ray, it was immediately noted that the image was less detailed than it had been on HD-DVD. But the Blu-ray did have a lossless track, even though the disc was only single layer. Obviously Uni decided to satisfy the lossless fans at the expense of image quality.

I don't think that was the right decision, but opinions vary. Personally I hope Warner continues doing what it's doing until such time as there's sufficient production capacity for BD50s, when this whole issue should go away.

M.
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#15 of 87 OFFLINE   David Wilkins

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Posted September 20 2008 - 01:29 PM

They're being penny wise and pound foolish. It's a mistake to continue disappointing the loyal core. We're not the Walmart horde, but most of the horde know someone like us, and they hear us talk.

Amazon has had some of these lossy titles for as low as $13.95. I've had no difficulty saying "no", and will continue doing so. How does that square with their cost saving measures? Is this part of the price cutting strategy that they announced a few months ago? Poor math, poor strategy. It's as if, disappointed by Blu-ray sales (if indeed they are), they're taking measures that are certain to assure that their disappointment will continue.

To quote Dear Leader: "It's fuzzy math."

#16 of 87 OFFLINE   Ron-P

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Posted September 20 2008 - 03:19 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cees Alons
Perhaps a copy of that letter should be sent to Sony, to urge them to make more BD50 slots available.
That would help the studios to plan more releases that can carry the lossless tracks when 25Gb isn't enough.


Cees
Question, is it a matter of availability of BD50 discs? Also, what's the cost of two BD25's vr one BD50. Maybe studios can put the film and lossless audio on one BD25 and all the extras on second BD25.
You have all the weapons you need...Now fight!


#17 of 87 OFFLINE   Douglas Monce

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Posted September 20 2008 - 03:50 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-P
Question, is it a matter of availability of BD50 discs? Also, what's the cost of two BD25's vr one BD50. Maybe studios can put the film and lossless audio on one BD25 and all the extras on second BD25.

Depending on the running time of the film, its likely that a lossless track would cut into the quality of the image on a BD25. It maybe that because there is still a some what limited production ability for BD50s, Warner chose to have the best picture quality possible on a BD25, so the lossless track had to go.

Speed Racer may have an image that is particularly challenging and may need a fairly high bit rate to maintain the image quality. It is also a little longer than the average movie.

I don't know for sure that these are the factors that figured into Warner's decision, but it seems logical.

Doug
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#18 of 87 OFFLINE   Stephen_J_H

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Posted September 20 2008 - 05:30 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-P
Question, is it a matter of availability of BD50 discs? Also, what's the cost of two BD25's vr one BD50. Maybe studios can put the film and lossless audio on one BD25 and all the extras on second BD25.
Not so much availability of BD 50 discs as pressing facilities that can produce the discs. All the studios have to make judgment calls in terms of what films will get the BD 50 treatment and what films will be "good enough" on a BD 25. Cost may come into the equation, but it's ultimately about replication availability. We've known about this for awhile.
"My opinion is that (a) anyone who actually works in a video store and does not understand letterboxing has given up on life, and (b) any customer who prefers to have the sides of a movie hacked off should not be licensed to operate a video player."-- Roger Ebert

#19 of 87 OFFLINE   Ronald Epstein

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Posted September 20 2008 - 08:24 PM

I think writing a polite and constructive letter is a good idea.
Anything beyond that, including littering any more threads with
complaints is not.

Will is quite correct that the studio is very good about responding
to consumer concerns. In fact, I guarantee this thread will be read
by the studio. Perhaps they will address the issue in an upcoming
chat with the forum.

Continue the polite discussion -- the studio deserves nothing less
even though you may not agree with this problem.

 

Ronald J Epstein
Home Theater Forum co-owner

 

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#20 of 87 OFFLINE   Cees Alons

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Posted September 20 2008 - 09:14 PM

Quote:
Not so much availability of BD 50 discs as pressing facilities that can produce the discs.
Correct. Getting the blank discs isn't the problem.
At the moment all Blu-ray producers are competing for a way too little amount of production slots. So they have to make tough decisions - will we bring it out later, or produce a BD25.
Also, time schedules have become more unpleasant: you wouldn't want to miss your reserved slot!
Hopefully that will be history soon, but currently this seems to be a major and very serious concern.

They're between the proverbial hard place and a rock.


Cees


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