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Where is Mary Tyler Moore Season 5?


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#21 of 184 Andrew!A

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Posted November 28 2006 - 05:05 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike*SC
A song is a song is a song, yes. But when that song is performed, other rights can come into effect.

I'm no legal expert, and where exactly grand rights begin and end is definitely fuzzy. They can include (but are not limited to) choreography, wardrobe, context, style of performance, etc.


Agreed. I thought you were stating that the format in which the song was ORIGINALLY used would affect its value when used elsewhere. (In a sense, this is true: the intrinsic value of the original song will certainly affect the fee you'll pay to license it. For example: Springsteen's "Born to Run" will likely set you back more than "Tiptoe Through the Tulips"... IF Springsteen's publisher will even consider licensing the song!)

But I see from this post that you mean the intended end use of the song can affect the fee. Absolutely. Along with all kinds of other variables. See my last post.

#22 of 184 Joseph DeMartino

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Posted November 28 2006 - 05:58 AM

Quote:
Agreed. I thought you were stating that the format in which the song was ORIGINALLY used would affect its value when used elsewhere.

Actually what I was wondering about (when I posted the original note mentioning the showtune origin of "Steam Heat") was whether or not the completely different copyright rules governing dramatic and literary works would have an affect on the handling of material from a Broadway musical, since the songs are in intrinsic part of the whole. You can't have Pajama Game without "Steam Heat" and the other songs it wouldn't exist. (And My Fair Lady without songs would cease to be My Fair Lady and turn back into Pygmalion. Posted Image) So it seemed at least possible to me this might make a difference, hence my wondering aloud about it.

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#23 of 184 Joseph DeMartino

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Posted November 28 2006 - 06:26 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos Garcia
Also, let's not forget that even though most of the song was edited out, they DID use several seconds of "White Christmas" on the DVD version of the 1st season Christmas episode. Enough was used so that I could tell what song it was, yet I'm sure the amount used was small enough so Fox didn't have to pay any amount to the Irving Berlin estate.


Quote:
I know it's not what you're implying, but your post made me think of the oft-repeated statement that if you use fewer than "x" number of notes of a song, you don't have to pay royalties.

Actually it seems to me that that is exactly what Carlos was not so much implying as flat-out saying. Or am I missing something here? Posted Image

Joe

#24 of 184 Andrew!A

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Posted November 28 2006 - 07:07 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph DeMartino
Actually it seems to me that that is exactly what Carlos was not so much implying as flat-out saying. Or am I missing something here? Posted Image

Joe

LOL! I think I must worry too much about people thinking I'm flaming them! Instead I end up doing the opposite - kissing a**. ;-)

#25 of 184 Joseph DeMartino

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Posted November 28 2006 - 09:18 AM

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LOL! I think I must worry too much about people thinking I'm flaming them! Instead I end up doing the opposite - kissing a**. ;-)

Which I'm sure we all appreciate. Posted Image

Joe

#26 of 184 Carlos Garcia

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Posted November 28 2006 - 10:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph DeMartino
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos Garcia
Also, let's not forget that even though most of the song was edited out, they DID use several seconds of "White Christmas" on the DVD version of the 1st season Christmas episode. Enough was used so that I could tell what song it was, yet I'm sure the amount used was small enough so Fox didn't have to pay any amount to the Irving Berlin estate.




Actually it seems to me that that is exactly what Carlos was not so much implying as flat-out saying. Or am I missing something here? Posted Image

Joe

Yep, that was what I was saying. It may be a myth, but I've read it so many times (that a few seconds of a song can be used without having to pay royalties) that I believed it to be true. Anyway, I still know it's "White Christmas" that's being played in that edited version of the Christmas episode, but if the courts don't think so, I'm sure that's all Fox really cares about. Posted Image
I'm a classic TV fan. Widescreen? What's that?

#27 of 184 Ollie

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Posted November 29 2006 - 09:46 AM

TV Shows On DVD is now posting upcoming releases as far out as March 2007....no sign of MTM S5 amidst the announcements. Back to the original question posed in this thread, does ANYONE have any word, gossip, rumors....(I'll take what I can get at this point) about the status of future MTM releases? I hope and pray we're not in for another 3 year lapse between releases.

Of late the MTM and Bob Newhart releases have come at regular intervals. I wonder if there's a forthcoming delay on completing to final two seasons on Bob Newhart as well.

#28 of 184 JohnMor

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Posted November 29 2006 - 02:09 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie
TV Shows On DVD is now posting upcoming releases as far out as March 2007....no sign of MTM S5 amidst the announcements. Back to the original question posed in this thread, does ANYONE have any word, gossip, rumors....(I'll take what I can get at this point) about the status of future MTM releases? I hope and pray we're not in for another 3 year lapse between releases

Well the only "rumor" I know is the totally worthless flyer that came in my Addams Family set, showing the MTM Season Four box and saying "Future Seasons Coming Soon." But of course, they also put a similar flyer in the first season set, and we all know how worthless that was. BUT, TAF set was a lot more recent than MTM Season 4, so that's a good sign. It seems to be a relatively recent flyer saying others season are on the way.

I'm also a firm believer that some of the slowness of TV on DVD this year was the studios waiting to see the public reaction to HD & Blu-Ray. I think we'll see a pick-up on TV on DVD next year.

#29 of 184 Phyll

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Posted January 22 2007 - 06:47 PM

I emailed Fox and they stated that there is no release date yet. That is all it said. Do you think it will be June or July before the 5th season is released?
I think this show only got better and I can't wait for the last three seasons. I am also waiting for Bob Newhart because my favorite episode is coming up-the one where he almost falls down an elevator shaft. Very funny stuff. And the episode where Mary sings one for my baby is so funny. Almost like she is trying out for American Idol. Lol. Does anybody have any guess as to what a release date might be now that we know it is not Jan. I was so bummed out.

#30 of 184 Joseph DeMartino

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Posted January 23 2007 - 03:41 AM

I'm confused. If someone at Fox told you there is no release date scheduled, what good does it do to solicit a totally blind guess from people who don't work for Fox and don't know any more than you do? Posted Image

Regards,

Joe

#31 of 184 Joe Lugoff

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Posted January 23 2007 - 04:13 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phyll
And the episode where Mary sings one for my baby is so funny. Almost like she is trying out for American Idol. Lol.

That presents a problem, though. It's been discussed here how this show's previous sets had cuts and music substitutions because they were too cheap to pay music rights (for instance, "White Christmas" in Season One.) So it's possible the whole "One for My Baby" thing won't make it to the DVD. (Which would be outrageous, of course.)

#32 of 184 Carlos Garcia

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Posted January 23 2007 - 05:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Lugoff
That presents a problem, though. It's been discussed here how this show's previous sets had cuts and music substitutions because they were too cheap to pay music rights (for instance, "White Christmas" in Season One.) So it's possible the whole "One for My Baby" thing won't make it to the DVD. (Which would be outrageous, of course.)
That may be one of the reasons for the long delay for season 5 and the rest.
I'm a classic TV fan. Widescreen? What's that?

#33 of 184 KatyD

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Posted January 23 2007 - 07:19 AM

it does seem like its been a long time, season 4 was released in june....

#34 of 184 Ollie

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Posted January 23 2007 - 08:11 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phyll
I emailed Fox and they stated that there is no release date yet. That is all it said. Do you think it will be June or July before the 5th season is released?

I would say the fact that they have no scheduled release date does not bode well for it being anytime in the near future. When I've inquired with studios in the past about sets that were forthcoming, if they didn't have a firm release date, I've at least gotten a ball park such as "early spring" or "late fall", which sets forth the understanding that there are definitive upcoming plans to release the set.

No word on MTM-S5 is bad news for me because I was really looking forward to Season 5 having thoroughly enjoyed the previous 4 I've collected to date.

Hopefully FOX will get at least one of the remaining 3 seasons out before the end of the year.

#35 of 184 Joseph DeMartino

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Posted January 23 2007 - 09:01 AM

Quote:
It's been discussed here how this show's previous sets had cuts and music substitutions because they were too cheap to pay music rights (for instance, "White Christmas" in Season One.)

So they were "too cheap" to pay for music rights. I guess there's no chance the rights holders were "too greedy" or asked "too much" those same rights. I assume you know the actual dollar amounts involved nad their impact on the profitability estimates for the DVDs since you're able to conclude that the studio was "too cheap"?

I'm pretty sure that "White Christmas" remains the single best-selling record of all times (over 50 million copies were sold of the Crosby 1947 Decca recording alone if I'm not mistaken), as well as one of the most-recorded songs of all time, so it is quite possible that the Berlin Estate or whoever controls the rights asked more than Fox could afford to spend.

I'm always surprised at the intimate knowledge of music costs and DVD negotiations that even the most casual DVD fan seems to have these days... Posted Image

Regards,

Joe

#36 of 184 Joe Lugoff

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Posted January 23 2007 - 11:35 AM

The Berlin songs are controlled by the Rodgers and Hammerstein Organization, I do believe. They don't ask for any outrageous fees. I read on this forum, and in other places, that Fox was just trying to save money on the MTM sets. It's not "intimate" knowledge, but I'm not quite the uneducated $%#@ you make me out to be.

#37 of 184 Joseph DeMartino

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Posted January 23 2007 - 12:37 PM

Quote:
I read on this forum, and in other places, that Fox was just trying to save money on the MTM sets.

And as we all know, everything we read on this forum and the rest of the internet is always true. Posted Image

I wasn't making you out to be ignorant, I was making a general comment on the tendency of fans in numerous threads here and elsewhere to reflexively assign blame for every music problem to the studios as if they were in the room during the negotiations.

Now I haven't made any special study of the MTM issues and it may well be that you know more about this than I do. But it is a dead certainty that you know less than the folks at Fox. You have heard some internet gossip, which may or may not be true. Neither one of us is in a position to know for sure.

Regards,

Joe

#38 of 184 george kaplan

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Posted January 23 2007 - 02:54 PM

Well, regardless of reason, it's cut, and that's all that matters.

One can only hope that season 5 comes out uncut. If not, I for one will pass on it.
"Movies should be like amusement parks. People should go to them to have fun." - Billy Wilder

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#39 of 184 David Von Pein

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Posted January 23 2007 - 06:00 PM

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#40 of 184 MatthewA

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Posted January 23 2007 - 11:18 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Lugoff
The Berlin songs are controlled by the Rodgers and Hammerstein Organization, I do believe. They don't ask for any outrageous fees. I read on this forum, and in other places, that Fox was just trying to save money on the MTM sets. It's not "intimate" knowledge, but I'm not quite the uneducated $%#@ you make me out to be.

White Christmas was present on a season 2 King of the Hill episode on DVD.

Though it's another studio, Anything You Can Do, I Can Do Better was on a season 1 episode of The Nanny on DVD.

Enough is enough, Disney. No more evasions or excuses. We DEMAND the release Song of the South on Blu-ray along with the uncut version of Bedknobs and Broomsticks on Blu-ray. I will not support anything your company produces until then.



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