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Lord almighty! Is my new Denon broken already????? HELP!


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#1 of 34 Tom Martin

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Posted January 10 2004 - 01:14 PM

I bought the Denon DVD 900 today. I put in Finding Nemo and then Moulin Rouge. I saw it once on Nemo, but it's all over Moulin Rouge: horizontal bars of what looks like static. I took the discs out and cleaned them but it keeps happening in the same spots. AND, it only happens in progressive mode. Interlaced is fine!? The discs are pristine so i doubt it's that. Anyone?

#2 of 34 Don_Berg

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Posted January 10 2004 - 01:17 PM

The DVD-900 model is a dog, get a DVD-1600 or DVD-910.

#3 of 34 Tom Martin

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Posted January 10 2004 - 02:43 PM

dog? how so? and i thought the 910 was the same except for a few added features.

#4 of 34 Don_Berg

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Posted January 10 2004 - 06:19 PM

No they are very different. The 900 has lots of issues including a very poor soft picture with loss of high frequency response. The 1600 and 910 has a much sharper picture.

#5 of 34 Stephen M

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Posted January 11 2004 - 02:47 AM

Can anyone help Tom with his question and not suggest another player??

#6 of 34 Tom Martin

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Posted January 11 2004 - 05:17 AM

thanks stephenPosted Image

anyway, i removed and then reconnected my component cables and the static went away, something my have been pinched or not in place right. The Denon 900 looks pretty good now. I was going to upgrade to the 910 but the guy at the store talked me out of it. He said they sold a whole bunch of 900 players and he's had no complaints, and that the internal stuff is exactly the same, they just added some features. The picture may be a little soft, but so far, every progressive scan player i've had has done that. Also, this player is actually very quiet and no random subtitles have popped up. So far.

#7 of 34 Don_Berg

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Posted January 11 2004 - 06:45 AM

The internal design is different between the older 900 and the newer 910. Just look at the lastest Secrets DVD player test results - the 900 scores way below the 910. The 900 is no better than a much cheaper player.

#8 of 34 Stephen M

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Posted January 11 2004 - 10:05 AM

Don, I know this has been beaten like the deceased equine, but the Secrets test results are NOT uniformly applicable to viewer satisfaction. Many excellent players are given less than great grades in the testing. Read the test results and see if your player displays the defects alleged in the test results. For a lot of viewers, the answer is a resounding no.

#9 of 34 Don_Berg

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Posted January 11 2004 - 12:40 PM

Sorry but I've tested many of the players myself and agree with the Secrets ratings. The top-rated players produce the best results, the lesser rated players are clearly worse.

#10 of 34 Stephen M

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Posted January 12 2004 - 12:39 AM

Well, since you have tested them tell us what to buy!Posted Image

#11 of 34 dpippel

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Posted January 12 2004 - 01:43 AM

Sorry but I've tested many of the players myself and agree with the Secrets ratings. The top-rated players produce the best results, the lesser rated players are clearly worse.

For the most part I think you're correct Don, but the Secrets results are certainly not the final word in what makes a player right for a given individual. Video performance is just as subjective as how a CD player sounds, or an amplifier, or speakers. What looks great to one person may be bested by something else for another, and it may have nothing at all to do with measured performance. Case in point - I found the progressive video output of the Denon 3800 to be far superior to the Panasonic RP82 during a direct comparison in my home theater. Does this mean that Secrets is wrong? No. It may simply mean that I prefer Silicon Image deinterlacing over Faroudja.

I think that Stephen has a point as well. Many of the tests performed by Secrets are done with measuring equipment or by people who know exactly what to look for and would be missed by the untrained eye.

The Secrets rankings should be used as a starting point and guideline in evaluating players, not as the absolute word on which player is best for YOUR needs.

Careful man, there's a beverage here!


#12 of 34 Don_Berg

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Posted January 12 2004 - 07:29 AM

OK, buy the top-rated players on the Secrets ranking - they are totally correct. I bought a Panasonic XP30 its top-rated and easily blows away picture quality wise all the other regular models I've tested. The Secrets ranking matches exactly what I have seen personally, you have to know what to look for after reading their detailed info carefully.

#13 of 34 Tom Martin

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Posted January 12 2004 - 12:19 PM

so, XP-30 will give me a better image than a Faroujda equipped Denon?

#14 of 34 greg_t

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Posted January 12 2004 - 03:11 PM

Quote:
so, XP-30 will give me a better image than a Faroujda equipped Denon?


Quite possibly. The XP30 also uses the Faroudja deinterlacer, but adds a top of the line MPEG decoder as well, which I have read some on other forums say is the best consumer MPEG decoder made. I'm not an expert on Denons, but I believe that the 900 used an inferior MPEG decoder to what is in the XP30. The XP30 uses the reference quality video output of the RP91 and adds Faroudja deinterlacing. All for a cost of ~$200 when they were new. I got mine for $180 new.

There are two important things to remember when looking for dvd players. First, progressive scan deinterlacers are only a part of the overall image, and the having the faroudja chip is no gurantee that a player will have outstanding overall video quality, it just means that it will have outstanding deinterlacing. The other thing to remember is that unless you are really a videophile, don't worry too much about having the absolute best. Every player has it's faults. If you are happy with your Denon, just enjoy it. If you aren't, then look into some other options.

The Secrets tests are the best around in determing the overall video quality of a dvd player. They really test these players out rather than just saying that a player produces a great image with The Fifth Element DVD, like many player reviews do. Again though, unless you are a strict videophile, you'll probably also want to factor in things such as quality of remote, features, user interface menu, etc. The Secrets doesn't test these things because they are more subjective, but don't mean that those factors aren't many times just as important in a purchasing decision as video quality.

#15 of 34 Don_Berg

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Posted January 12 2004 - 06:17 PM

Yes the XP30 has much higher quality than the DVD-900. It has the best picture quality and de-interlacing I've ever seen! I bought a used XP30 on EBAY because I was just not satisified with any of the models I've tried available in stores. Now I am finally satisifed with the XP30.

#16 of 34 Chu Gai

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Posted January 12 2004 - 11:17 PM

So let's see, this was ultimately traced to possibly a connection problem, yes?

#17 of 34 Tom Martin

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Posted January 13 2004 - 12:25 AM

no, it doesn't look like a connection problem. i'm not sure yet what it is. and all i'm really interested in is a bright clear picture. when i pause a scene and switch from interlace to progressive, the picture loses a lot of detail, the black level seems to become brighter and the colors wash out a bit. and i tried this with 5 players already!

as for the XP30, i was looking around for it last night and i didn't see it having the Faroudja DCDi in it anywhere. Also, i could only find it for $300.

#18 of 34 Don_Berg

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Posted January 13 2004 - 08:32 AM

The XP30 indeed has the Faroudja de-interlacer, Panasonics just don't put a DCDi sticker on the front panel. I got one on EBAY recently for $200. The original list price was $299.

#19 of 34 greg_t

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Posted January 13 2004 - 09:58 AM

Quote:
as for the XP30, i was looking around for it last night and i didn't see it having the Faroudja DCDi in it anywhere. Also, i could only find it for $300


Like Don said, they do have the Faroudja, it's just not advertised. The XP30, XP50, and RP82 are all the same player video wise. You'll probably get an XP30 the cheapest though because it does not do DVD-Audio whereas the other two players do.

#20 of 34 Tom Martin

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Posted January 13 2004 - 10:03 AM

where the heck can i find the xp30? it seems to be pretty hard to find. is it discontinued or something? and i'd rather buy it somewhere where it comes with a warranty.





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