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I, Robot: Fox Keeps Screwing Fans of Extras


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#1 of 69 Travis Brashear

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Posted March 15 2008 - 03:33 AM

Reviews across the internet are touting the video and audio of the recent I, ROBOT Blu-ray as among the finest releases on the market; and yet Fox is screwing the Blu-ray customer once again by making their packaging look like the BD contains all the features on the SD All-Access Collector's Edition when, in fact, many of them have been edited down from that earlier version (see details at the BD's review at highdefdigest.com). Hell, since they're all still SD extras anyway, Fox could have just added that 2nd disc from the earlier C.E. instead of truncating the extras and squeezing them on a single BD. This frankly scares the hell out me--how am I ever going to be able to trust Fox packaging now, if there's no indication that they're providing edited-down versions of previously available SD extras? I know this forum is chock-a-block with members who could give a rip about extras--just give 'em great picture and sound, and they're set--but for the rest of us, this sets an unethical and unacceptable precedent...
Ernest Hemingway once wrote, "The world is a fine place and worth fighting for." I agree with the second part...
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#2 of 69 Robert Crawford

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Posted March 15 2008 - 03:42 AM

As someone that generally doesn't really care about alot of extras, I have to agree with you. Fox and the rest of the studios needs to give us the advantages that the BR format offers us, especially, if they're going to charge us the amount of money they do on these releases. They have no excuses in this matter.





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#3 of 69 Jari K

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Posted March 15 2008 - 04:23 AM

Fox has often indeed dropped all the extras from that "Disc 2" from the SD DVD SE.. Not sure why. Then again e.g. "The Fly (1986)" included everything.. Go figure.

#4 of 69 Travis Brashear

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Posted March 15 2008 - 04:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jari K
Fox has often indeed dropped all the extras from that "Disc 2" from the SD DVD SE.. Not sure why. Then again e.g. "The Fly (1986)" included everything.. Go figure.

Right, which pisses me off to no end, but at least I'm aware of such before I choose to make a purchase or not. This case is far more insidious, IMO, because the packaging makes it look like all the extras have been carried over, but since many of them are truncated versions of what came before, they really haven't. There's no way (other than waiting past release day and hoping for someone to offer an intensively researched review) for the consumer to make an informed purchase decision with a marketing tactic like this.
Ernest Hemingway once wrote, "The world is a fine place and worth fighting for." I agree with the second part...
--Det. William Somerset, SE7EN

http://www.dvdanthol...-movielist.html), http://LDDb.com/coll....user=Filmmaker

#5 of 69 RickER

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Posted March 15 2008 - 05:08 AM

Not to mention FOX still has the highest MSRP of any of the studios. Course they always have, even back in the LD days.
I will buy this, but not for $27. When it comes from FOX, i wait for a sale. Even if it did have all the extras!

#6 of 69 Michael Reuben

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Posted March 15 2008 - 05:11 AM

Quote:
There's no way (other than waiting past release day and hoping for someone to offer an intensively researched review) for the consumer to make an informed purchase decision with a marketing tactic like this.
This is yet one more reason why I don't buy Fox Blu-ray discs until after they've been out for a while.

Steve Feldstein of Fox Home Entertainment has it half-right: Early adopters are willing to pay more. But the flip side to that coin is that we're savvy enough to know when we're being taken advantage of.

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#7 of 69 Marc Colella

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Posted March 15 2008 - 05:48 AM

Is this movie on a BD-25 by chance and they didn't have enough space for all the extras, so they started trimming? Otherwise, it makes no sense why they would remove/trim things from a BD-50 when there's more than enough room for everything.

This doesn't even seem like the standard double-dip attempt.

Very strange.

#8 of 69 Paul Hillenbrand

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Posted March 15 2008 - 05:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Colella
Is this movie on a BD-25 by chance and they didn't have enough space for all the extras, so they started trimming? Otherwise, it makes no sense why they would remove/trim things from a BD-50 when there's more than enough room for everything.

This doesn't even seem like the standard double-dip attempt.

Very strange.

Per the i, Robot link at High-Def Digest:
Quote:
Technical Specs

  • Blu-ray
  • BD-50 Dual-Layer Disc
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#9 of 69 Nick Graham

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Posted March 15 2008 - 06:02 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Reuben

Steve Feldstein of Fox Home Entertainment has it half-right: Early adopters are willing to pay more. But the flip side to that coin is that we're savvy enough to know when we're being taken advantage of.

M.


BINGO. I'm hoping this sentiment gets shared (respectfully but firmly) by many members at the upcoming meet and greet with Fox.

#10 of 69 Chris S

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Posted March 15 2008 - 07:12 AM

All of these sentiments are exactly why I've largely stayed away from Fox releases so far. Unless Amazon is running a 50%+ off sale I pass almost every time.
DVD & Blu-ray - It's all about the movies!

#11 of 69 MatthewA

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Posted March 15 2008 - 08:08 AM

I think there may be grounds for a class action suit here, or at the very least a bunch of negative publicity for Fox. This is just not acceptable.

Enough is enough, Disney. No more evasions or excuses. We DEMAND the release Song of the South on Blu-ray along with the uncut version of Bedknobs and Broomsticks on Blu-ray. I will not support anything your company produces until then.


#12 of 69 TravisR

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Posted March 15 2008 - 09:33 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MatthewA
I think there may be grounds for a class action suit here, or at the very least a bunch of negative publicity for Fox. This is just not acceptable.
Class action lawsuit? I'm not a lawyer but I can't quite see that.

#13 of 69 Stephen_J_H

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Posted March 15 2008 - 10:45 AM

Negative publicity? You bet! Class action suit? Erm, no. Show me where precisely Fox has an obligation to provide consumers with exactly the same special features as are available on SD versions. More importantly, show me where there is a fraudulent misrepresentation here. I don't see it.
"My opinion is that (a) anyone who actually works in a video store and does not understand letterboxing has given up on life, and (b) any customer who prefers to have the sides of a movie hacked off should not be licensed to operate a video player."-- Roger Ebert

#14 of 69 WillG

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Posted March 15 2008 - 02:33 PM

Quote:
Show me where precisely Fox has an obligation to provide consumers with exactly the same special features as are available on SD versions.

Well, it is kind of a screw job. I Know it's about presentation first and foremost, still, there is no reason why all the available extras should not be ported over. Hell, if it comes to it just throw another SD-DVD in the package for extras for an extra few pennies, like the Blade Runner release. Unless maybe it's a situation that has to do with fees that anyone involved with producing the extras would want if they were ported over to the new release. I'm not sure how that all works, outside of the standard "under 30 minutes" rule, so maybe it has nothing to do with that.

I just bought the ID4 BD and I was watching the trivia track which makes many mentions of the Special Edition cut of the film, which was availabe via seamless brancing on the Five Star release (and I guess possibly the other 200,000 SD-DVD versions out there) But why is not on the BD? I guess Fox hasn't mastered Seamless branching on BD yet.
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#15 of 69 Douglas Monce

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Posted March 15 2008 - 04:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris S
All of these sentiments are exactly why I've largely stayed away from Fox releases so far. Unless Amazon is running a 50%+ off sale I pass almost every time.


Exactly. I have bought exactly one Fox title because of the prices and lack of extra. Until Fox gets its act together I won't be buying any more.

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#16 of 69 EnricoE

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Posted March 15 2008 - 11:58 PM

personally i don't care much about the missing extras on this release or any other fox release i have the 2 disc dvd from (id4, planet of the
apes, from hell, cast away for example). i prefer high quality of audio and video. the only real extra i wanna see are the trailers of the films in hd. fox did on many releases a good job in providing them. but they didn't do so on i, robot Posted Image

on the other hand i also understand why many people getting upset about the missing or edited extras. either put everything on it or none at all, except trailers of course.

but for new releases of new films dvd and br extras should be equal or bd should have the edge. it's a joke that fox didn't release die hard 4 in the uncut version on br.

i also dislike fox's politics with the region coding on br releases. fox, get rid of it!!!

#17 of 69 Robert Crawford

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Posted March 16 2008 - 12:57 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by EnricoE
personally i don't care much about the missing extras on this release or any other fox release i have the 2 disc dvd from (id4, planet of the
apes, from hell, cast away for example). i prefer high quality of audio and video. the only real extra i wanna see are the trailers of the films in hd. fox did on many releases a good job in providing them. but they didn't do so on i, robot Posted Image

on the other hand i also understand why many people getting upset about the missing or edited extras. either put everything on it or none at all, except trailers of course.

but for new releases of new films dvd and br extras should be equal or bd should have the edge. it's a joke that fox didn't release die hard 4 in the uncut version on br.

i also dislike fox's politics with the region coding on br releases. fox, get rid of it!!!
I have those dvds too, but it's still not the right thing to do by Fox especially considering the amount of money they're charging us for these catalog titles.




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#18 of 69 Travis Brashear

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Posted March 16 2008 - 01:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen_J_H
More importantly, show me where there is a fraudulent misrepresentation here. I don't see it.

I don't know if that describes what they're doing (I'm so much not a lawyer, I can't even make it through an episode of LAW & ORDER, he he), but isn't titling the extra features identically to the SD version's (which has set the consumers' collective prior expectation) without any indicator that they have been altered from their previously released form "fraudulent misrepresentation"? If they had cut 1/4 of the footage from the film itself out without any indication of editing, surely that would have been fraudulent misrepresentation; what's the difference?
Ernest Hemingway once wrote, "The world is a fine place and worth fighting for." I agree with the second part...
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#19 of 69 Stephen_J_H

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Posted March 16 2008 - 02:10 AM

By the same token, when Universal released Jaws on DVD the first time with an edited version of the lengthy documentary contained on the deluxe laserdisc release, they made no indication that it was edited down. It's really no different from international and North American releases of films having different running times and different footage for various reasons. Is it deceptive? Oh, yeah! Is it fraud? Not really. Had Paramount not pulled the Jack Ryan HD DVDs from release, that would have been a good example of a release ripe for a class action suit (advertising features that weren't even on the discs).

Ultimately though, the question on a class action boils down to how much money a class action lawyer can drain out of a company. Software numbers for BD are still low enough that it isn't worth a class action lawyer's time to even bother.
"My opinion is that (a) anyone who actually works in a video store and does not understand letterboxing has given up on life, and (b) any customer who prefers to have the sides of a movie hacked off should not be licensed to operate a video player."-- Roger Ebert

#20 of 69 Michael Reuben

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Posted March 16 2008 - 02:51 AM

If a lawsuit like this were actually filed, there'd probably be another thread in After Hours about how the legal system is out of control and the lawyers should all be sanctioned. Posted Image

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