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Quality Problems with Z2


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26 replies to this topic

#1 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 14 2005 - 02:43 AM

I've had my Z2 for about a month now but since I've spent all this time installing it in my HT, I never really had time to sit down and calibrate.

Recently I have been disturbed by the poor image quality. At first I thought it was my screen but last night I removed it from the equation.

This is what I'm experiencing:

1. Ghosting (click here for image ).

Ghosting is mainly apparent on text and DVD menus. But from time to time I can spot it especially when an object is black on a white background.

2. Vertical Banding (click here for image ).

This one is strange because I've been following a thread on another forum which says to tweak service settings 13/14/15. This did nothing for me, the vertical lines are not uniform enough for me to think it's VB, although when I do increase VB it does appear in places where the lines are that I currently see. What I see is more like vertical scratches, in different lengths.

3. Images lack clarity.

I've focused and focused again and also increased the sharpness but I still see a soft image. I have ruled out the DVD player by outputting from another machine.

The only thing I am thinking is the component cable I am using is 75' long. I purchased the Python cable from Cablesforless. Could it be that this is too long and that I will lose quality? I heard of people making 100' runs without signal loss.

#2 of 27 OFFLINE   John S

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Posted January 14 2005 - 04:01 AM

Ghosting is usually interference of some sort, or signal loss in general.

So what are you outputting to your projector?

480p? Does it get better if you feed it 480i, if you cna even try that, as some DVD players no longer output 480i.

What sort of screen size are we talking about here also?

I think you are going to have to at least temporarily move the DVD player close to the projector with some short cables to help diagnose it though.

On those long runs, I like to use 3 separate RG6 coax cables with RCA adapters, that always seems to work best for me over most cables of that length that can be purchased, and it's much cheaper too. Posted Image

#3 of 27 OFFLINE   Ian_J

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Posted January 15 2005 - 12:12 PM

This is very intersting. The same problem recently started popping up on my z2. I changed screens from white to gray which seems to have increased the problems. Someone help us please!

#4 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 16 2005 - 02:28 AM

I *think* I've managed to remove the ghosting. I tweaked service settings 7/8/9 and this has reduced it a little.

I ruled out the cable being the problem by running a smaller cable directly between PJ and DVD player and I am getting the same problems.

I am going to upgrade my screen to High Power to see if mugginess of the picture will go due to the waves I currently have.

I am still having problems with the "scratches". If someone has firmware 1.08 please let me know what your settings are for service settings 13/14/15.

Thanks.

#5 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 17 2005 - 07:38 AM

Here's two new screenshots of the vertical "scratches" I am getting. I just ordered a high power screen as a replacement, I will see if this makes the picture any better.

Image 1
Image 2 (look on the left)

Am I seeing things?

#6 of 27 OFFLINE   Michael Caicedo

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Posted January 17 2005 - 08:30 AM

Fixed Pattern Noise or Vertical banding. FPN looks like streaks, VB is more structured. VB can be somewhat tweaked with register 14 on service menu. Put up a solid grey pattern and try different settings, but make sure you write down original values.
75' is a long run. This could be the problem or as John S mentioned make sure you have a good 480p source from your dvd player. Good dvds should look razor sharp.
I hate to tell you, but the Hi-Power screen (and many high gain screens) is _very_ revealing. That means it will enhance the good with the bad. However, it will help a lot with the waves.
Mike, FL

#7 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 17 2005 - 08:49 AM

Thanks for your response.

I connected the Z2 via a shorter cable. I am getting the same streaks/scratches from DVD and HDTV sources.

Do you know how FPN can be corrected?

I know what you mean by VB being more structured. Reducing service setting 14 down from 91 to about 70 creates horrible vertical lines. Going in the other direction doesnt help either.

Well, I am completely stumped. Is it because I am sat too close (12' from 106" screen) that I see every imperfection? And you say image should be razor sharp and I can tell you that mine is far from that. With the exception of the movie T3, others are are just "blah".

I'm considering sending it back for a replacement, but I don't know if that's possible, even though it's been under 30 days.

#8 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 18 2005 - 01:09 AM

Took this picture last night. The screen is going back to Da-Lite and is being replaced. But look at the irregular vertical scratches. This doesn't look like VB to me because as you say it's more structured. So what can this be?

Example

#9 of 27 OFFLINE   John S

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Posted January 18 2005 - 02:14 AM

have you tried feeding it 480i via the component video cables... Displays that have great DCDi in them, seem to love 480i via component connections is all.


I have rectified just this sort of thing for people, by making this simple change. You will still get 480p, just your display will be providing it.

#10 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 18 2005 - 02:38 AM

yeah, looks ten times worse. I can't remember if the lines were there, but certainly the picture was a lot more blurry and lacking color. I notice though that there are 3 modes on the Z2 when accepting a 480i input. There is L1 and L2 and "Film". L1 is for moving image, L2 for still. There is a slight difference between the two, but none is really better than the other. Film mode creates a slightly softer image.

Film mode description:

"When this function is on, it detects a proper interleaving of 3-2 pull down for film-based sources and produces a suitable image for the input source.".

Edit: I tried these settings and 480i results in a softer, more pixelated, colorless image. Flipping between 480i and 480p, 480p is defenetley the winner. However, they both display the VB I am getting.

I have a HDTV receiver hooked up to this too BTW, even feeding it a 1080i or 720p source I still see the scratches.

#11 of 27 OFFLINE   John S

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Posted January 18 2005 - 02:55 AM

Time to go back to your dealer, and tell them you are just not happy with it perhaps? Hard to imagine why the 480p / 480i would be much if any different. Calibration would be different possibly though.

#12 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 18 2005 - 09:06 AM

Had to send it back to Sanyo service. They have a quick turnaround of 72 hours (or so they say). I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it not only comes back in one piece but with the VB totally gone! Knowing my luck, they won't even be able to reproduce the problem, but then if they say what I'm seeing is normal, then I guess at least I'll know it's not all in my head!

#13 of 27 OFFLINE   Ian_J

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Posted January 19 2005 - 01:38 AM

My Z2 is being shipped out today for the same problem.

#14 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 19 2005 - 01:40 AM

Ian - let me know how you get on. Mine will arrive there Friday so hopefully I'll get it back tail end of next week or week after. But keep me posted.

Thanks.

#15 of 27 OFFLINE   Ian_J

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Posted January 24 2005 - 04:17 AM

AL,

The projector was returned today with a new filter and updated flash memory. I'll test it out tonight and post the results ASAP. I've also taken advantage of this downtime to change sources and cabling. The denon dvd2200 has been replaced with a panny S97S (upscaling DVD)and a HDMI / DVI cable (15') run. I'll post a comparison between the DVI and RGB cables also.

Ian

#16 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 24 2005 - 04:52 AM

Ian - when did you send yours off? Mine was supposed to have been shipped out Saturday.

I did get a call from Dan the technician. He told me he upgraded to firmware 1.09 (which apparently fixes VB and SDE issues). He also said the panel was misaligned on mine.

I have not had mine back yet, but as soon as it arrives will check for the VB I was getting and post back with my findings.

#17 of 27 OFFLINE   Ian_J

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Posted January 24 2005 - 05:16 AM

I think mine went out on the 19th. Fortunatley, I ship straight from work so it may be a bit faster.

#18 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 24 2005 - 05:18 AM

Do you know the day they shipped it back to you?

I hope it comes today. I just got my new screen today too and I'm itching to try hooking it up to a 720p DVI source to test the difference between that and my Sony player which only outputs 480p.

#19 of 27 OFFLINE   Ian_J

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Posted January 24 2005 - 06:11 AM

They sent a fax to my office on the 21st saying it shipped out. What type of screen are you installing?

#20 of 27 OFFLINE   Al L

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Posted January 24 2005 - 06:44 AM

Da-lite hi power. My other had bad waves.