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Kung Fu - Season 1 (March 16th) is not OAR


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186 replies to this topic

#41 of 187 OFFLINE   todd s

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Posted December 30 2003 - 02:46 AM

More importantly. Any chance we will get Kung Fu:The Legend Continues?? Seriously, I liked that show.
Bring back John Doe! Or at least resolve the cliff-hanger with a 2hr movie or as an extra on a dvd release.

#42 of 187 OFFLINE   Matt Rexer

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Posted December 30 2003 - 07:46 AM

Rodney: This should be as important as Willy Wonka, and we should put a stop to this as soon as possible.

I can't help but wonder if the massive response their open matte Willy Wonka got worked too well... now WB is scared not to release something in widescreen. Maybe?

Also, looks like the domain name OARadvocate.com is still up for grabs, hint, hint... Posted Image
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#43 of 187 OFFLINE   Rick P

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Posted December 30 2003 - 07:58 AM

If anyone is curious as to what this looks like.. should you have access to HDNet on your DBS system, watch a coupla of episodes of "Hogan's Heros".

#44 of 187 OFFLINE   Jeff Jacobson

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Posted December 30 2003 - 03:17 PM

This cropped version of "Kung-fu" (or any tv show) is a really stupid idea. All of the people who complain about "black bars" on their widescreen movies will complain about the black bars on this release as well. And they will be joined by the people who care about OAR!

#45 of 187 OFFLINE   Christopher D

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Posted December 30 2003 - 03:42 PM

I already have one of these in my collection (inadvertantly). The recent R2 box set rerelease of "Danger UXB" is MAR 16x9. I am pretty zealous about OAR but I didn't know this when I ordered it and was stuck with it. I have to admit I don't see a huge difference compared to the original OAR releases, but just can't condone this practice. You have to use your old 4:3 TVs for something!

#46 of 187 OFFLINE   Jeff F.

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Posted December 31 2003 - 06:48 AM

Is everyone 100% sure that "Kung Fu" was not originally shot for HDTV? The reason I say this is that I worked as a runner on "Newhart" (the one where Bob was an inn keeper) in 1984, which was shot on film. One day I was looking at the floor monitors and noticed that the picture was "letterboxed" with a "square" image drawn in the middle. I asked the director (whose name escapes me at the moment) why it looked like that. He explained that the industry knew that HDTV was coming and that the producers wanted to make sure that the series would be compatible with "future technology." Could this have possibly been the case with "Kung Fu?"

#47 of 187 OFFLINE   Steve Phillips

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Posted December 31 2003 - 07:23 AM

I don't think they were concerned about HDTV in 1972-75. I understand your point though, which is are we sure the series is being cropped/tilt and scanned or are they simply opening up info on the sides. While the latter has happened more recently, in most cases these widescreen versions will be created by cropping. ALl releases should be in the aspect ratio of their original telecasts, period.

#48 of 187 OFFLINE   Rick P

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Posted December 31 2003 - 10:17 AM

[quote] The reason I say this is that I worked as a runner on "Newhart" (the one where Bob was an inn keeper) in 1984, which was shot on film. One day I was looking at the floor monitors and noticed that the picture was "letterboxed" with a "square" image drawn in the middle. I asked the director (whose name escapes me at the moment) why it looked like that. He explained that the industry knew that HDTV was coming and that the producers wanted to make sure that the series would be compatible with "future technology." [quote]

Now that you've said that, it twiged something in the back of my head... SOMEWHERE I remember reading that "The Fall Guy" was filmed in a widescreen format for 'future-proofing' the eventual move to a theaterical format screen, this was back in 1983 when most everything was film. I could see back then that it might be just as easy to shoot 1.85:1 as it was 4:3 and 'crop' for the broadcast masters, but have something else back in the vault.

Remember 'Babylon 5' was shot 16:9 back in '94, but it suffered from not rendering the effects shots in 16:9 - bit for a non-cgi'ed show (Kung Fu, Newhart, Fall Guy) shot totally on film... it's a possbility...

#49 of 187 OFFLINE   Stephen_J_H

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Posted January 01 2004 - 09:47 AM

[quote] Gone with the Wind was re-issued in the 1960's blown-up for 70mm. Hey, despite it being cropped to 2.21:1 and processed by Metrocolor...it had 6-track stereophonic sound! [quote] Anyone want to see what this looks like? Go to the American Widescreen Museum and check it out!
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#50 of 187 OFFLINE   Matt Rexer

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Posted January 01 2004 - 10:33 AM

[quote] SOMEWHERE I remember reading that "The Fall Guy" was filmed in a widescreen format for 'future-proofing' the eventual move to a theaterical format screen [quote] Even if this were the case with a number of TV shows from the past, presenting them in 16:9 is still not the OAR and isn't acceptable in my book. If it was originally broadcast (and re-broadcast and re-run... for years) in 4:3, then that's what I want on my DVDs.

This is the same reason I'd buy the widescreen DVD of Harry Potter over the fullscreen version -- even though I have a 4:3 TV and the director composed for both ratios -- I'd want the original presentation. Ditto for avoiding open matte movies on DVD.
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#51 of 187 OFFLINE   John_Berger

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Posted January 01 2004 - 12:34 PM

[quote] I'd want the original presentation. [quote] If the original presentation is NOT the filmmaker's intended presentation, then the original presentation is MAR regardless of whether or not it was the way that you've been seeing it.

#52 of 187 OFFLINE   David Lambert

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Posted January 01 2004 - 01:02 PM

But John, that doesn't apply here. IF true (and I admit my skepticism that they were protecting for HDTV back in the time of The Fall Guy, but he was THERE and I wasn't so how can I gainsay him?), then it was still merely "protecting for a possible future", and not "intending this format". 4x3 is correct OAR for The Fall Guy, and countless others. Period.
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#53 of 187 OFFLINE   Matt Rexer

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Posted January 01 2004 - 01:39 PM

[quote] If the original presentation is NOT the filmmaker's intended presentation [quote] Short of asking every single director of every episode of every television show getting a DVD release, we'll never know this for sure. Logically, any director filming a television show in the 70s or 80s is going to keep things in the 4:3 space... that's all his audience is going to see. If the 16:9 space is kept boom mike- and crew-free... cool beans. But, by default, TV shows from this era should be assumed to be 4:3 (unless, of course, the director says otherwise. See: V.).
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#54 of 187 OFFLINE   george kaplan

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Posted January 01 2004 - 04:18 PM

If Kung Fu in widescreen turns out not to be pan & scan, then I'll go ahead and buy it. But I will be absolutely shocked if this early 70s show was filmed with such foresight.
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#55 of 187 OFFLINE   Brian W.

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Posted January 01 2004 - 04:40 PM

[quote] If Kung Fu in widescreen turns out not to be pan & scan, then I'll go ahead and buy it. But I will be absolutely shocked if this early 70s show was filmed with such foresight. [quote]

It is pan & scan, George. I saw the 16:9 pilot tape at my work several months ago when the DVD was being mastered. I made a few screen caps, emailed them to myself, then rented the VHS of the pilot and compared them. They definitely shaved the top and bottom of the frame. There's no additional info at the sides. It's not AWFUL, but they are many instances where just the tippy-top of a person's head is cut off, just barely, or where the top of their head is just touching the top of the frame, which looks slightly odd.

#56 of 187 OFFLINE   Christian Preischl

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Posted January 02 2004 - 12:35 AM

[quote] Short of asking every single director of every episode of every television show getting a DVD release, we'll never know this for sure. [quote] Actually, they'd just have to ask one person: the producer. Here's a snippet from an interview with Joss Whedon where he talks about the differences between movie and TV directors and the job of the producer of a TV show:

"Now, somebody should protect the script, somebody should be there to do that. Directors have to be storytellers and all that stuff, and some are better than others. I'm talking about movie directors, because a TV director has to do that as much as they can, but ultimately are in service to the executive producer. The producer is the one who has to do that. But, you know, as Jeanine put it once, or probably more than once, "A director doesn't have to create anything, but he is responsible for everything." Same thing goes for an executive producer on TV. I don't have to write a line of the script - although there's not a script for my shows that I don't have a line in, or a scene, or a pitch, or something. I don't sew the damn costumes, I don't say the words - but I'm responsible for everything in every frame of every show. That's my job, whether or not I'm directing the episode."

And a little later:

"It's very simple. I said to one director... he said, "One of these days, I'm going to come down and look over your shoulder while you're shooting." I brought him up to my office the next day and I said, "Let me explain something to you. It is my job to control the way you shoot, not your job to control mine. My name comes at the end of every show. You do very good work and you're going to come back for us, but I am never going to let you do something that I don't approve of."

Complete interview here.

Chris

#57 of 187 OFFLINE   David Lambert

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Posted January 02 2004 - 12:52 AM

Chris that's a great find. I think that Joss spoke it very well.

We could probably have a thread just discussing that quote (there probably already is one over in the TV forum Posted Image ). But it does hearken back to my belief that the decision as to what the AR is for a show comes "from the top", and not from individual directors as some like to propose. Regardless of what a specific director decides to do about AR composition, the show will still be presented in the same AR in the same places week after week, as agreed upon by the shows producers and the studio that broadcasts it (or sometimes imposed upon by the studio, depending on some things).

There is the occasional change-up, like Buffy's 6th-season "Once More, With Feeling". But those are few and far between.
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#58 of 187 OFFLINE   Larry House

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Posted January 09 2004 - 06:54 AM

It may have been posted before, if so I apoligize for requesting it again, but does anyone have a (snail) mailing address for someone at Warner Home Video? I would like to express my extreme disappointment to them directly in writing

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#59 of 187 OFFLINE   Jeff Jacobson

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Posted January 09 2004 - 03:20 PM


Look here.

#60 of 187 OFFLINE   Mark Lx

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Posted February 10 2004 - 06:47 AM

An old thread, but I'm new. This is disappointing. There's only a limited number of TV DVD sets that I'm interested in (a number that isn't growing, having not watched TV in years), but Kung Fu is definitely one of them. I think many people will pick this up (partly because of the price) in complete ignorance of the OAR issue. I hope they heed to complaints and release a Season 2 at some point with the complete picture intact.




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