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Stryke AV15 vs. PE 15" Titanic III


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#1 of 41 Jeff G

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Posted May 01 2004 - 04:33 AM

I'm planning on building a sealed, downfiring subwoofer for mostly music with a Q of around .6 Am considering these 2 drivers. Both seem OK for downfiring (stryke has sag of ~2% and the PE is ~3%). They map similarly on WinISD in a 5 cu ft.enclosure. The Titanic has an f3 of 37Hz with a Q of .61. The Stryke rolls more gradually with and f3 of 33Hz and a Q of .66

Both seem like great drivers. Thinking about waiting on a sale. Thoughts?
Jeff

#2 of 41 Wayne Ernst

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Posted May 01 2004 - 05:48 AM

Quote:
Thinking about waiting on a sale. Thoughts?

Jeff, Not sure if you'll see any sales on Stryke drivers - unless there's some B-stock available. Also, the AV15 drivers were at an excellent price last fall during the "pre-order" period.

Nonetheless, it's a great driver. If you are waiting for a sale price, you might have better luck with the Parts Express driver as P.E. is known for sales, but I can't vouch for that particular driver.
"My reality check ... just bounced"

#3 of 41 Dennis Gardner

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Posted May 01 2004 - 07:08 AM

Stephen at TC Sounds has AV-15 MkI drivers for $115 + shipping.

I don't know how many are left, but the deal is unbeatable!

#4 of 41 Robert_J

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Posted May 01 2004 - 10:18 AM

If you are talking about the Audiohole deal, then they are all gone. Just the TC9's, Ultimate 10's and a 12 with the 4hp motor.

-Robert

#5 of 41 John E Janowitz

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Posted May 02 2004 - 05:59 PM

Dennis,

I would stay away from the drivers that TC is selling with my name on them. They are the single spider version that have an extremely high failure rate. That was the reason to the change for dual spiders on the MKII. I rejected the batch of them and they decided to sell them off and make some money off of my name.

In addition to that, there is no relationship between Stryke and TC anymore. I waited 9 months to receive drivers that were promised in 3 months. Repairs promised in 2 weeks sat for over 4 months and never did get repaired. TC does not have my permission to sell drivers with the Stryke name on them. This is highly illegal and I had considered taking the matter up in federal court, but due to the current financial situation of TC Sounds it was not worth my time.

As many of you know, Rockford Fosgate is no longer letting me use the Stryke name. They threatened to sue me for trademark infringement. TC is unwilling to take my name off the drivers, so I have turned the matter over to the lawyers for Rockford Fosgate. I'll let them deal with TC and I'm sure they will not be as nice to them as I would have been.

The fact is, the AV15's they sold will have about a 50% chance of failing. That has been the rate on that batch. They are not offering any kind of warranty on them.

I'll be building all drivers at my shop from now on. The AV series will continue but will be slightly improved upon. I'll also have an introductory series with around 18mm Xmax, an SQ series with a copper/aluminum faraday motor, and then a larger 3" coil driver with close to 40mm Xmax. Look for these starting in about a month.

John

#6 of 41 Wayne Ernst

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Posted May 02 2004 - 10:49 PM

John,

Nice to see a post by you back here - Posted Image

Also, I did read the information on your site a few days ago about the upcoming name change the the move to make drivers in-house. I think this will be a very good thing and since you're more involved with the process, you should be able to provide much better updates for customers as needed.

Keep making those excellent drivers! Posted Image
"My reality check ... just bounced"

#7 of 41 Dennis Gardner

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Posted May 03 2004 - 01:35 AM

John,

Thanks for the heads up! Reliability in a sub is an important factor in the decision making for DIY guys. We tend to push our creations to their limits as it is.

Good luck in your next versions of great products,

Dennis

#8 of 41 Chris Brock

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Posted May 03 2004 - 03:38 AM

Quote:
and then a larger 3" coil driver with close to 40mm Xmax


Posted Image Posted Image

sounds like a plan to me!!Posted Image

#9 of 41 Rory Buszka

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Posted May 03 2004 - 05:01 AM

So it looks like Acoustic Elegance is out to become the next Lambda, and then some? How are prices looking? The risk with building in-house seems to me that you don't get the whole economies of scale thing and then you've got major problems with high prices that drive customers to other makers that have the capacity to produce lots and lots of drivers for lower prices per unit with lower, but still acceptable quality. Still, it seems to me like your drivers will be unique enough and just plain good enough to warrant paying a higher price if that is the case. These days, it's all about displacement per dollar with the j6p DIYer crowd ("What's the most bang I can buy?") but if you can market your drivers as offering something more than "bang" (the displacement as well as great transient response for musical fidelity), then you're talking. And you're talking to a crowd who is often able and willing to pay more to get that performance.

Quote:
and then a larger 3" coil driver with close to 40mm Xmax.


Hmm. Not 4"? Though I imagine you've already pondered that and decided that overkill in that area won't sell more drivers. Please offer a 10" driver with at least 12mm Xmax and good price. I have a Blueprint 1001 driver that I think is exceptionally good for the $79 I paid for it. Though I would have to wonder - it seems like all anybody goes for are 12" and 15" drivers these days...

One last idea: How about a Center Point tower speaker with an in-house-built Uber-6.5" downfiring powered woofer?
"It sounds like it's barfing out the bass." - Zach

#10 of 41 Rory Buszka

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Posted May 03 2004 - 08:44 AM

Since TC Sounds supplies the SVS dB-12 and TV-12 woofers, what will happen to SVS if TC Sounds goes under?
"It sounds like it's barfing out the bass." - Zach

#11 of 41 Wayne Ernst

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Posted May 03 2004 - 09:49 AM

Quote:
quote:
and then a larger 3" coil driver with close to 40mm Xmax

sounds like a plan to me!!

Chris, Just get your damn Blueprint driver utilized and stop drooling all over this thread. Sheesh. Posted Image Posted Image
"My reality check ... just bounced"

#12 of 41 Tom Vodhanel

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Posted May 03 2004 - 10:30 AM

>>>Since TC Sounds supplies the SVS dB-12 and TV-12 woofers, what will happen to SVS if TC Sounds goes under?<<<

TC is a very well established manufacturer with an excellent reputation in the industry. I speak with several folks there almost daily. They are growing and expanding their sales and product line in very impressive bounds(thanks in part to SVS) and they won't be "going under" ANY time soon unless the *big one* hits the west coast and they fall off into the Pacific..Posted Image

"quick edit"---I should have also mentioned, for EVERY component SVS currently purchases from a vendor...we have various back up plans in place. So if ANY vendor could no longer supply a component...there could be a hiccup in our supply chain for a short period of time(most likely several weeks)...nothing else.

Tom V.
SVS

#13 of 41 John E Janowitz

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Posted May 03 2004 - 11:34 AM

Hi Tom,

I called and left a message for you earlier today before I ever saw you posted here. Please give me a call back when you get a chance.

John

#14 of 41 Denis P

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Posted May 03 2004 - 12:27 PM

"They are the single spider version that have an extremely high failure rate. That was the reason to the change for dual spiders on the MKII."

John - Are you implying that ALL the single spider Mk I AV15's have an expected 50% failure rate? This is more than acedemic interest to me as I have four of yhem in an IB in my attic.

#15 of 41 John E Janowitz

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Posted May 03 2004 - 01:03 PM

Denis,

Unfortunately this is the case. TC used a single spider on them with a coil that was much too heavy for just one spider. In addition many of the woofers I tore apart had pole's that were off center slightly. They all have the possibility to rub. There have also been some where the cones came detached from the VC former. TC was unwilling to take any responsibility for any of the problems.

Whether they rub or not seems to depend on the alignment they are used in. Small sealed boxes seem to be the worst. IB alignments seem to be the best. If they don't make any bottoming noises, then you should be fine. If they start I will take care of that and rebuild them with dual spiders here. It will be a couple more months before I have parts available though. I do want to make sure everyone is satisfied.

ALL future woofers will be built here. I am able to do full FEA on all the motors to calculate BL curves and parameters before even building drivers. I will be using only the best glues available. I will be getting a lathe here to do prototypes and thouroughly test prototypes before releasing drivers. I am confident that the production problems will be eliminated and the drivers made here will be the most reliable available.

John

#16 of 41 Eric Eash

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Posted May 03 2004 - 04:19 PM

that 50% fail rate is news to me, and frankly doesn't sit well. i have pushed the hell out of my two, without even so much as a hiccup, and when i say pushed, how about 120db at 10Hz from 1m. not for very long mind you, but it happened nonetheless.

John, will the 40mm Xmax drivers be 15"ers, if so, i'll be sending you an email for an order in a few months. also, please keep the aluminum cones, i love the aluminum cones. i might have 2 tumults right now if they had aluminum cones.

eric
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#17 of 41 John E Janowitz

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Posted May 03 2004 - 04:30 PM

Eric,

I'll be doing 12's, 15's and possibly 18's in the high excursion design. I like the look of the aluminum cones too, but may offer a few other options. Once the motor designs are down it's fairly easy for me to offer variations with different cones. One that interests me a lot is a carbon fiber honeycomb. Very light, stiff and strong. I'm concerned that alum on the 18" will be too heavy. There is also the possibility of an electroplated polycone. The good ones look identical to the alum on the front, but are much lighter.

The plan is for the more budget woofers first though. They will retail for $125 and $150 for 12" and 15" respectively. Looking at 18.5mm Xmax on these. Cast basket, alum cone, rubber surround, spiders woven in lead wires, etc. I won't be doing any preorders anymore. I can't afford the problems associated with delays in the case that parts don't show up on time. There will be an introductory price for 2 weeks though at the time of release once the drivers are ready to ship. I'll be doing something shortly to get names of people that are interested so I know how many to make. Stay tuned.

John

#18 of 41 Wayne Ernst

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Posted May 03 2004 - 04:34 PM

Quote:
They will retail for $125 and $150 for 12" and 15" respectively. Looking at 18.5mm Xmax on these. Cast basket, alum cone, rubber surround, spiders woven in lead wires, etc.

I'm *very* interested in a pair of 15" drivers. I'm ready to make a move to an infinite baffle system ... soon. Posted Image
"My reality check ... just bounced"

#19 of 41 Allen Ross

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Posted May 03 2004 - 04:54 PM

Sounds like good things on the horizon, now lets see what Adire can do Posted Image
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#20 of 41 MattD

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Posted May 03 2004 - 06:18 PM

Good luck John. Posted Image


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