-

Jump to content



Sign up for a free account!

Signing up for an account is fast and free. As a member you can join in the conversation, enter contests and you won't get the popup ads that guests get. Click here to create your free account.

Photo
- - - - -

Warner dumbing down Blu-ray Audio ?


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
8 replies to this topic

#1 of 9 BrettB

BrettB

    Producer

  • 3,024 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 01 2001

Posted January 04 2007 - 05:05 AM

What are the theories on this situation?

#2 of 9 David Allen

David Allen

    Stunt Coordinator

  • 138 posts
  • Join Date: Oct 20 2002

Posted January 04 2007 - 05:33 AM

Could you be a little less vague? What do you mean by "Dumbing down" ? And how is Blu-Ray audio different than HD-DVD audio?

#3 of 9 BrettB

BrettB

    Producer

  • 3,024 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 01 2001

Posted January 04 2007 - 06:07 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Allen
Could you be a little less vague?

Maybe.

Posted Image

Quote:
Amid great relief after early info from Warner indicated otherwise, 'Superman Returns' did indeed come with a Dolby TrueHD 5.1 surround track on the HD DVD release. Alas, Blu-ray fans aren't so lucky. For whatever reason, Warner decided to drop the track from the Blu-ray release, even though more players, particularly the PlayStation 3, can now decode Dolby TrueHD. That's a very unfortunate omission, because while the Dolby Digital 5.1 track that is included is perfectly fine, such decisions continue to rate Blu-ray as a second-best format in the eyes of some early adopters.

superman returns BD review

This has been quite common with the Warner titles that have been released on both formats.

#4 of 9 Dave_P.

Dave_P.

    Supporting Actor

  • 983 posts
  • Join Date: May 20 1999

Posted January 04 2007 - 06:21 AM

I think they may be prepping uncompressed PCM tracks for Blu-ray if The Sopranos was any indication.

#5 of 9 DaViD Boulet

DaViD Boulet

    Lead Actor

  • 8,805 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 24 1999

Posted January 04 2007 - 06:59 AM

There has been talk about this and I've put some feelers out to my industry contacts but so far have heard nothing conclusive. HOWEVER, it's important to understand that the way that Dolby Digital, (core, plus, and True HD) are authored on BD and HD DVD is very different because of differences between how the two formats "packet" the data as well as differences between format requirements.

For instance, BD allows packet structures that permit standard (core) Dolby at rates up to the maximum consumer bit-rate of 640 kbps. HD DVD is restricted to the packet structure of DVD which caps Dolby Digital to 448. Dressler from Dolby has stated plainly at AVS that the 5.1 Dolby Digital Plus tracks on HD DVD are "equivilant" to the standard-Dolby tracks on BD that are running at 640. Bascially, Warner is using Dolby Plus as a work-around to increase the bit-rate to what you can get with standard Dolby on BD (6.1 Dolby does require Dolby Plus to encode the discrete rear channel, so this is talking about 5.1 mixes here).

There are also differences to how Dolby True HD is encoded on both formats.

On HD DVD, there is no provision for a "core" Dolby track in a Dolby True HD stream (which is basically MLP). So the bit-rate required for True HD is probably lower since no core is required. The downside to this is that no HD DVD player can extract the core 640 Dolby stream for those without LPCM capability over HDMI (or who have multi-channel analog).

The BD format requires that a 640 kbps "core" Dolby track be embedded with a Dolby True HD track for backwards compatibility with legacy gear. That would increase the bit-rate required for the overall track and may be why we're not seeing Warner duplicate True HD tracks on single-layer BD discs if their HD DVD file size was already maxing out the 25 gig limit.

That's just conjecture (my guess why the True HD tracks were dropped for the BD). But if it's somewhat accurate, as dual-layer BD replication gets better and cheaper the issue would be moot once the industry shifts to dual-layer BD as the defacto norm.
Be an Original Aspect Ratio Advocate

Supporter of 1080p24 video and lossless 24 bit audio.

#6 of 9 Jason Harbaugh

Jason Harbaugh

    Screenwriter

  • 2,968 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 30 2001

Posted January 04 2007 - 07:19 AM

Good information David.

#7 of 9 BrettB

BrettB

    Producer

  • 3,024 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 01 2001

Posted January 04 2007 - 07:33 AM

Yes. David's posts are very helpful with what is for me the most confusing part of the new formats, the audio. Posted Image I've just got to start wrapping my brain around this stuff. Posted Image

#8 of 9 Ron Z

Ron Z

    Stunt Coordinator

  • 55 posts
  • Join Date: Mar 15 1999

Posted January 04 2007 - 10:05 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaViD Boulet
as dual-layer BD replication gets better and cheaper the issue would be moot once the industry shifts to dual-layer BD as the defacto norm.
You likely mean IF the industry shifts to dual-layer BD as the defacto norm. Posted Image Because right now, it's a coin-toss - especially with dual format players and discs likely coming to market.

#9 of 9 DaViD Boulet

DaViD Boulet

    Lead Actor

  • 8,805 posts
  • Join Date: Feb 24 1999

Posted January 04 2007 - 04:17 PM

As far as BD goes, dual-layer will become the defacto norm. That's been the goal of manufacturing/replication all along, just like with dual-layer DVD.
Be an Original Aspect Ratio Advocate

Supporter of 1080p24 video and lossless 24 bit audio.





Forum Nav Content I Follow