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PS3 and HD Player VS. Samsung Combo Player


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#1 of 24 OFFLINE   warren whit

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Posted December 27 2007 - 11:28 AM

As of now this is what my equipment looks like;
Sony Bravia 1080p Television
Denon 3808CI Receiver
40GB PS3 Updated with newest firmware
7 Polk Audio LSI speakers
SVS Dual 12 inch subwoofer


Now im wondering if i should buy the Samsung BD-UP5000 just get a seperate HD DVD player.

I'm not very familar with how the differnet sound technologies work (bitstream vs pcm, TRUE HD etc etc.). So basically Im wondering if my ps3 will be enough to give me the best sound possibly (running hdmi to receiver).

I've already spent over 10k on home theatre system, so spending more isn't a concern if i need to go with a better blu ray player, but if the ps3 will do the trick then i'll stick with that and purchase a HD DVD player this week. Thanks for any replies!

#2 of 24 OFFLINE   Earl Simpson

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Posted December 27 2007 - 11:04 PM

I bought one of each format but prefer my PS3 for everyday use. I think you will find that if you shop the sales you can get one of each cheaper and that will allow you to add a second BR/HD TV in another room. Working on my 3rd 1080P TV and I have the 46/2500 Sony as well as the Sharp 52". I may get the 40" Sony/40W 1080P model for the back room and my computer. Just a thought as you know you will buy another TV/LOL

PS/ hold off for a $100 A3 sale. When that happens you will need to jump. I got the A2 for $99 at Wal-Mart and have seen the A3 for as low as $100 (very rare at that price point/mostly around $180)
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#3 of 24 OFFLINE   Shane Martin

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Posted December 28 2007 - 12:41 AM

I bought a PS3 and an HD player as my combo but if I had to do it now, I'd buy the Panasonic BD30 + a Toshiba A35. I'd take that combo anyday and twice on Sunday over a Samsung. Samsung's aren't exactly the mark of quality for quality electronics. Both the Bd30 and the A35 will output bitstream audio to your 3808 thus you take FULL ADVANTAGE of the lossless audio codecs. Both of those players output bitstream for EVERY CURRENT HD AUDIO Format.

A PS3 + HD combo will not. The PS3 won't be able to output bitstream audio.

#4 of 24 OFFLINE   Robert Crawford

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Posted December 28 2007 - 04:45 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane Martin
I bought a PS3 and an HD player as my combo but if I had to do it now, I'd buy the Panasonic BD30 + a Toshiba A35. I'd take that combo anyday and twice on Sunday over a Samsung. Samsung's aren't exactly the mark of quality for quality electronics. Both the Bd30 and the A35 will output bitstream audio to your 3808 thus you take FULL ADVANTAGE of the lossless audio codecs. Both of those players output bitstream for EVERY CURRENT HD AUDIO Format.

A PS3 + HD combo will not. The PS3 won't be able to output bitstream audio.
I think the Samsungs are getting a bad rap. The Samsung-1000 is a very good player that did a bang up job for a first generation player especially being the first one on the market for that format. I bought that player way back in May/June 2006 at the same time with the RCA 5000 HD DVD player. Within a couple of weeks, I returned the 5000 and then bought a XA1 player. Without question, I had fewer problems with the 1000 than the XA1. That's not to say that the XA1 was a bad player, but I had more lockups with that player than the Samsung. Of course, the Samsung has been having more problems earlier this year due to these newer discs with more stuff on them, but with the latest firmware update, it's still doing a great job for me just that it's a lot slower than these new players and can't pass these latest audio codecs.

Now, with that said, I received my 5th and 6th high-def players this week for Christmas. Both of them are BR players that I'm going to keep because their gifts from some loved ones. One of them is the Samsung-1400 that is going to replace the 1000 and be placed in my bedroom HT along with the XA1. The second one is the Panny-BD30 that is being paired in my main HT with the XA2 that I bought last Christmas season so that both formats are covered in each of my HT setups. The 1400 with the latest firmware update is still having a few problems with the newer discs so I expect another firmware update for that one very soon. The BD30 has exhibited no problems so far with the latest firmware and has impressed me very much so.

IMO, I think all of these players will have problems now and then due to the latest discs being loaded up with a bunch of techno crap. However, at this time, I decided to cancel my preorder of the Samsung-5000 combo player because of the obvious reasons of not really needing it right now. Chances are I will get another high end player sometime in the future, but I'm hoping we have a more definitive answer to the format war by then since that player will be a more significant investment.





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#5 of 24 OFFLINE   RickER

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Posted December 28 2007 - 05:05 AM

Samsung as a brand does nothing for me. Its a step up from LG, hows that? I would buy Panasonic Blu-ray player, they make good stuff. I own the Sony BDS 300 Blu-ray player, and i love it. I had a Toshiba A2 HD player, and really didnt like the build of the machine, or the fact that it locked up on everything i played. That being said i like Toshiba as a brand. I own a Tosh Plasma, and it has a pleasing picture.

#6 of 24 OFFLINE   Robert Crawford

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Posted December 28 2007 - 05:23 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickER
Samsung as a brand does nothing for me. Its a step up from LG, hows that? I would buy Panasonic Blu-ray player, they make good stuff. I own the Sony BDS 300 Blu-ray player, and i love it. I had a Toshiba A2 HD player, and really didnt like the build of the machine, or the fact that it locked up on everything i played. That being said i like Toshiba as a brand. I own a Tosh Plasma, and it has a pleasing picture.
Samsung makes some of the best televisions out on the market.

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#7 of 24 OFFLINE   Earl Simpson

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Posted December 28 2007 - 10:20 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane Martin
I bought a PS3 and an HD player as my combo but if I had to do it now, I'd buy the Panasonic BD30 + a Toshiba A35. I'd take that combo anyday and twice on Sunday over a Samsung. Samsung's aren't exactly the mark of quality for quality electronics. Both the Bd30 and the A35 will output bitstream audio to your 3808 thus you take FULL ADVANTAGE of the lossless audio codecs. Both of those players output bitstream for EVERY CURRENT HD AUDIO Format.

////A PS3 + HD combo will not. The PS3 won't be able to output bitstream audio.////////////////
The PS3 does bitstream on all my DVDs and BRs. Are you talking about CDs? Have not tried a CD yet.
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#8 of 24 OFFLINE   Shane Martin

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Posted December 28 2007 - 03:02 PM

Quote:
The PS3 does bitstream on all my DVDs and BRs
It doesn't bitstream lossless at all and won't. It can't.

#9 of 24 OFFLINE   Brent M

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Posted December 28 2007 - 06:57 PM

I've been following all the information about the Samsung 5000 since it was first announced and after planning for months to buy one, now that it's finally available I'm going to pass on the machine after all. The thing just has way too many issues(2-channel TrueHD only from both analog and HDMI, incompatible with a myriad of discs--HD-DVDs, Blu-Ray and standard DVDs, reported video issues, Samsung's questionable reliability after problems with their other Blu-Ray players, the list goes on and on). It's a shame because I really wanted a dual format player that did it all and I was prepared to plop down the cash if this thing lived up to the hype, but after reading about all the problems with it I wouldn't even consider buying one now. I'm just going to keep my A1 and buy a PS3 for Blu-Ray playback.
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#10 of 24 OFFLINE   Earl Simpson

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Posted December 28 2007 - 10:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane Martin
It doesn't bitstream lossless at all and won't. It can't.
Hey, thats info that would be nice to have. Got a link man so I can read up. Thanks man. What is lost? I am getting all 6 channels. What am I missing?
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#11 of 24 OFFLINE   Earl Simpson

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Posted December 28 2007 - 10:28 PM

AVS Forum


Linear or Bitstream sound...need a geek to help me with this. - PLAYSTATION®3 General - PlayStation.com Forums


Bitstream is basically the PS3 sending audio signal directly to the reciever and the reciever decodes it.

Linear PCM is the PS3 decoding it, then sending the signal to the reciever.


if you are using a fiber optic cable, you want to use Bitstream, and have a reciever that can decode DD and DTS. Linear PCM outputs in only 2.0 with optical.


If you are using HDMI connection, You want to use Linear PCM. You can achieve DolbyTrueHD, Uncompressed PCM and hopefully soon with an upgrade,DTS-Master HD.

(granted, you can still use "bitstream" with HDMI...but if your reciever cannot decode HD audio...then PCM is your best bet.)
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#12 of 24 OFFLINE   Drew Reiber

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Posted December 29 2007 - 03:34 AM

I ended up buying the Samsung BD-5000 and though I haven't had many problems so far (one brief lockup), I'm aware of the audio issues and 4x3 stretching problem. I'm going to call Samsung for my own edification and then decide if this needs to go back or not.

Big update: I spoke with a higher-tier tech supporter at Samsung, and he said the unit IS supposed to support multi-channel TrueHD and they ARE working on solving the problem. They will then issue a firmware update and the issue will be resolved. He said that if someone else in customer support ever said that it wasn't, they were wrong. I think I am going to keep this player.

#13 of 24 OFFLINE   Brent M

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Posted December 29 2007 - 06:21 AM

Drew,

I have no doubts that Samsung will be issuing a firmware update for the 5000 soon, but I'm just wondering if they will be able to cure ALL of the players problems with the first update. I know from experience that it took a few firmware fixes to get my first-gen Toshiba A1 working properly. Since I only paid $300 for the machine I could live with its' glitches, but if I'm going to pay $800 for a dual-format player I want it to work properly right out of the box. Given Samsung's track record with their previous Blu-Ray players I don't have much faith that the 5000 will be any better. As I said before, I've had my eye on this player since August and was really hoping it would be the "all in one" solution I was looking for, but there are just too many potential pitfalls for me to justify buying one. Hopefully it will get better in time and I wish you luck with yours.
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#14 of 24 OFFLINE   Drew Reiber

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Posted December 29 2007 - 10:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent M
I have no doubts that Samsung will be issuing a firmware update for the 5000 soon, but I'm just wondering if they will be able to cure ALL of the players problems with the first update.

Are there any other major issues I should look out for? So far I haven't had any serious problems, but the least I could do is look into the bigger concerns out there and report whatever I find until my 30 day return period is up.

Quote:
I know from experience that it took a few firmware fixes to get my first-gen Toshiba A1 working properly.

I'm not really going to have the money for a proper home theatre sound system for a while, so I can wait out the TrueHD problem. Otherwise, I might get around to a Fox DVD sooner or later (Die Hard trilogy) and see if there are any problems there. I've heard from a few people that they didn't have any trouble, so some of these glitches may be related to certain units. The AVS thread pointed out there are a few different software versions already, so who knows if I got one of the more problematic ones.

Quote:
Since I only paid $300 for the machine I could live with its' glitches, but if I'm going to pay $800 for a dual-format player I want it to work properly right out of the box.

Again, I haven't personally encountered any major problems. It locked up once during Batman Begins, but I was probably sending way too many commands to the player as I had no idea what I was doing. I also don't know if I'm going to go out of my way to buy two seperate players and still have to drop more money for HDMI cables when this unit takes care of most of demands.

A friend recommended Samsung's BD1400 and Toshiba's A35 as alternatives, but I need someone to explain to me how much of a difference I would see in features and capability if I were to switch to these units. I asked this question on the other thread I put up, but nobody had responded yet.

Quote:
Given Samsung's track record with their previous Blu-Ray players I don't have much faith that the 5000 will be any better.

What is their track record? A friend of mine that works at Circuit City is a BD nutcase and he swears by Samsung. Did you have some poor personal experiences with their products that you could tell me about?

Quote:
As I said before, I've had my eye on this player since August and was really hoping it would be the "all in one" solution I was looking for, but there are just too many potential pitfalls for me to justify buying one. Hopefully it will get better in time and I wish you luck with yours.

Thanks, man. I'm just so completely new to these formats and high-definition in general, I'm trying to keep things simplified. If this player proves too much of a hassle in the next few weeks, I still have plenty of time to back out. However, so far, so good...

#15 of 24 OFFLINE   Brent M

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Posted December 29 2007 - 12:00 PM

Hey Drew,

I've followed a lot of the Blu-Ray threads over at AVS Forum as I tried to decide on which player I should get. In my extensive reading, I heard a ton of horror stories about the Samsung BD1400, BD1200 and BD1000 players. In fact, some people went so far as to say Samsung makes the most unreliable Blu-Ray players on the market today. Needless to say, I was very disheartened by all of this as I had the 5000 targeted as my all one HD solution. Now that I know about their poor track record when it comes to quality, however, I've decided that even if the 5000 does address all the audio, video and compatibility issues with a firmware update I'm still going to resist the urge to buy one. At this point, I think my best bet is to either keep my A1 or try finding an XA2 for HD-DVD and get a Playstation 3 or one of the Panasonic players(BD10 or BD30) for Blu-Ray. It's almost a consensus that the PS3 and Panny machines are the best Blu-Ray players on the market today so I don't think you can go wrong with either one. Good luck on whatever you choose to do and please keep us posted on how the 5000 performs for you. Posted Image
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#16 of 24 OFFLINE   Drew Reiber

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Posted December 29 2007 - 09:45 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent M
I've followed a lot of the Blu-Ray threads over at AVS Forum as I tried to decide on which player I should get. In my extensive reading, I heard a ton of horror stories about the Samsung BD1400, BD1200 and BD1000 players. In fact, some people went so far as to say Samsung makes the most unreliable Blu-Ray players on the market today.

Can you please tell me what the unreliability issues were? All the comments I saw on AVS regarding the BD1400 was that it had similar problems to the BD-UP5000, which were fixed with firmware. I would very much like to know what other issues I should keep an eye out for.

Quote:
It's almost a consensus that the PS3 and Panny machines are the best Blu-Ray players on the market today so I don't think you can go wrong with either one. Good luck on whatever you choose to do and please keep us posted on how the 5000 performs for you. Posted Image

I'm not going to give Sony money for a PS3, and that for me is a situation where I refuse to support blantant disregard, manipulation and dishonesty towards their supposedly valued consumers. Did you know they are intentionally disabling the cheaper PS3's emulation to force software purchases? Did you know that all the features they claimed were dropped due to capacity or feasibility were just to make it cheaper to produce? That's just the first two things that come to mind, before I even get the fact they're selling a DVD player under the guise of an upgrade in gameplay. Ugh.

If I drop the 5000, I'm probably going to pick up a Toshiba A35 and just distance myself from Blu-Ray for a while. So far I have consistently discovered they come with the most problems and the least features. I even had to return Blade Runner and Superman: The Movie because they were missing items found on the HD-DVD versions. Sony isn't even producing that many players compatible with their new 1.1 profile, which leads me to suspect this is another tactic to sell their PS3s. No thank you.

In the end, the compatibility and convenience of having an all-in-one unit like the 5000 is the *ONLY* reason I have (or will have) Blu-ray capability at all right now or in the forseeable future.

#17 of 24 OFFLINE   Earl Simpson

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Posted December 29 2007 - 10:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent M
Hey Drew,

I've followed a lot of the Blu-Ray threads over at AVS Forum as I tried to decide on which player I should get. In my extensive reading, I heard a ton of horror stories about the Samsung BD1400, BD1200 and BD1000 players. In fact, some people went so far as to say Samsung makes the most unreliable Blu-Ray players on the market today. Needless to say, I was very disheartened by all of this as I had the 5000 targeted as my all one HD solution. Now that I know about their poor track record when it comes to quality, however, I've decided that even if the 5000 does address all the audio, video and compatibility issues with a firmware update I'm still going to resist the urge to buy one. At this point, I think my best bet is to either keep my A1 or try finding an XA2 for HD-DVD and get a Playstation 3 or one of the Panasonic players(BD10 or BD30) for Blu-Ray. It's almost a consensus that the PS3 and Panny machines are the best Blu-Ray players on the market today so I don't think you can go wrong with either one. Good luck on whatever you choose to do and please keep us posted on how the 5000 performs for you. Posted Image
Thats what I did and am happy so far. Time will tell but I do have the PS3 60 version and have not heard any bad things about the other 3 versions. Wireless internet and media readers are not that important to most people and the 40 version may be the way to go and the cheapest. Have not bought a bad Sony, HK, Pioneer, JVC, Onkyo, Denon, Panasonic, or a Sharp product yet. Always a first time though! LOL
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#18 of 24 OFFLINE   ManW_TheUncool

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Posted December 30 2007 - 12:09 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew Reiber
I'm not going to give Sony money for a PS3, and that for me is a situation where I refuse to support blantant disregard, manipulation and dishonesty towards their supposedly valued consumers. Did you know they are intentionally disabling the cheaper PS3's emulation to force software purchases?

I'm not a Sony fanboy -- my new PS3 is my first Sony purchase in ages -- but I wonder if this line of thinking isn't either merely counterproductive or somewhat misguided though. RE: the "disabling" of emulation for PS/PS2 games (in the PS3/40GB I assume), it's not like they're disabling something that they marketed to buyers of the PS3/40GB. They're just offering that version w/out the backwards compatibility plain and simple -- though no doubt some folks bought it before realizing anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew Reiber
Did you know that all the features they claimed were dropped due to capacity or feasibility were just to make it cheaper to produce?

I don't know what their exact/explicit claims were, but I don't see why those need to be mutually exclusive to the motive of "cheaper to produce". They're a business, and their bottom line is to make $$$. Some aspects of that involve cutting costs. And when I hear mention of reducing capacity and/or feasibility requirements, I also hear cost cutting as a major motive. And if I understand correctly, they don't directly make $$$ off the PS3 machine itself -- and might well be losing some $$$ as seems to be the case (or claim anyway) w/ every game console maker. So it's not even like they're cutting costs so they can directly make more $$$ off the sale of each machine. I suspect they're just making whatever needed adjustments to fit the new(?) marketing strategy for that particular version of the PS3. Since you're not forced to choose that particular version over the other one(s), I don't see what's wrong w/ that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew Reiber
That's just the first two things that come to mind, before I even get the fact they're selling a DVD player under the guise of an upgrade in gameplay. Ugh.

Not sure I understand what you mean there. Are you saying they're selling the PS3/40GB as a BD/DVD player w/ the bonus of PS3 gaming feature? OR are you saying they're selling it as a gaming machine (w/out backward compatilibility) w/ the bonus of BD/DVD playback? What's wrong w/ either anyhow given the price point?

FWIW, I just bought my PS3/40GB as a good BD/DVD player w/ the bonus of PS3 gaming and whatever other rudimentary media center and internet capabilities. For the price, seems to make good sense. Someone else who wants more could just spend the extra $100 on the 80GB version -- and it's not like the price went up for that one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew Reiber
Sony isn't even producing that many players compatible with their new 1.1 profile, which leads me to suspect this is another tactic to sell their PS3s. No thank you.

Actually, seems like the PS3 is the only Sony machine w/ profile 1.1, and that was only after the very recent software update. Can't say I see this as a "tactic to sell PS3's" as much as them just not being on the ball w/ getting things done overall. If they don't come out w/ any profile 1.1 standalones soon (other than maybe some sort of new ES flagship model), then maybe I can see them just going w/ the PS3 as their lower end model for profile 1.1 BD. If it makes business sense, maybe they'll even strip it down some more to market as a standalone BD/DVD player (w/out the gaming) that can be produced in the same assembly line as other PS3's. If that results in lower prices for the consumer w/out lost in BD/DVD playback quality, I don't see what's wrong w/ that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew Reiber
In the end, the compatibility and convenience of having an all-in-one unit like the 5000 is the *ONLY* reason I have (or will have) Blu-ray capability at all right now or in the forseeable future.

Well, I'd much prefer to only have 1 player too, so I can certainly empathize. In my case, I'm doing the opposite and opted to jump into BD w/ the PS3/40GB instead. I won't hold my breath waiting for a good uni-player to become affordable enough for me. And it's also not clear to me that it's worthwhile investing all that much into *both* formats just yet. To each his own I guess...

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#19 of 24 OFFLINE   millionairewes

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Posted December 30 2007 - 06:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren Whit
I've already spent over 10k on home theatre system, so spending more isn't a concern if i need to go with a better blu ray player, but if the ps3 will do the trick then i'll stick with that and purchase a HD DVD player this week. Thanks for any replies!

Warren,

The PS3 is capable of outputting Dolby TrueHD (via HDMI ONLY) to a receiver (likes yours) that can decode Dolby TrueHD. DTS-HD Master Audio is currently not available via the PS3. (lets keep praying for a future firmware upgrade). Right now one of the Blu-Ray titles that I know of in Dolby TrueHD 7.1 is "Rush Hour 3". Check it out and let me know how the sound is. If your planning to get and HD DVD player and are looking for movies that have DTS-HD master Audio then a good web site that let you know the type of DTS audio is the dts web site, find the dvd titles link.
Just remember that you can still have HD sound at 5.1 in both Dolby and DTS. Try to look for 7.1 somewhere in the case. HD audio 5.1, still sounds better than any other 5.1 format.

#20 of 24 OFFLINE   spider

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Posted December 30 2007 - 11:56 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by millionairewes
Warren,

The PS3 is capable of outputting Dolby TrueHD (via HDMI ONLY) to a receiver (likes yours) that can decode Dolby TrueHD.

Sorry for interupting the conversation. But can you let me know how to set this up the get the reciever to decode TrueHD coming from the PS3? Is it Bitstream on HDMI? Tried it with Spiderman3 what claims on the case to have TrueHD track. Playback information of the PS3 is showing the same.

Thanks
/Ronny


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