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Warner Bros. upsets me


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#1 of 101 OFFLINE   stewprime

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Posted July 18 2008 - 01:19 PM

I don't know what there business policy is but it sure stinks. They release Night Court Season 1 as a bare bones set in what? 2004? And fail to produce the reamaining seasons. Then, 2 years later, they release Drew Carey season 1 on the DVD and guess what? Screwed again. And we've only got 1 season of Whose Line is it Anyway? as well.

I mean, seriously, who the hell is driving Warner's Home DVD sales department? A chimp? I've seriously got a bone to pick with who ever is in charge. Posted Image

Warner Bros. Get your act together...please.

#2 of 101 OFFLINE   Joe Tor1

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Posted July 18 2008 - 02:16 PM

While we're at it, where's Season 2-4 of HUCKLEBERRY HOUND?

WHV did do well with classic Hanna-Barbera releases until then. Wha' hoppen?

And, too often, their PACKAGING is that slimmer, cheaper packaging that Warner Home Video has used since the latter part of 2005, where one disc rests upon another. You cannot handle or remove DISC TWO without first removing or handling DISC ONE. There is always potential, however slight, for damage with packaging of this sort.

#3 of 101 OFFLINE   bmasters9

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Posted July 18 2008 - 10:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by stewprime
I don't know what there business policy is but it sure stinks. They release Night Court Season 1 as a bare bones set in what? 2004? And fail to produce the reamaining seasons. Then, 2 years later, they release Drew Carey season 1 on the DVD and guess what? Screwed again. And we've only got 1 season of Whose Line is it Anyway? as well.

I mean, seriously, who the hell is driving Warner's Home DVD sales department? A chimp? I've seriously got a bone to pick with who ever is in charge. Posted Image

Warner Bros. Get your act together...please.

I think, stewprime, that it is the infamous "starts with F" rule that is the reason why "Night Court," "Drew Carey," and "WLIIA" each only have one season's worth released. If it doesn't start with F, Warner seems to say, it's not going to get completed, released beyond S1, or even released at all. This, I believe, is part of why "Friends" has had all 10 seasons' worth released and why it has also been released in a full series package as well.

Two notable exceptions to this are "The Waltons," which has been released from 1972-79 (7 seasons' worth), and "Dallas" (9 seasons' worth from 1978-
86; this being the way that Warner counts seasons).
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#4 of 101 OFFLINE   JohnMor

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Posted July 19 2008 - 07:56 AM

The bottom line is if S1 sells, there will be a S2 released. Friends and The West Wing sold enough to not only complete their runs, but release deluxe complete sets as well. Dallas sells well enough to get up to S9, but Knots Landing stalled at S1.

Why would they release further seasons of shows that don't sell? It's a business, pure and simple.

It's frustrating, I know. I would love to get The Mary Tyler Moore Show completed, but the last season released (S4) only sold about 75,000 units, and Fox isn't interested in those kind of numbers. But that's business.

#5 of 101 OFFLINE   Bryan^H

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Posted July 19 2008 - 08:34 AM

Warner Brothers doesn't joke around. If it doesn't sell as may units as they would like, they will drop that title forever. I don't know of anything Warner has abandoned, and returned for another release. Once they stop a title, they never seem to look back. They are ruthless. Punch you in the gut, and ask if your OK ruthless.

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#6 of 101 OFFLINE   Haden

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Posted July 19 2008 - 11:46 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan^H
I don't know of anything Warner has abandoned, and returned for another release.

Well that seemed to be the case with Mary Tyler Moore at first, which had season 1 come out in 2002, and then nothing for almost 3 years until season 2 finally came out in 2005. There seemed to be hope for awhile after that with seasons 3 and 4 being released in 2006, but alas it looks like it's been abandoned again. Posted Image

I'm somewhat amazed and thankful Dallas has made it this far with 9 seasons. I guess that's a testament to its continued popularity. Surely they won't stop when they are this far into it. Only 5 seasons left to go.

#7 of 101 OFFLINE   Bryan^H

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Posted July 19 2008 - 11:53 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haden
Well that seemed to be the case with Mary Tyler Moore at first, which had season 1 come out in 2002, and then nothing for almost 3 years until season 2 finally came out in 2005. There seemed to be hope for awhile after that with seasons 3 and 4 being released in 2006, but alas it looks like it's been abandoned again. Posted Image

I'm somewhat amazed and thankful Dallas has made it this far with 9 seasons. I guess that's a testament to its continued popularity. Surely they won't stop when they are this far into it. Only 5 seasons left to go.

I didn't know MTM was a Warner Brothers release. I stand corrected.

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#8 of 101 OFFLINE   whisperintherain

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Posted July 19 2008 - 12:39 PM

Ironically enough, my favorite Warner shows are the ones that don't sell. Don't get me wrong, I love BABYLON 5, FRIENDS, GILMORE GIRLS, NIP/TUCK, SIX FEET UNDER, SMALLVILLE and VERONICA MARS (all of which I collect), but I can't help feeling terribly sad that we may never see the rest of KNOTS LANDING (my favorite show ever, I like it much better than DALLAS which I can't help finding awfully boring), LIFE GOES ON (an underrated gem of a show) and EVERWOOD (a wonderful show with excellent writing and acting, probably the best thing that The WB ever aired) released on DVD. I was surprised by the DVD success of something like THE DUKES OF HAZZARD, which I in no way begrudge, but am wondering if by any chance, the sales expectations were set at a lower level for that show.

Is there a complete list of WARNER's abandoned shows available online? I know that people often mention MURPHY BROWN or NIGHT COURT, but besides these titles and the ones mentioned previously, I'd like to have just a rough idea of how frequent this practice is.

Oh, another odd thing I thought I'd mention in passing: some shows get quicker releases in Europe than in the US. For instance, ER season 12 is already scheduled for a fall release and Season 4 of WITHOUT A TRACE was released last month. Just wondering: is it possible that these titles are more popular over here than in the country where they first aired?

However, other titles are not very popular on DVD around here. For instance, there are currently no plans to release DALLAS beyond Season 7 in France, due to poor sales (despite the fact that the show is constantly in reruns over here).
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#9 of 101 OFFLINE   Haden

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Posted July 19 2008 - 12:58 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan^H
I didn't know MTM was a Warner Brothers release. I stand corrected.

It's not, but I was just using it as an example of another series that seemed to stall for quite a while after the first season came out and then picked up again after 3 years with seasons 2, 3, and 4.

#10 of 101 OFFLINE   Bryan^H

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Posted July 19 2008 - 03:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haden
It's not, but I was just using it as an example of another series that seemed to stall for quite a while after the first season came out and then picked up again after 3 years with seasons 2, 3, and 4.
My fault. I took your first paragraph the wrong way. I guess time will tell on WB's abandoned titles.

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#11 of 101 OFFLINE   Joe Karlosi

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Posted July 19 2008 - 10:50 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnMor
The bottom line is if S1 sells, there will be a S2 released. Friends and The West Wing sold enough to not only complete their runs, but release deluxe complete sets as well. Dallas sells well enough to get up to S9, but Knots Landing stalled at S1.

Why would they release further seasons of shows that don't sell? It's a business, pure and simple.

It's frustrating, I know. I would love to get The Mary Tyler Moore Show completed, but the last season released (S4) only sold about 75,000 units, and Fox isn't interested in those kind of numbers. But that's business.

Yeah, yeah, yeah -- "That's business". But what about good or even classic shows that ought to be preserved?

I'm sick and tired of "newer" shows like FRIENDS getting all the attention. OF COURSE a show like that is going to sell very well on DVD, because it's a recent show that younger people love. But really great older shows like MARY TYLER MOORE should suffer just because they premiered in 1970 instead of in 2006??? That's what really irks me.

#12 of 101 OFFLINE   bmasters9

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Posted July 20 2008 - 12:24 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Karlosi
Yeah, yeah, yeah -- "That's business". But what about good or even classic shows that ought to be preserved?

I'm sick and tired of "newer" shows like FRIENDS getting all the attention. OF COURSE a show like that is going to sell very well on DVD, because it's a recent show that younger people love. But really great older shows like MARY TYLER MOORE should suffer just because they premiered in 1970 instead of in 2006??? That's what really irks me.

No doubt. I can understand the appeal of "Friends" to younger people, perhaps as somewhat of a, shall we say, "chick series," which daters might see with their dates, but it was, however, not my cup of tea. That is not to say that the younger people couldn't enjoy it if they wanted to. The main turnoff, however, to me, was its opening theme-- "I'll Be There For You" by The Rembrandts does not hold the same appeal to me as does "Love Is All Around" by Sonny Curtis or "Angela" by Bob James; heck, even the opening theme of "Trapper John, M.D." by John Parker is something that I, for one, could enjoy over and over. Of course, not everyone thinks the same way.
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#13 of 101 OFFLINE   Tory

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Posted July 20 2008 - 02:42 AM

Growing pains seems dropped too. I do not think these series were pushed well, I could hardly find Growing Pains, Night Court or Murphy Brown but stores were flooded with Fresh Prince and Full House.
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#14 of 101 OFFLINE   Aryn Leroux

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Posted July 20 2008 - 03:58 AM

It seems it has been awhile since the last HTF WB Chat. I have had several folks tell me they may not be doing any in the future, because of all the questions they have to answer about stalled or abandoned shows. I hope that is not the case because i really enjoyed those chats. You at times would get a little ray of hope on a title you were waiting for and they were fun to participate in. Here is to hoping a session will pop up in the near future!

#15 of 101 OFFLINE   whisperintherain

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Posted July 20 2008 - 04:22 AM

Well, if that's the reason they don't do those chats anymore, shame on them. We have a right to ask about our favorite shows, not theirs, whether they like it or not. Would they rather have people calling them all the time?

I also remember being appalled last year when someone asked about the next DALLAS release and they replied by saying THE OC's latest season was coming up. Talk about responding besides the point. These chats are useless anyway, since they never seem to take the consumers' opinions into account. Sometimes I think they would deserve a good boycott, but the truth of the matter is they release too much stuff that I want for me to turn my back completely on them. I just like to complain once in a while. Posted Image
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#16 of 101 ONLINE   TravisR

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Posted July 20 2008 - 04:43 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aryn Leroux
I have had several folks tell me they may not be doing any in the future, because of all the questions they have to answer about stalled or abandoned shows.
I've never seen any reason for WB seems to have stopped HTF chats and unless you heard that from someone who works at WB, they're just guessing.

#17 of 101 OFFLINE   ChrisCook

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Posted July 20 2008 - 07:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan^H
Warner Brothers doesn't joke around. If it doesn't sell as may units as they would like, they will drop that title forever. I don't know of anything Warner has abandoned, and returned for another release. Once they stop a title, they never seem to look back. They are ruthless. Punch you in the gut, and ask if your OK ruthless.

The first season of "Without a Trace" was released in 2004, which resulted in poor sales. The studio gave it another chance and released the second season in 2007. (I should also add that Warner didn't take any short cuts - they went and cleared all the music which was expensive, and even included deleted scenes). I haven't seen any news on a third season from TVShowsOnDVD, so this must have got the same "poor sales" as the first season, or did worse.

#18 of 101 OFFLINE   Corey3rd

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Posted July 20 2008 - 07:33 AM

seems that Warners got a major juice a few years back when they slashed their prices at Walmart and other retailers to $18 a set and then they had the rebate so that people could get a boxset for under $10. This me into buying quite a few sets.
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#19 of 101 OFFLINE   Gord Lacey

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Posted July 20 2008 - 07:39 AM

Right, and that's an example of a NEW show that was dropped for the same reason the older shows are dropped; poor sales.

Warner Bros doesn't completely drop a show with the intention of burying it, they just have such an extensive catalog that they can more onto something else they think will sell better. I talk to Warner Bros all the time, and they're constantly looking at all their properties to see if some of them have become viable. That doesn't mean more will be released, but they haven't completely dropped a title forever.

We have to remember that the studios are out to make money for their shareholders, they aren't here to preserve memories, or "art." Sometimes everything comes together and they're able to satisfy everyone. Yes, it completely sucks when a show is put on hold, but the studios are just as upset that they put all this time and effort into releasing a set that not enough people bought.

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#20 of 101 OFFLINE   Jeff Willis

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Posted July 20 2008 - 10:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gord Lacey
We have to remember that the studios are out to make money for their shareholders, they aren't here to preserve memories, or "art." Sometimes everything comes together and they're able to satisfy everyone. Yes, it completely sucks when a show is put on hold, but the studios are just as upset that they put all this time and effort into releasing a set that not enough people bought.

That's it. It's something that I know, for me, as an HTF'er & TV/DVD collector, I have to remind myself of this. Bottom line is if the #'s are there. the releases will come.

I often wonder what impact we (HTF'ers) might have if we represented a larger # of the TV/DVD buying public. We've talked about this before here but what's our sales # percentage? 1-3%? Maybe that's on the low side. When I see pre-80's series that has stalled after 1 or 2 seasons released, I wonder, as a Baby Boomer myself, "Where are the 'Boomers out there?" We sure have the #'s as far as population in the states, but they aren't buying these older shows in large #'s for whatever reasons. I have no facts on why, but I have a feeling that there are a couple of reasons:

1) They are satisfied with their current programming at home via Satt/Cable.
2) Their DVD $'s go to movie DVD sales.
3) The perception of TV/DVD seems to be very different vs movie DVD releases. I've heard this feedback from co-workers and friends. It's just my theory, but there's a perception regarding TV/DVD sets, that "Ive seen that show on TV. Why would I buy the DVD set?" Or, "TV Shows were broadcast over the air for free for many years. I don't want to buy something that I've watched for free."
4) This one might be a bigger factor than I listed it here. Lack of communication about TV/DVD releases. I've often heard from people (after the releases of Get Smart, or UNCLE, as examples) "That's on DVD? Your're kidding!"

We here that hit TSoD & HTF daily are a small minority out there. I wish it were otherwise.

The toughest part of this hobby for me is the "not knowing" factor. What are the sales #'s for "Show X S1"? What is the break-even # for unit sales? What legal/rights issues are on the table for a show & what is the present status of said issues? Is "Show Y S2" on the slate for a Q1 '09 release? etc. Since that information is proprietary to the studios, we don't know statuses of a particular series that may be on our "Grail" lists.

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