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$30US Titles Are Killing HDM's Chances!

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#1 of 57 OFFLINE   Ed St. Clair

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Posted July 30 2008 - 01:52 PM

Thirty bucks for 21, Never Back Down, Doomsday, et all??? Ugh! The BD of "H&KEFGB" is almost twice as much as the SD. For "that" kind of movie are we really going to get J6P flocking to HD? Where are the two for twenty bucks sales that helped win the war? This is about B&M, you know, walk in & buy it! Stores where J6P shops. (if this becomes a BB is a ripoff thread, I wouldn't mind! ;-) ) I'm getting used BD's for about $15US avg w/tax (and a good enough selection), so I'm OK w/prices. Just "we" all want HDM to succeed & I don't see that happening at these pricepoints, yet. (last yr HD Disc sales were less than 2% of SD DVD sales; I was hoping for >10% in '08)
Movies are: "The Greatest Artform".
HD should be for EVERYONE!

#2 of 57 OFFLINE   TonyD


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Posted July 30 2008 - 02:49 PM

wow ed you are on a roll tonight.
someone put something in your coffee.
Posted Image

what is "H&KEFGB"?

#3 of 57 OFFLINE   troy evans

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Posted July 30 2008 - 02:55 PM

"Harold and Kumar: Escape from Guantonimo Bay"
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#4 of 57 OFFLINE   Ray_R



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Posted July 30 2008 - 03:04 PM

It doesn't really matter since not just purchases are done solely in B&M's. Alot of better deals are to be had on multiple online stores. I use DVDPriceSearch.com alot for comparisons and even Amazon Marketplace for titles.
Hell, I'm still buying HDDVD occasionally since it's cheap and I won't be actively buying any Blu's until I'm nearing to buy a Profile 2.0 player. That doesn't mean I can't buy the titles on Blu, might as well build the library before buying the player.
Matters more to me if the image quality looks great and how the film is intended to. Same for original theatrical audio and if all the extras are ported over. More for upgrading really irregardless of format.
I import too so that's also a factor.Posted Image

#5 of 57 OFFLINE   Ed St. Clair

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Posted July 30 2008 - 03:05 PM

I don't drink coffee (maybe "once" a month). You don't want too 'see' me on coffee!!! :-0 EDitEDbyED: Ray, Hi, do you think the avg HT fan is buying HDM? If not, why? I think the avg person hasn't a clue as too the benefits of HD Discs & at thirty bucks a pop, they'll NEVER find out! Thanks.
Movies are: "The Greatest Artform".
HD should be for EVERYONE!

#6 of 57 OFFLINE   RickER



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Posted July 30 2008 - 03:21 PM

I can count the number of FOX titles i own on one hand. I got them all on sale too! Actually, i have not paid full price, or anything like it, for any BD i own. Warner is my best friend, because i usually pay $14 to $16 for their BD's. I dont buy FOX BD's until i can find them in the $20 price, as in a BOGO sale. The prices dont kill me, i simply dont buy until i find a price i like. Then they get a sale!

#7 of 57 OFFLINE   Ray_R



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Posted July 30 2008 - 04:02 PM

Well, alot of it has to do with MSRP and what some B&M's set their pricing at. Even people like me who also buy online want that quick buy of a film they love. A few weeks or so ago, someone scoffed at the very high price for the BD of PREDATOR at Circuit City. I agreed and said it's a rip-off for so how much, actually it's very little, FOX put on the disc. Based on this, the customers won't buy a title which has little to zero value compared to the DVD.
Will they consider the BD a safe buy for upgrading from the DVD? Hell, even I upgrade a bit here and there for my HT. I even helped the employees at CC with a customer about some high def stuff and it was quite cool. Even the working type I've encountered said they preferred OAR and the film grain so appearances can be deceiving. But there are those which complain "Why is this Blu-ray in Widescreen?!" Whining and bitching and moaning are perfectly fine for those Pan and Scammers since Blu-ray is OAR only and should be kept that way.
Of course there aren't the fans like us but even us avid HT'ers choose to upgrade their equipment slowly due to budgetary or other reasons. And one of my other reasons is I don't have enough space in my current living environment to have a fully dedicated HT.
As I've said/typed in an earlie post, it's not all just about B&M's. Online is factor too. Especially with BOGO's. At least it's not like Laserdisc where something with as many features as a SINGLE The Lord of the Rings - Extended Edition film on the format would cost over $200!
Well, one thing I like and don't about the HD formats are the things such as for DVD. The packaging could be more creative compared to just the cases. Why not more digipaks and such? At least the subtitles are neat and tidy! So why are there clips for booklets when so few titles use them?
I guess those're just the quirks of being someone who also imports alot of DVD's which have kick ass packaging and the like, I'm just expecting more for the "2K" format. I think the only Steelbook which is used for High Def discs was the Germerman HDDVD of the Ultimate Edition for T2. At least Warners is offering nice packaging. Maybe wishing for something more lively including a great disc stuff wouldn't be too difficult to ask for?
What's the point of myself buying more BD's when I have to go over to a friends house to play them on his PS3? I'm gonna build my library of Blu's and dammit, alot of them are going to be older films so the studios will know there is interest for them on High Def. I own The Adventures of Robin Hood on HDDVD and I just wish more films from around the time will be displayed more. I don't mind owning HDDVD's one bit. I mean alot of them are cheap and I got my HDDVD add-on for my 360 for only $50.
King Kong (2005) was free inside it. But deep down inside I really wanted the 1930's KONG to watch in HD. Of course HD media won't be the final HT format that's for sure. And why are director's shoot on HD video anyway? It won't even be suitable for the next format. Hell, film at best is quite nearly 8K or higher (just random guessing, Robert Harris would know more definite) and 1080p is just only a stepping stone.
For what I really want, this goes for DVD also, is more older films should be released. I'm sorta counting on Criterion and Kino, even Warner Brothers, gives me hope alot of the older films I'm interested in will out. I'm only 29 and I damn I own alot of older films on DVD, HDDVD and such. Not really BD since I only own one of them (BLACK HAWK DOWN)!Posted Image There are even alot of films from the 20's-70's on my DVR and damn, I'd love to own the ones I really enjoyed in my collection.
Also in regards to DVD... I just don't get why alot of films of John Wayne are on the 5" optical disc formats but where's Robert Montgomery, John Garfield, Errol Flynn (well, there's alot but since I'm a huge fan!) and alot of other actors and actresses? I automatically set my DVR to record a film since it has a actor in it I respect and appreciate. I DVR'd They Were Expendable more to watch another Robert Montgomery film. There're even a few which Clark Gable were also in.
Just venting but I'm a bit choosy even on my blind buying.Posted Image

#8 of 57 OFFLINE   Ron-P



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Posted July 30 2008 - 04:07 PM

It d oesn't bother me, I hit BB weekly and buy Blu titles almost every trip. Just picked up Dark City and Doomdays both at BB Tuesday.
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#9 of 57 OFFLINE   Paul Arnette

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Posted July 30 2008 - 04:11 PM

That's all fine and well, and I do the same believe me. However, I think Ed's point is more along the lines of this format won't 'take off' until someone can walk into a B&M and make an impulse purchase without balking at the price. I do know that, for better or worse, I can't right now because I know I can get BDs cheaper online every time. Sometimes I miss not being able to walk out of Target, for example, with an impulse purchase.

That said, if you think about how long DVD took to take off we're probably another year away from the studios moving prices down toward that kind of adoption. In fact, I'm not sure the current infrastructure could support it anyway. If the studios don't consider the format war in their timetable, we're probably two years away. Although sometimes we forget it we are early, early adopters. Posted Image
Universal Blu-ray Discs I will not be buying while they're offered only as Blu-ray + DVD 'flipper' discs:

The Jackal
, Out of Africa, and Traffic.

#10 of 57 OFFLINE   Ron-P



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Posted July 30 2008 - 04:17 PM

When I used to pay $50+ for a widescreen VHS I have no problem paying half that for a Blu-ray disc.
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#11 of 57 OFFLINE   PaulDA



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Posted July 30 2008 - 04:33 PM

If one accounts for inflation and that BD is still in early days, prices are not that bad, in the aggregate. I remember spending more on used DVDs than some BDs are priced at my local stores (not to mention even lower prices online). And I too remember laying down serious coin for widescreen VHS versions of Ben-Hur and Spartacus (both over 40$, if memory serves), among others. So while BD purchases will not be impulse buys at first, neither were VHS nor DVD when I first began buying those.
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#12 of 57 OFFLINE   CraigF



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Posted July 30 2008 - 06:36 PM

Compared to the old days, BD prices aren't bad at all. However, the studios set the DVD pricing policies and strategies, and have only themselves to blame for any resistance to paying a huge premium for BD vs DVD (I'm especially targeting you, FOX). I don't own a single Fox BD. Don't intend to, until they get real. I'll buy 10 WB etc. BD before one Fox. On principle. Do you know what a principle is Fox? It has nothing to do with $$$, so I guess not. You're a business, I'm a customer, we have nothing to talk about, right? May I introduce you to GM?? Nuff said...

#13 of 57 OFFLINE   MarkBirds


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Posted July 30 2008 - 07:17 PM

I agree. I really don't buy DVDs since I got my PS3, and I rarely buy new releases on BD (Blockbuster Online is an affordable way to feed my BD habit). $25-30 is too high for a blind buy, which I used to make all of the time when I could get a brand new DVD for under 20 bucks. I have around 40 BDs. I've gotten a lot of them on eBay, where there are a lot of good deals to be had (like the Die Hard set for $50 brand new), the occasional Amazon sale and even a couple from Columbia House. I can't tell you how many new releases I would have purchased if they were not, in my opinion, overpriced. I skipped Gone Baby Gone, Batman Gotham Knight, The Bank Job ... I could go on and on. Hopefully, it's just a matter of time until the prices become a little more reasonable.
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#14 of 57 OFFLINE   David Wilkins

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Posted July 30 2008 - 07:28 PM

Please...not this argument again. People who make this argument need a history lesson, or at least to sit down and reflect a little. There is nothing out of line with where we are at this point in format development. These are Salad Days for home theater. You want what? TrueHD, flawless transfers from new masters and restorations, bonus features, and on, and on, and on. And you want to pay $10 a disc? Not gonna happen. I don't give a flip if Joe-schmo buys into BD tomorrow or not. I want reference quality discs of films I really want. If that means the product prices keep Granny from wanting a BD player for the time being...I couldn't care less.

#15 of 57 OFFLINE   CraigF



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Posted July 30 2008 - 08:23 PM

^ That's the attitude we need. Kill BD before it even gets anywhere. Make it ultra-elitist. Oh yes, that makes big $$ for the studios, who couldn't care less about what elitists think (and since when did elitists think??). You are a beginner for sure...have you not noticed it's what J6P (and I really do hate using that term) thinks that matters? It's called democracy in these parts. And the free market. It sucks, but sucks less than the alternatives...

#16 of 57 OFFLINE   Jari K

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Posted July 30 2008 - 10:16 PM

IMO, the "attitude" what we need is somewhere in the middle. No need to accept Fox price-range (especially if some extras are dropped), but it´s also rather naive to believe that Blu-ray-titles should cost "$10" or something. But yes, this is one tired subject for sure..

#17 of 57 OFFLINE   Mike Frezon

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Posted July 31 2008 - 01:52 AM

Ray: FWIW, the UK BD of Sweeeney Todd was also in a steelbook.


I suppose this could be considered a tired subject. But it's kind of like the weather for people within this community. There might not be much we can do about it...but it sure has a big impact on our lives so we like to talk about it.

I suppose the one difference is: My belief is that we ARE doing something about HD pricing the long run. Many of us are making discriminating choices about what HD material we are buying...mostly because of price. Our buying patterns HAVE to be having an impact of pricing patterns in the B&Ms.

For example, while Target still has most BDs up in the $29 to $34 range, I am starting to see more and more in-store markdowns (temporary price reductions) on individual titles which certainly catch my eye and, if circumstances, allow, might just convince me to make that impulse buy. Posted Image

For all those HTFers who roll their eyes and talk about how much they paid for laserdiscs or widescreen VHS, I just don't find those comments pertinent to this discussion. The marketplace now is a much different place than the '80s. While you may be happy--given your financial situation--rationalizing purchases of top dollar HDM by comparing it with what-you-paid "in the old days"...isn't really the point Ed was trying to make in his OP.

I'm finding it interesting that many of us in this thread (and other similar threads)--Ed, Rick, Mark & I--are like-minded in searching out desired titles in "used" bins...where we know the quality of the product is just as good but the price is that much better.

I'd have to count 'em up...but I'd say 75 to 90% of the BD titles in my collection are the former occupants of a used bin.

Prices will come down when the marketplace and its participants decide it's necessary. And some of us consumers are doing our part by being selective. That's all.

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#18 of 57 OFFLINE   Dave H

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Posted July 31 2008 - 03:42 AM

A voice of reason!

Nearly all of my BDs are shipped to me for under $20.00 which is a better deal than what I was paying for 480i, lossy DVDs back in the late 90's, early 2000. I mean when you factor in the cost of living increases and FAR, FAR superior quality with BD, I have no issues with pricing. My only problem is there are so many good titles coming out the rest of the year and how I going to afford buying them! Posted Image

As far as Fox titles, you just have to be patient and wait for a deal. Those list priced $39.95 catalog titles do drop to $19.95 or cheaper with sales after a few months

#19 of 57 OFFLINE   Sam Posten

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Posted July 31 2008 - 04:20 AM

I was REALLY happy to see Paramount's latest batch at Costco for a flat $18.49 apiece rather than the $27 most of Costcos other BDs are going for. Thats a real good start!

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#20 of 57 OFFLINE   Jari K

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Posted July 31 2008 - 05:49 AM

Exactly. And NONE of these titles are actually $39.95 in Amazon etc in the first place (not sure about Best Buy and stores like that - I´m talking online-stores).

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