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I, Robot: Fox Keeps Screwing Fans of Extras


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#41 of 69 OFFLINE   Travis Brashear

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Posted March 17 2008 - 12:04 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas Monce
I agree. But isn't Patton a full featured version with all the extras of the SD release included? My understanding is that it was and in that case I will probably buy it.

Well, supposedly, yes, but one would think the same from I, ROBOT. That's my whole point--regardless of the fact that the titles of all the previous special features have been bullet-pointed on the press release, we still won't know until the title is released and someone reviews it well and thoroughly if the special features appear in their full, unedited form.
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#42 of 69 OFFLINE   Travis Brashear

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Posted March 17 2008 - 12:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by troy evans
Those people who don't own the sd dvd special edition version and buy the BD version won't care about those edited/missing features anyway. They either don't know about them or don't care about them.

Hmm, way off the mark there--you forget the consumer who a) for whatever reason (financial, young consumer just getting into collecting, etc.) never got the SD special edition but b) is very much interested in bonus features, as well as c) the best video and audio available in the marketplace. Now that consumer has to make a choice between the two (or double the financial impact of the purchase by buying both) when there's 50 f-in' gigs on the Blu-ray!
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#43 of 69 OFFLINE   Jim_K

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Posted March 17 2008 - 12:24 AM

Quote:
However, by purchasing their product, you're in a sense encouraging them to keep their high prices.

But on the flip side by not purchasing their product, you're in a sense sending the message (intentionally or not) that you're not interested in catalog titles.

It's a no-win situation.

Are the Fox bean-counters savvy enough to compare their figures to other studios sales numbers then determine that their low sales are due to people boycotting their product because their catalogs are priced 25-30% higher than other studios or because they trimmed 25% of the supplements? Don't know, but I highly doubt other studios would freely give Fox (a competitor) their sales data.

Or after crunching the numbers for Predator, Master and Commander, Patton, Butch Cassidy, etc, etc they just determine that there's no market in HDM for catalog titles and just pull the plug on future releases. Very possible.

Do I agree their catalog product is overpriced? absolutely. I'd love to pay less, I'm not a complete idiot.

Does the pricing deter a purchase from me? yes, quite a few times (ID4, Sand Pebbles, being the latest examples)

Does cutting supplements bother me? yes, I think it sucks. But it's just not a deal breaker a lot of the times.

Do I flat out boycott all their product? absolutely not. I make a case by case judgement based on just how much I like the title. There's just not enough content being released for me to go passing up favorite titles as a matter of principle, but that's me.

Give me $60 to spend and I'd purchase 2 favorite films at $27 each rather than 3 titles at $20 each I'm only luke-warm about.

Not defending Fox at all here believe me, just playing Devils Advocate. Posted Image
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#44 of 69 ONLINE   Robert Crawford

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Posted March 17 2008 - 01:18 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim_K
But on the flip side by not purchasing their product, you're in a sense sending the message (intentionally or not) that you're not interested in catalog titles.

It's a no-win situation.


It's not a no-win situation if we continue to buy catalog titles from other studios which should tell Fox that their catalog pricing is too high in comparison to their competition.





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#45 of 69 OFFLINE   Bleddyn Williams

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Posted March 17 2008 - 02:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by EnricoE
personally i don't care much about the missing extras on this release or any other fox release i have the 2 disc dvd from (id4, planet of the apes, from hell, cast away for example).

Well I have the two-disc version too. The R3 version, which came as two discs right off the bat (unlike Fox's crappy "single disc first, two discs later" ploy in the US).

I do care, though - when a blu version comes, it should feature all the extras from the already released SD. That way, we can get rid of our old DVD versions. There's no reason in the world why Fox needed to truncate the extra material for I, Robot, except to hold something back for another release.

Same with ID4 - the making of material previously available is replaced by a game no one will play, and a complicated index & search feature that surely no one with a life will ever have the time to mess around with.

Now I have these films on blu-ray, I don't want to keep my DVD versions, but Fox forces you to do so if you wish to keep all the extra material. It seems that almost every release from Fox is somehow incomplete so at the back of your mind you know what's coming.

Nobody is as blatant at screwing you as Fox.

#46 of 69 OFFLINE   Chris S

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Posted March 17 2008 - 04:30 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Crawford
It's not a no-win situation if we continue to buy catalog titles from other studios which should tell Fox that their catalog pricing is too high in comparison to their competition.

This is a good point. Lord knows Warner has taken quite a toll on my paycheck with their catalog releases.
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#47 of 69 OFFLINE   ppltd

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Posted March 17 2008 - 04:33 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Crawford
It's not a no-win situation if we continue to buy catalog titles from other studios which should tell Fox that their catalog pricing is too high in comparison to their competition.





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I stopped buying all Fox catalog releases a while back (many I would like to own). Until Fox finally lowers their retail down to what the other studios charge, they will not get my money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris S
This is a good point. Lord knows Warner has taken quite a toll on my paycheck with their catalog releases.
Ditto
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#48 of 69 OFFLINE   TonyD

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Posted March 17 2008 - 04:49 AM

i won't buy any ANY fox discs until they are priced to sell, not priced to gouge.
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#49 of 69 OFFLINE   MatthewA

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Posted March 17 2008 - 04:52 AM

If you even want to start to make them a difference, you need to write to them with your complaints and reservations. It wouldn't hurt to include a list of titles you would buy on Blu-Ray.

Stranger things have happened.

Enough is enough, Disney. No more evasions or excuses. We DEMAND the release Song of the South on Blu-ray along with the uncut version of Bedknobs and Broomsticks on Blu-ray. I am going to boycott The Walt Disney Company until then.


#50 of 69 OFFLINE   LarryH

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Posted March 17 2008 - 03:13 PM

Apparently Fox has gotten the message a little bit:
Fox Slashes Prices on Blu-ray Catalog | High-Def Digest

Now just to wait for them to lower the price of I, Robot, etc.

#51 of 69 OFFLINE   Travis Brashear

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Posted March 18 2008 - 02:06 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryH
Apparently Fox has gotten the message a little bit:
Fox Slashes Prices on Blu-ray Catalog | High-Def Digest

Now just to wait for them to lower the price of I, Robot, etc.

Their prices are only half the problem; they could lower I, ROBOT to $5 and it still would have truncated extras. They have to improve on both fronts--price and supplements--to succeed, especially with hi-def media being in as precarious a position as it currently is.
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#52 of 69 OFFLINE   troy evans

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Posted March 18 2008 - 08:48 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Travis Brashear
Their prices are only half the problem; they could lower I, ROBOT to $5 and it still would have truncated extras. They have to improve on both fronts--price and supplements--to succeed, especially with hi-def media being in as precarious a position as it currently is.
Yes, but in Fox defense, the price is number one of two of thier biggest issues. Sony, Lionsgate and even some Disney Blu-ray releases have not included all previously released bonus material as well. What they have done is maintain a presence in the market. Something Fox has not done. At least not well. Perhaps that will change in the coming months. However, since people still buy the Blu-rays from the other studios who don't include everything, Fox has no reason to think extra features are that important. Price on the other hand would help them greatly and if Fox Blu-ray titles did drop to $5.00 each they would fly off shelves, special features or not. Another example of where Fox misses the mark is with this weeks release of The Seeker. The dvd release has nothing on it in the way of extras, so where the hell is the day and date Blu-ray? If they release this a month or two from now who cares. They will have missed the prime buying new release timeframe that the sd dvd had. That can hurt more than pricing. I feel this special features thing is more than a Fox issue and is an issue with Blu-ray as a whole. Fox, like many here have already said, is doing this to have the double dip later. The problem isn't so much with Blu-ray as the entire sd dvd market as well. How many times have we seen the same film get released in two or three or four different versions? Too many. Sd dvd started this shit and sadly Blu-ray is following the same marketing ploy. If anyone bought the first release of any dvd and stopped there, great. Myself and many others on here more than likely bought the other versions as well. We are all to blame for what the market has become and unless we all stop getting the featureless/watered down features dvd releases it'll never change. That's hard to do when you're like me simply because, I want Blu-ray to succeed. I'm affraid if we all don't support it, then, we'll lose it. I don't want that and I'm sure many here feel the same. So, in the case of special features, I'll have superior PQ and AQ over them any day.
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#53 of 69 OFFLINE   Paul.S

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Posted March 19 2008 - 03:46 PM

Fox sets a crappy BD supps precedent here. They could have asterisked those SD DVD Collector's Edition featurettes whose titles they bullet point here and--right next to where the box reads "Special Features Are Not Rated"--stated "* Special Features Are Edited From Previous DVD Release."

High Def Digest's Kenneth Brown does an outstanding job of describing exactly what's 'missing' on the BD compared to the SD DVD CE in his thorough review.

Quote:
At first glance, I foolishly thought Fox had finally released a film on Blu-ray with a definitive supplemental package. Unfortunately, the stingy studio continues to miss the point, failing to respond to fan outcry. Instead of packing in all 4 hours of featurettes that appeared on the 2005 2-disc Collector's Edition DVD, Fox has trimmed down the runtime and even left an entire documentary on the cutting room floor. Approximately 240 minutes of bonus material has been reduced to 150 minutes -- instead of issuing a 2-disc BD set, Fox has elected to discard an hour and a half of behind-the-scenes information. Unbelievable.


#54 of 69 OFFLINE   Dale MA

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Posted March 19 2008 - 10:11 PM

I'll stick with the DVD. I'll also join the Fox boycott, they'll get the message eventually.

#55 of 69 OFFLINE   Dave Scarpa

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Posted March 20 2008 - 03:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Travis Brashear
Reviews across the internet are touting the video and audio of the recent I, ROBOT Blu-ray as among the finest releases on the market; and yet Fox is screwing the Blu-ray customer once again by making their packaging look like the BD contains all the features on the SD All-Access Collector's Edition when, in fact, many of them have been edited down from that earlier version (see details at the BD's review at highdefdigest.com). Hell, since they're all still SD extras anyway, Fox could have just added that 2nd disc from the earlier C.E. instead of truncating the extras and squeezing them on a single BD. This frankly scares the hell out me--how am I ever going to be able to trust Fox packaging now, if there's no indication that they're providing edited-down versions of previously available SD extras? I know this forum is chock-a-block with members who could give a rip about extras--just give 'em great picture and sound, and they're set--but for the rest of us, this sets an unethical and unacceptable precedent...

Yes, and Fox BD's are some of the Most Expensice on the Market. Their Steelbook SD version was at BB this week for $15, Yet you get a watered down Disk for more than twice the price.
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#56 of 69 OFFLINE   RobertR

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Posted March 20 2008 - 03:19 AM

Quote:
However, by purchasing their product, you're in a sense encouraging them to keep their high prices.


But on the flip side by not purchasing their product, you're in a sense sending the message (intentionally or not) that you're not interested in catalog titles.

It's a no-win situation.
If you explicitly TELL Fox WHY you're not purchasing their product, there is no "no-win" situation.

#57 of 69 OFFLINE   Jason_V

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Posted March 20 2008 - 03:44 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Menard
Am I really going to have to purchase the extended version of Independance Day from Japan?

Hence why I'm keeping my Five Star version of Independence Day. I'm particularly scared of what they're going to do to The Abyss. It may be non-anamorphic, but it's one beautiful two disc set.

#58 of 69 OFFLINE   Shaun

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Posted March 20 2008 - 03:52 AM

This is one of the main reasons why I initially supported HD-DVD instead of Blu-Ray. All the greedy (high-priced, double-dipping, features-lacking) studios seemed to lean towards Blu-Ray.

Now that Blu-Ray has won the war, hopefully things will start to improve and pricing will become more consumer-friendly.
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#59 of 69 OFFLINE   Jari K

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Posted March 20 2008 - 05:50 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun
This is one of the main reasons why I initially supported HD-DVD instead of Blu-Ray..

Here we go again.. It has always been up to the studios, not formats. E.g. Warner has always been great to add extras (whether it´s SD DVD, HD DVD or Blu-ray), so they (studios) make their own choices.

Since Blu-ray now has 50gb in use, you can fully blame the Fox and not the "format". I´ve no clue why Fox is dropping extras from many of their releases.. I doubt that any of us know the real reason (if there´s one in the first place).

They want to limit their HD-releases to "one disc"? (with 50gb in use, could this really be the reason?)

They want that their SD DVD-release "still sell"? (since some people buy those for the extras etc)

No idea..

But I agree. This doesn´t work. At least not with this price range (with Fox, I mean).

#60 of 69 OFFLINE   TonyD

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Posted March 20 2008 - 07:32 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun
This is one of the main reasons why I initially supported HD-DVD instead of Blu-Ray. All the greedy (high-priced, double-dipping, features-lacking) studios seemed to lean towards Blu-Ray.

Now that Blu-Ray has won the war, hopefully things will start to improve and pricing will become more consumer-friendly.

jari you should quote the entire post if you want to respond that way.

shaun did say ....
"All the greedy (high-priced, double-dipping, features-lacking) studios seemed to lean towards Blu-Ray."
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