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Batman Begins & Matrix - How come these are on HD and not Blu-ray?


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#41 of 72 OFFLINE   Paul Arnette

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Posted November 11 2007 - 12:24 PM

Not at all. However, there are two threads designated for format war talk, and this isn't one of them. I originally recommended this thread be closed because there was already one opened on this very subject, and I knew it would be impossible to discuss it without straying into the format war. The original thread was beaten to death, just as this one is being, with the same predictable results. Do you really think you are contributing any new insights here with respect to why these titles are being withheld on BD? I've come to enjoy having format war talk restricted to two threads. It reduces clutter and the membership tends to get along better outside those threads when we talk about the HDM we actually can buy and enjoy. The mods seem to be willing to give us some rope with posts that touch on the format war, though I'm never surprised by our knack for hanging ourselves with it.
Universal Blu-ray Discs I will not be buying while they're offered only as Blu-ray + DVD 'flipper' discs:

The Jackal
, Out of Africa, and Traffic.

#42 of 72 OFFLINE   Brandon Conway

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Posted November 11 2007 - 12:26 PM

I find the PS3 argument to be weak.

"And now the reprimand, from an American critic. He reproaches me for using film as a sacred & lasting medium, like a painting or a book. He does not believe that filmmaking is an inferior art, but he believes, and quite rightly, that a reel goes quickly, that the public are looking above all for relaxation, that film is fragile and that it is pretentious to express the power of one's soul by such ephemeral and delicate means, that Charlie Chaplin's or Buster Keaton's first films can only be seen on very rare and badly spoiled prints. I add that the cinema is making daily progress and that eventually films that we consider marvelous today will soon be forgotten because of new dimensions & colour. This is true. But for 4 weeks this film [The Blood of a Poet] has been shown to audiences that have been so attentive, so eager & so warm, that I wonder after all there is not an anonymous public who are looking for more than relaxation in the cinema." - Jean Cocteau, 1932


#43 of 72 OFFLINE   Chris Maynard

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Posted November 11 2007 - 12:30 PM

I saw several things he mentioned. Why is it that so many members here are quick to say " please close this thread?" or "I am gonna tell the moderators on you!" Relax. It is just the Internet and you shouldn't get so butt-hurt if someone disagrees with you.
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#44 of 72 OFFLINE   DaViD Boulet

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Posted November 11 2007 - 12:37 PM

No hurt feelings here. Just tired of having discussion about a "topic" inevitably turn into personal insults. Is it too much to ask that we avoid it?
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#45 of 72 OFFLINE   Robert George

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Posted November 11 2007 - 01:03 PM

Your statement lies at the crux of the "problem". To you (meaning those that are still stuck on this as a competition), any time there is a conversation where anything negative is said about one format or the other, it's a "war". What some of you haven't figured out yet is that for some of us are past this. You see, for those of us that have moved beyond the rhetoric and bullshit that is being perpetuated by those corporate parties that are deeply invested in this so-called war, there is only the simple fact that there are two formats. Some of us that have lived with BOTH formats for a while now are more interested in discussing these things on a factual basis. We really don't care that Warner has some things on HD DVD that they don't have on Blu-ray. We are more concerned that Fox is not supporting either format. Talking about Fox not fully supporting Blu-ray is not format war rhetoric, it is a simple acknowledgment that one of the major studios is not helping with the adoption of HDM in general, and specifically, not releasing the product we want. If that sound selfish, well, duh. I don't spend my hard-earned money so that Sony or Toshiba "wins" some competition. I spend my money on what gives me pleasure. Right now, that happens to be high definition movies and that also happens to mean two formats. I'm not a format cheerleader, and frankly, I don't like people that are. They are not doing me any good and they are not doing the hobby any good. So, you don't like "format war rhetoric". Great. Neither do I. That doesn't mean I'm going to ignore the technical shortcomings of either format or the stupid (IMO) decisions I see being made by the companies involved all the time. Pointing out Blu-ray costs more to produce than HD DVD, and therefore affects the decisions some studios are making, is not format war rhetoric. It is a simple acknowledgment of the way things are. People that can't discuss the realities of the marketplace and the technical state of this technology need to back up and reevaluate what their priorities are. [/rant]

#46 of 72 OFFLINE   Chris Maynard

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Posted November 11 2007 - 01:22 PM

It is no secret we are friends but damn if that post just didn't say it all!

Where is the "I'm With Stupid" smiley when you need it?

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#47 of 72 OFFLINE   Paul Arnette

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Posted November 11 2007 - 01:55 PM

Well, I would like to think that I've gotten past the format war too. However, you and I apparently have different ideas about what belongs in the "format war threads". I see discussions about Warner releasing some titles on HD DVD vs. BD as a topic for the "Official HTF HD Formats Industry/Retailer/Studio Support Thread", while those who are interested in having a discussion of the "technical shortcomings of either format" should feel free to head on over to the "Official HTF HD Formats Comparison Thread". I do not hold this position because I think that I am incapable having these discussions elsewhere, or that I do not wish to hear anything negative about my preferred format. I hold this position because I've seen positives of keeping these subjects from spilling into virtually every other topic in this forum as they had before. Namely, the membership gets along better, the focus returns to HDM, and if I don't want to be bombarded with the format war, I know to stay out of those threads. That is what I thought the HTF was trying to accomplish with their policy, and I think it has been a success. Those who say that I can just as easily stay out of this thread are correct, but, again, I thought the point of the HTF new format war policy was that I shouldn't have to. Nevertheless, I shall leave you all to beat this dead horse some more if that is your wish.
Universal Blu-ray Discs I will not be buying while they're offered only as Blu-ray + DVD 'flipper' discs:

The Jackal
, Out of Africa, and Traffic.

#48 of 72 OFFLINE   Chris Maynard

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Posted November 11 2007 - 02:02 PM

First of all there is nothing "dead" about this horse. Second of all, while some may think this policy is a success on HTF others may argue that some spirited discussion is much needed on this forum. "Other" forums are much more active but I will not try to argue the quantity vs. quality debate which I find subjective at best. I remember when the HTF could have spirited discussion like back in the day of DTS vs. DD without screaming for the Yard Duty teacher.

I did nothing...I did absolutely nothing and it was everything I thought it could be..

#49 of 72 OFFLINE   DaViD Boulet

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Posted November 11 2007 - 02:03 PM

I've got an idea. It should be fun. Let's take turns having each other's opinions. Like a musical-chairs of ideas and we can switch/off rotate every couple of days. As an example Robert and I can switch positions: for a day or two I can argue that Blu-ray's primary market is gamers and he can argue for why one format, BD, would be better for the HT community than two. Should be fun. Then we could all have a raffle and swap with a new "mystery" idea... like one of those gag-gift Christmas parties. And you can't give away whether or not your present contains a pro HD DVD, Pro BD, or format-neutral prize! No red or blue colored wrapping paper allowed.

Maybe after exhausting every argument on every side of every issue... ourselves... we'll then be able to move on keep themed-discussions on track?

Ok... don't try to guess what's in my gag-gift!

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#50 of 72 OFFLINE   Robert George

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Posted November 11 2007 - 04:01 PM

You just absolutely refuse to "get it", don't you. You can want one format from now till doomsday but that will not change what is. There are two formats, and there will continue to be two formats for a long time. The reason there continues to be "format war rhetoric" is because of people like you that just can't move on. You ASSUME that because I'm not a format cheerleader that I am not of the opinion that one format would be better than two. Of course one format would be better than two, but guess what, neither format is that "one". Both formats are dogs with different fleas. Because a few big, rich corporations could not get past their egos long enough to agree on one format, we, the consumer, are stuck with two compromises. The difference between you and me is I accept that and try to make the best of it.

#51 of 72 OFFLINE   DaViD Boulet

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Posted November 11 2007 - 04:43 PM

Robert. Lighten up. Hence my joke. Relax.
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#52 of 72 OFFLINE   Douglas Monce

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Posted November 11 2007 - 04:43 PM

I think your theory is basically sound for Warners release strategy for last year, however this year Warner has consistently released catalog titles on both formats. For example The Cowboys, Rio Bravo, Bullitt, Lethal Weapon 1 & 2, The Superman Movies, The Road Warrior, The Kubrick Films, The Searchers, Twilight Zone the Movie... I think the more likely reason that films such as Casablanca and Forbidden Planet have not yet been put onto blu-ray, maybe the some what limited production chain. It maybe all the plants can do to keep up with new releases. So rather than getting behind on their new titles coming out, Warner is just holding off on the older HD DVD exclusives until they won't delay anything else. Doug
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#53 of 72 OFFLINE   Brandon Conway

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Posted November 11 2007 - 05:55 PM

Exactly, Doug. Exactly.

"And now the reprimand, from an American critic. He reproaches me for using film as a sacred & lasting medium, like a painting or a book. He does not believe that filmmaking is an inferior art, but he believes, and quite rightly, that a reel goes quickly, that the public are looking above all for relaxation, that film is fragile and that it is pretentious to express the power of one's soul by such ephemeral and delicate means, that Charlie Chaplin's or Buster Keaton's first films can only be seen on very rare and badly spoiled prints. I add that the cinema is making daily progress and that eventually films that we consider marvelous today will soon be forgotten because of new dimensions & colour. This is true. But for 4 weeks this film [The Blood of a Poet] has been shown to audiences that have been so attentive, so eager & so warm, that I wonder after all there is not an anonymous public who are looking for more than relaxation in the cinema." - Jean Cocteau, 1932


#54 of 72 OFFLINE   Patrick.C

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Posted November 12 2007 - 04:35 AM

But you need to differentiate between the two. There's catalog titles, and then there's catalog titles. You can't lump 70's/80's films like Superman and Lethal Weapon together with Grand Prix and Forbidden Planet. As film enthusiasts, we know and love them all. But Superman and Mel Gibson have a much wider appeal to your average Joe 6 Pack than Grand Prix and Forbidden Planet. When I purchased Grand Prix back on release date, I couldn't find anyone in my circle of friends and relatives that had even heard of it - including parents and grandparents that were in their 30's or higher when it came out! I don't think their strategy has changed. If Grand Prix and Forbidden Planet were being released today, in November 2007, I don't think they would be on both formats. With the relatively limited appeal they have in the overall market, I can see how it would make sense to not release on both formats.

#55 of 72 OFFLINE   Douglas Monce

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Posted November 12 2007 - 05:22 AM

Yes but surely you'll give me Bullitt and Rio Bravo. I think you'd have to call those classic catalog titles. And The Searchers is an example of one that was exclusive and they eventually got around to putting onto blu-ray. Frankly I think that Warners has shown that everything they are doing now is going onto both formats even if they can't put all the same features on the blu-ray version. Doug
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#56 of 72 OFFLINE   Grant H

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Posted November 12 2007 - 05:27 AM

I believe only the Director's Cut is on Blu-ray. The theatrical version was previously released on HD DVD only.
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#57 of 72 OFFLINE   Shane Martin

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Posted November 12 2007 - 11:22 AM

Yup.

#58 of 72 OFFLINE   Dave Moritz

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Posted November 27 2007 - 03:04 AM

According to HighDefDigest both Batman Begins and The Ultimate Matrix Collection is to be anounced, no current release date. I have wondered why these titles did not get released on Blu-ray around the same time as the HD-DVD release. But it does not matter as far as I am concerned because I allready own the on HD-DVD. If these titles would have come out earlier on Blu-ray I would have purchased them in Blu-ray instead, oh well. Posted Image

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#59 of 72 OFFLINE   DaViD Boulet

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Posted November 27 2007 - 04:13 AM

Warner was waiting for PIP for the BD release. This has been known since the HD DVD release hit the streets. Why are people still wondering why these titles weren't released on BD along side the HD DVD?
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#60 of 72 OFFLINE   Nick

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Posted November 27 2007 - 04:28 AM

thanks for asking. I was wondering about that myself. I thought it was some kind of feature that HD-DVD has over Bluray.