1789 replies to this topic

[jompaul17]

A thought occurred to me as I was watching a MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE, coincidentally a Sutton Roley-directed episode from around 1971 called "Blast", and that is something that I think was mentioned before, but it just sank in - that Season 7 was where MANNIX was on the air alone of the former "Desilu Big Three".

 

For yet more coincidences, I'd also just watched a FUGITIVE episode from the third season of that show called "Wings Of An Angel". It was made prior to the start of MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE and co-starred Greg Morris as a prison inmate. Flash forward to last evening and I'm watching "Climb A Deadly Mountain", and who shows up? Greg Morris, fresh from his now-former MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE gig, playing an escaped prison inmate. Sometimes it boggles the mind.

 

Unfortunately, Mr. Sandman got the better of me and I nodded off about 15 minutes into the story.

 

Harry

Harry,

 

Along those lines, notice how Joe's office was re-decorated, almost re-modeled, for season 7, lasting into season 8.    It sort of morphs from a kind of Spanish-Mediterranean kind of office into a hunting lodge with Spanish-Mediterranean influence.  They add this dark wood around everything, and put lots more pictures on the wall, along with an old rifle, a large American Eagle and at least one sailing ship.  The basic furniture remains the same, but the couch and guest chairs change from leather upholstery to a striped, cloth pattern.

 

When it happened, it was kind of shocking.   I liked the simplicity of the old office.   But, that simplicity served a practical purpose -- going back to the Desilu big final three.   Watching Mission: Impossible closely reveals that sets were shared quite a bit between the two series, especially Joe's office and apartment.  They would remove the pictures from the office walls, move most of the furniture out,  add a cheap and slow-moving paddle fan overhead and viola -- Joe's office would serve as some third world dictator's office.

 

But, all this moving around meant that the stagehands didn't pay a whole lot of attention to where the pictures belonged on Joe's office walls.   The basic things mostly -- mostly -- stayed put, like the barometer/thermometer and the picture of Joe in his football jersey.  But, the secondary pictures moved all over the place as they didn't put them back properly.

 

There is this scene in season 4's "Bang Bang, You're Dead" where Peggy is straightening the pictures in her office.  I thought it was sort of funny in that she would have been the logical one to keep moving all of those pictures around -- I still wonder if it wasn't some sort of inside joke.    

 

So, after Mission went away, Joe finally got his own office without having to share it, and the pictures on the walls never move around in seasons 7 and 8.  His apartment did not get the same kind of remodeling job -- maybe because he could not get a tax write-off for that?

 

We've noted here before how easy it is to fall asleep while watching Mannix.   I'm sure -- sure -- many detractors of this thread will say it is because the series is boring.   But, that certainly isn't the case for me.    The series -- and character -- are actually incredibly comforting.   It makes you feel good that there are people like that around, and even comfort that it is OK to wind up getting hurt yourself.   Life is never so full of anxiety as when you feel so protective of pretty much anything.  

 

Actually, one of the great benefits I've experienced by being re-united with the series is that I sleep much better.    And, when it comes right down to it, sleeping well and with less anxiety eliminates all sorts of problems.

 

"Climb a Deadly Mountain" is one of my favorite episodes of the series.   I love the whole theme -- lots of symbolism in that episode, the scenes with Peggy and Art and especially that great ending. 

 

Just imagine seeing that first-run, after being invested with those characters for the previous seasons. 

 

Makes me want to watch it again...

Edited by jompaul17, May 13 2013 - 08:28 AM.

[Harry-N]

7.04 "Little Girl Lost" - a title use often in movies and TV. One of its more famous uses is an old TWILIGHT ZONE where a young girl slips into another dimension in her bedroom. The MANNIX story of course features a little girl, and for a time she's a bit "lost", but not in another dimension.

 

Some rather interesting casting in this episode, starting with the coincidental pairing of Beverly Garland and Dawn Lyn. Those two played mother and daughter for a couple of the ending years of MY THREE SONS, though in this MANNIX they have no scenes together. Julie Adams had done a first season MANNIX, and some other Desilu show veterans appear here. Sam Elliott had appeared as a semi-regular team member in MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE, Barry Atwater had a memorable role as Surak, Vulcan leader on STAR TREK, Gary Walberg did a quick scene on STAR TREK as well, and HM Wynant had also done a prior MANNIX, along with being in another famous TWILIGHT ZONE, "The Howling Man". And last but not least is Pernell Roberts, with a long and distinguished career in television.

 

The L.A. Zoo gets some time in this episode, too, and was memorably featured in the final two-part episode of THE FUGITIVE.

 

The young girl mentions that she can see "inside" people and that she knew that Joe Mannix was good because he "looked " like her late father on the inside - a heart-warming moment.

 

Harry

[jompaul17]

7.04 "Little Girl Lost" - a title use often in movies and TV. One of its more famous uses is an old TWILIGHT ZONE where a young girl slips into another dimension in her bedroom. The MANNIX story of course features a little girl, and for a time she's a bit "lost", but not in another dimension.

 

Some rather interesting casting in this episode, starting with the coincidental pairing of Beverly Garland and Dawn Lyn. Those two played mother and daughter for a couple of the ending years of MY THREE SONS, though in this MANNIX they have no scenes together. Julie Adams had done a first season MANNIX, and some other Desilu show veterans appear here. Sam Elliott had appeared as a semi-regular team member in MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE, Barry Atwater had a memorable role as Surak, Vulcan leader on STAR TREK, Gary Walberg did a quick scene on STAR TREK as well, and HM Wynant had also done a prior MANNIX, along with being in another famous TWILIGHT ZONE, "The Howling Man". And last but not least is Pernell Roberts, with a long and distinguished career in television.

 

The L.A. Zoo gets some time in this episode, too, and was memorably featured in the final two-part episode of THE FUGITIVE.

 

The young girl mentions that she can see "inside" people and that she knew that Joe Mannix was good because he "looked " like her late father on the inside - a heart-warming moment.

 

Harry

Harry,

 

That cast is also interesting because it formed the basis of the 1998 Diagnosis Murder episode that brought Joe Mannix back one more time -- supposedly they continued the "unresolved" case of who actually murdered the little girl's father. 

 

MC is quoted (I can't remember where now -- maybe the season 1 DVDS?) as saying they picked that episode because of the number of guest stars that were still alive, but I bet it is also because there were quite few "names" in that episode, especially Garland and Roberts, who were both available in 1998.   The little girl (Dawn Lyn), however, apparently no longer acts, so they brought in someone else to play the adult version. 

 

As mentioned here before, I have mixed feelings about the DM episode.  It was great to see MC play Joe again, and they included all sorts of "symbolic" elements of the character.    But, extending that story like that sort of ruins the original version -- and now that we have the original back, it can take away something from the original story to even think that the story was extended in the way it was.

 

Because, you are right -- it was kind of a heartwarming story, especially with the "moment" you describe -- which is not only nice, but generally true of certain people.

 

Then again, what else were the people behind the DM episode going to do? 

 

Because it did not include Goff and Roberts, I never really considered the DM episode a valid Mannix episode -- a virtual 195th episode -- it was just something fun. 

 

Towards that end, I think everyone should have their own notion of what happened to Joe and Peggy after the series ended -- left to the viewers imagination, as so many elements of story were in the tightly edited episodes with the often abrupt endings that practically demanded such imagination fill in the gaps and extend the endings into viewer-told continuations. 

 

Mannix also used the LA Zoo multiple times (s4's "A Ticket to the Eclipse" comes to mind).   And, Mannix also used an amusement park in s3's "Once Upon a Saturday" as well as s2's "In Need of a Friend."  I have wondered if either (or both?) was the same one used in the final episode of The Fugitive.

Edited by jompaul17, May 16 2013 - 09:18 AM.

[Harry-N]

Starting the second disc of S7, I watched 7.05 "The Gang's All Here", where once again something's happened to Joe, and Peggy and Malcolm are out trying to find him. The seemed rather soon after "Climb A Deady Mountain", though other than the Joe-alone-and-injured premise, the two are quite different.

 

The late Paul Carr does one of his six turns in different roles in Mannix, looking quite '70s-ish with the long hair and bushy mustache. The New York Street set gets a workout here and so does poor Joe. The man winces like no other!

 

Harry

[jompaul17]

Starting the second disc of S7, I watched 7.05 "The Gang's All Here", where once again something's happened to Joe, and Peggy and Malcolm are out trying to find him. The seemed rather soon after "Climb A Deady Mountain", though other than the Joe-alone-and-injured premise, the two are quite different.

 

The late Paul Carr does one of his six turns in different roles in Mannix, looking quite '70s-ish with the long hair and bushy mustache. The New York Street set gets a workout here and so does poor Joe. The man winces like no other!

 

Harry

Harry,

 

I love the ending of "The Gang's All Here."  

 

I know when they did it, that MC and GF weren't looking at each other -- it was a single-camera show.  But, they probably did do the scene together, and multiple times at that, considering the multiple camera angles.

 

Beyond that being yet another great ending with them together within a couple of weeks, the other being "Climb a Deadly Mountain," the meaning behind that scene is timeless.  I even like the story of that episode, the young kid who first tries to find his identity with a gang -- a group -- but ultimately finds the courage through the spirit of his dead father, and help from Joe, to be his own man -- to become his own man, even risking himself in the process.

 

I just love that theme.

 

And, you are right, MC winced and showed pain better than anyone else I know -- he didn't overdo it, but he tended to be comfortable expressing it.  Greatness in a can -- literally, when you consider the film in the can!

 

It was, indeed, strange that "Climb a Deadly Mountain" and "The Gang's All Here" were aired so close to each other.  They are not only shown two weeks apart, they are two production numbers apart and done so early in the season.   And, they both involved some shooting that seemed different -- one on a mountain and the other with scenes on the Paramount lot that seem to have been done at night.

 

But, notice how, in season 4, the three episodes "The World Between,"  "The Mouse That Died" and "What Happened to Sunday?" were production numbers 81, 82, and 83, respectively.  They all had "hospital' themes and were consecutively shot, but were not shown that close to each other -- the latter show seemed to be held for months before being shown.    It is by far the only season that had underlying themes and episodes filmed close to each other -- as mentioned before, "The Sound of Darkness" was practically set-up in almost every episode of season 3 that aired before it.

 

The surprising thing about these two episodes were how closely they were shown together.

 

Beyond the obvious "where's Joe -- we know he's in trouble and can't find him" theme, setting up similar scenes with Peggy and Art, it's almost as if the show was trying to say to its fans -- hey we know we got away from this sort of thing in season 6, but we're letting you know we are back!

 

Beyond that, notice how these two episodes sort of pair up in other ways -- they set types of scenes that are curiously missing from "The Dark Hours" an episode that comes much later in the season but which was designed to be a feature for that season.    You sort of feel cheated from some scenes in that episode, which is brilliantly done to be something less than ordinary.  But, those scenes that you feel are missing are actually there in "Climb a Deadly Mountain" and "The Gang's All Here."    And, I've read where scripts for the whole year are picked early in the production season, essentially first.

 

Now, did the producers do this on purpose, or was this an accident?

 

I have found, since researching this series, that there was much more intention behind what you see on the screen than one might initially anticipate -- things I never expected were meant to be a conscious and well-considered departure from both PIs of the past as well as the emerging trend towards lesser heroic types were very much on purpose, by design and for good reasons.

 

I find this information in old articles and interviews -- and it makes me love this series and character all that much more. 

[Harry-N]

7.06 "Desert Run" is one of those Joe-in-a-strange-town episodes. Great cast that includes Ford Rainey, Kenneth Tobey, Mark Lenard, and Jeanette Nolan.

 

It's a great example of economy of story-telling. Early on, Joe is flying his rented plane with James Sikking, looking for the plane crash site. Not finding it, they spot a town that's supposedly deserted. In a split second, Joe's parking his rent-a-car in that town. Then after being admonished by the townspeople to leave, we're again instantly thrust into a scene with Mannix driving up to his client's supposed house - in a totally different rental car!

 

This all happened in an era where show producers had a lot more time to tell their stories, yet in order to get even lengthier stories told, the Mannix showrunners used this then-uncommon visual style where scenes just jump-cut to the next one without unnecessary exposition.

 

Today's shows are so short, they HAVE to do this - and they have their actors speak so quickly that you often miss part of the story trying to digest what was just said.

 

Harry

[jompaul17]

7.06 "Desert Run" is one of those Joe-in-a-strange-town episodes. Great cast that includes Ford Rainey, Kenneth Tobey, Mark Lenard, and Jeanette Nolan.

 

It's a great example of economy of story-telling. Early on, Joe is flying his rented plane with James Sikking, looking for the plane crash site. Not finding it, they spot a town that's supposedly deserted. In a split second, Joe's parking his rent-a-car in that town. Then after being admonished by the townspeople to leave, we're again instantly thrust into a scene with Mannix driving up to his client's supposed house - in a totally different rental car!

 

This all happened in an era where show producers had a lot more time to tell their stories, yet in order to get even lengthier stories told, the Mannix showrunners used this then-uncommon visual style where scenes just jump-cut to the next one without unnecessary exposition.

 

Today's shows are so short, they HAVE to do this - and they have their actors speak so quickly that you often miss part of the story trying to digest what was just said.

 

Harry

Harry,

 

Mike Connors discussed this tight editing style in the PBS Special, Pioneers of Television: Crime Drama.   He credits Bruce Geller (Goff and Roberts must have kept it going after Geller departed), and says it kept the show moving, clicking his fingers when he said it.  It's sure clear they were able to tell more story than a lot of other shows -- and not at the expense of relationship with the characters.

 

You make a very nice point that dialogue today is so clipped it is absurd.  I watched the whole season of HBO's The Newsroom, displaying a host of characters with interaction so clipped and dismissive that they would be fired for their arrogance, regardless of their technical ability.  But, that style was also in series like the recently departed Vegas, and, as you say, it does seem to be commonplace.

 

For me, rapid-fire dialogue makes visual arts too technical, too literal -- removing rich symbolism and imagery of the kind I find not only more prevalent in older series, but also in our culture back before we became, as a whole, too technical and literal-minded -- and too dug in, as a result.

 

This is one reason Mannix did not fare well in syndication.   It's richness was in the way that tight editing was woven with character relationships and symbolism, which were always given time amidst the action.  Even just reaction shots conveyed so much -- but those reaction shots were the first to be cut in the edited versions for syndication.  Since syndication also speeds up the playback, some of those reaction shots lose their warmth even when they are there, almost appear as something they are not, when sped up.

 

Truly -- it was a revelation to see what was really in Mannix -- on those uncut DVDs, running at proper speed.

 

It helps that I was so used to paying attention when I first watched it that the impression some scenes left on me was deeply embedded -- and it was so sweet to see those scenes again.  They hold a lot, when the viewer just gets out of their own way and lets them sink in.

 

By the way, I once read where someone thought "The Sound of Darkness" was a two-part episode.  Nope -- they did it all in a single episode.  And, it really is amazing how much they get done in that episode -- when the bulk of it is about character, not action.

[derosa]

Well, it's written by Aaron Sorkin, and that's his signature style of dialogue

and characters.

 

Sports Night, The West Wing, Studio 60 on the Sunset Strip, and of course 

the "You can't handle the truth!" scene from A Few Good Men.

 

 

 

You make a very nice point that dialogue today is so clipped it is absurd.  I watched the whole season of HBO's The Newsroom, displaying a host of characters with interaction so clipped and dismissive that they would be fired for their arrogance, regardless of their technical ability. 

[jompaul17]

 

Well, it's written by Aaron Sorkin, and that's his signature style of dialogue

and characters.

 

Sports Night, The West Wing, Studio 60 on the Sunset Strip, and of course 

the "You can't handle the truth!" scene from A Few Good Men.

 

 

Right, I remember seeing him interviewed before The Newsroom premiered. 

 

A Few Good Men is one of my favorite movies, as I've mentioned here before.  But, not all of the dialogue in the movie is like the courtroom scene (which is excellent).  Courtrooms are designed to be confrontational, so, while the intensity of the exchange might well be trumped up from what happens in real life, it's plausible that such a scene could happen -- anything exceptional is, by definition, plausible (because so many kinds of things can happen once, exceptionally).  But, if that kind of intensity happened all of the time, the physics changes.  We would need to be driven by all kinds of drama, effectively making us victims of ourselves, unable to step back and process things intelligently -- which is the way The Newsroom comes across. 

 

The rest of A Few Good Men takes some time to develop the characters, with scenes that actually take time to ponder faces and actions -- maybe because it was directed by Rob Reiner.  That is what sets up the drama behind the courtroom scene. Heck, we even wonder what Caffee is up to before the courtroom scene takes place, because we see, entirely visually, that Caffee is thinking, planning, plotting.  I don't see that kind of thing in The Newsroom -- at all.

 

I sampled some of Sports Night (seem to recall it had a major actor in common with the excellent Six Feet Under) and some of The West Wing, didn't see the other.   My impression is that Sports Night got full of itself.  I remember them turning an episode of ESPN-style programming into something poignant, thereby getting the lead character out of his dismay with his cushy job.  That's pretty tough to buy for people who slog through all sorts of middle-class indignities on a daily basis, which is probably why the show did not last.   From what little I saw of The West Wing, Martin Sheen had at least some time to show some facial expression -- he at least had to come across as thinking about the implications of serious situations, even if everyone was buzzing around him and talking at him.  Actually, his need to ignore the buzzing around him made his taking the time to think all that more significant.  I don't see that in The Newsroom -- at all. 

 

Of course, that kind of rapid-fire dialogue mimics real life to a certain extent, since we live in a twitter generation.   But, when characters start to turn into animated tweets and text messages, where do we go for inspiration to take time to think, to take what is happening around us in, to step back and decide, and, most especially, to learn how to stand alone, above the fray of talking heads around us?

 

The rapid fire dialogue is being copied by other series, probably for the same reason the Harry Potter themes found their way into Batman and the recent James Bond movie -- same themes, applied to classic characters that were originally based upon different themes.

 

And, the way so many TV series seem to have a soap-opera background fueling the main characters, geez, how do they have time left to get anything done?   When did we start to see ourselves as victims of overblown family dramas who get work done despite drowning in personal relationship problems instead of noble public servants first?  

 

Success breeds copying. 

 

The only thing that breaks us out of a bad trend is to hope that something else succeeds -- some work of art that brings us out of feeling like victims of all of the chatter and makes us noble again.

[Harry-N]

Just watched 7.07 "Silent Target". Wow - this one could have been titled "Desert Run" - it would have fit nicely, but that title was already taken!

 

It was interesting seeing the young Frank Langella in this one. I always liked his version of DRACULA. Also appearing in the nest of bad guys was Del Monroe who had played four years+ of Seaman Kowalski on VOYAGE TO THE BOTTOM OF THE SEA. And the there's the lovely Barbara Luna, who had been the "Captain's Woman" in the alternate universe episode of STAR TREK.

 

Peggy gets a quick opening in this episode - part of a string of Mannix-away-from-the-office episodes that seems to be prevalent in this season so far. Her deflection of the phone call as Joe is leaving the office is a bit of fun.

 

This episode, penned by Shimon Wincelberg, didn't have much in the way of the quick cuts that we'd just discussed. Indeed, there are shots of planes landing and Joe driving through the desert early on, and then there's lots of running around in the desert later on as he and Elena are being pursued. By the way, Barbara Luna has played multiple characters named Elena (MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE and HAWAII FIVE-0) - and her STAR TREK character's name was Marlena.

 

Harry