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RPTV that can show 720p w/o conversion?


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25 replies to this topic

#1 of 26 ashley__cooper

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Posted October 01 2003 - 03:50 PM

I've been looking, but I can't find anything that will do this. Also important is not converting 480i to anything else either. Basically no automatic conversion. As an indie filmmaker, the accuracy is important.
Thanks ahead of time for any help!

#2 of 26 DuWayne

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Posted October 01 2003 - 09:36 PM

um....there are plenty out there, like my Philips 55PL977S/3. It's 720p native LCOS RPTV. Plus almost any DLP.

#3 of 26 John_F

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Posted October 02 2003 - 12:18 AM

um....there are plenty out there, like my Philips 55PL977S/3. It's 720p native LCOS RPTV. Plus almost any DLP.
I don't think LCOS/DLP/LCD based sets would solve the OP's problem, wouldn't 480i need to be converted for LCOS?

#4 of 26 PhilBoy

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Posted October 02 2003 - 12:26 AM

Samsung DLP.
simplicity is genius...

#5 of 26 John_F

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Posted October 02 2003 - 12:29 AM

Samsung DLP.

Won't the Samsung DLP convert 480i?

#6 of 26 Michael TLV

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Posted October 02 2003 - 01:21 AM

Greetings

Mind you that HD sets also convert 480i to 480p so conversion of one sort or another is unavoidable.

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Michael @ The Laser Video Experience
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#7 of 26 PhilBoy

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Posted October 02 2003 - 02:46 AM

Oops... I shudda read the whole question.

Current Samsung DLP's native display is 720p. Everything coming in is converted to that (including 480i).

Sorry.
simplicity is genius...

#8 of 26 John_F

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Posted October 02 2003 - 02:52 AM

Michael, I was not aware of that, I thought there may be some CRT RPTV sets that display 480i "natively".

Thanks.

#9 of 26 DuWayne

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Posted October 02 2003 - 04:30 AM

Quote:
Michael, I was not aware of that, I thought there may be some CRT RPTV sets that display 480i "natively".


He really states 2 questions...

1. no convert on 480i
2. 720 native

You can't have both, but any DLP and LCOS will give you 720p native. Any non-HDTV RPTV /w componet inputs should do 480i.

#10 of 26 John_F

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Posted October 02 2003 - 04:49 AM

"...but any DLP and LCOS will give you 720p native. ..."

Not the Toshiba LCOS sets. Also, you keep leaving out LCD.

...Any non-HDTV RPTV /w componet inputs should do 480i.

Are these being sold anymore? I checked Panasonic, Toshiba, and Sony web sites, and all of their current RPTVs are HD compatible.

Also, do you need component inputs to do 480i, I thought that any connection (composite, S-Video) could pass 480i?

Thanks,
John Flegert

#11 of 26 DuWayne

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Posted October 02 2003 - 08:13 AM

Quote:
Not the Toshiba LCOS sets. Also, you keep leaving out LCD.


There isn't an Toshiba LCOS anymore....its MDed, and the "new" one isn't out (and may never). So, with that said, any current DLP/LCOS sets.

Quote:
Are these being sold anymore? I checked Panasonic, Toshiba, and Sony web sites, and all of their current RPTVs are HD compatible.


Any "HD Upgradable" RPTV (and there are plenty) will not take an HD progressive signal w/o an external box. Hence it should only accept 480i.

Quote:
Also, do you need component inputs to do 480i, I thought that any connection (composite, S-Video) could pass 480i?


I believe NTSC = 480i. So I believe any connection will do.

#12 of 26 Michael TLV

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Posted October 02 2003 - 08:19 AM

Greetings

There was a time when you could get a set that did this. A Panasonic RPTV from 4 years ago. It did 720 native and you could turn the line doubling off for 480i native material.

I have not seen a TV since the 2001 Pannys that could even disable the line doubling.

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#13 of 26 John_F

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Posted October 02 2003 - 08:29 AM

DuWayne, I am not familiar with the term "HD Upgradable". Could you please provide a a manufacturer and model # that has this?

Thanks again.

#14 of 26 DuWayne

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Posted October 02 2003 - 08:44 AM

Quote:
DuWayne, I am not familiar with the term "HD Upgradable". Could you please provide a a manufacturer and model # that has this?


There are WAY too many to list all, but here are some Mitsi's:

Series: Silver Series CRT Projection TV

WT-42313 42-inch Widescreen Table Top
HD-Upgradeable Television $1,799.00
WS-48313 48-inch Widescreen floor standing
HD-Upgradeable Television $2,199.00
WS-55313 55-inch Widescreen floor standing
HD-Upgradeable Television $2,599.00
WS-65313 65-inch Widescreen floor standing
HD-Upgradeable Television $3,199.00

Key Features: -- Full array of inputs and outputs to satisfy every
enthusiast
-- MonitorLink™ input for connection to the
HD-5000 HDTV Receiver/Controller upgrade
-- PerfectColor™ color control system that allows
for independent control of 6 colors
-- AMVP™ Advanced Multimedia Video Processor that
provides format conversion and dramatically
better picture performance from lower-resolution
signals (not available in WT-42313)

Series: Silver Plus Series CRT Projection TV

WT-42413 42-inch Widescreen Table Top
HD-Upgradeable Television $2,099.00
WS-48413 48-inch Widescreen floor standing
HD-Upgradeable Television $2,399.00
WS-55413 55-inch Widescreen floor standing
HD-Upgradeable Television $2,799.00
WS-65413 65-inch Widescreen floor standing
HD-Upgradeable Television $3,399.00

Key Features: All the features of the Silver Series, plus:

-- NetCommand-IR icon-based, on-screen home theater
analog device control system with IR learning
mode (not available in WT-42413)
-- QuadField Focus™ that produces sharper focus
and more detailed imagery
-- DefinEdge™ VSM that improves image transitions
from bright to dark scenes, controllable by
input.
-- Fully illuminated five-layer multibrand remote
for easy, sophisticated control in dark rooms.
-- Unique Plus Series upgraded cosmetic

#15 of 26 ashley__cooper

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Posted October 02 2003 - 09:17 AM

Thanks for the help, but I'm still a little confused. So it's not a possibility to get an HD rptv to show 480i native w/o conversion even if I don't go through the external HD converter?
So is my only option to find a 2001 panasonic? If so, could someone please give me some model numbers or somehting?
Am I crazy, or are these tvs just not designed for people with precise technical needs? Would I have better luck with projectors?

#16 of 26 DuWayne

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Posted October 02 2003 - 09:32 AM

Quote:
Thanks for the help, but I'm still a little confused. So it's not a possibility to get an HD rptv to show 480i native w/o conversion even if I don't go through the external HD converter?


The ones listed above should do 480i without HD box. BUT, you can not have a set thats says native 720p or 1080p/i and display a 480i source without converting.

#17 of 26 Stephen Tu

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Posted October 02 2003 - 10:00 AM

Look into professional studio monitors rather than consumer TV sets. Consumer TVs don't support multiple scan rates so they can be made cheaper. You'll have to spend a lot more money to get what you are apparently looking for. It may be impossible to get something that does both 480i (15.75 kHz scan rate) & 720p (45 kHz scan rate); you might have to buy 2 sets.

Fixed pixel display will also never work for this.

You'll have better luck with CRT front projectors; 480p->720p should be no problem to find. Don't know about 480i though. Don't you have a normal TV around you can use for the 480i?

#18 of 26 Matthew Todd

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Posted October 02 2003 - 10:12 AM

Would I have better luck with projectors?


As mentioned above, the only way to do this may be with a CRT projector. I've got a CRT front projector, and it can be fed any scan rate you want from 15kHz to 105kHz, so you can do 480i, 720p, 1080i, 1080p, etc.

You can set up a CRT front projector be be a rear projector, and I've even seen some that were manufactured that way with a built in screen (that's really what an RPTV is anyway, except that it's difficult to find consumer models that do multiple scan rates).

Used CRT projectors (and if you're lucky you may find one that is pre-setup for rear projection including the built in screen (e.g. I've seen an Ampro 3600 Retro like this) are about the same cost (or less) as an RPTV. The Ampro 3600 Retro I saw was available for $700, but they can be pretty hard to find.

Matt
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#19 of 26 John_F

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Posted October 03 2003 - 12:03 AM

DuWayne, thanks for the clarification. I guess I got a little confused by your phrasing:

Any "HD Upgradable" RPTV (and there are plenty) will not take an HD progressive signal w/o an external box. Hence it should only accept 480i.


I see now that you are refering to the original posters specific question.

I didn't think that "HD Upgradable" was a industry accepted terminology, for example, I believe Toshiba calls this HD compatible.

I guess I don't like your definition of HD upgradable because it seems to differ based on the display technology. For example your definition applies to RPTVs, but if you look at the Mit's plasma, they call it "HD Upgradable" even though it will accept 720p. Isn't Mits definition of "HD upgradable": an external HDTV STB is needed.

Sorry for hijacking the thread.

#20 of 26 DuWayne

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Posted October 03 2003 - 06:45 AM

Quote:
I guess I don't like your definition of HD upgradable because it seems to differ based on the display technology. For example your definition applies to RPTVs, but if you look at the Mit's plasma, they call it "HD Upgradable" even though it will accept 720p. Isn't Mits definition of "HD upgradable": an external HDTV STB is needed.


Quote:
The ones listed above should do 480i without HD box. BUT, you can not have a set thats says native 720p or 1080p/i and display a 480i source without converting.



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