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Just got the new Philips 55PL9773 LCOS...


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#1 of 68 DuWayne

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Posted September 09 2003 - 11:16 AM

I hope I put this in the right forum...

I love my set to death, but there is one thing I have to get used to. When watching broadcast TV, the 55PL9773 makes everything look like its being sent as a Live video feed.

Its a nice feature (Pixle Plus), but it will make you do a double-take when watching shows you just knew you seen before.


Now...for all resalers

When you go to set this display up in your store, PLEASE take the time and configure the settings correctly. I read that people went to Good Guys to see this set, and walked right back out the door. I kinda had the same response when I first turned my set on...

If you are going to display Broadcast TV...
1. Turn Active Control on Maximum
2. Set Display to Pixle Plus (or Movie Plus)
3. DNR to Maximum
4. Dynamic (something-a-nother) to OFF
5. Connect to AV1 Componet (480i) or S-Video

For HDTV
1. Connect to AV3 or AV4 Componet (720p)

For DVD/HDTV
1. Use DVI (720p)

Please use these settings at a minimum. This wonderful set has been getting pis-poor reviews unfairly.

Thanks....I will be more than happy to answer any questions one may have also.

#2 of 68 JayQuinty

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Posted September 10 2003 - 05:09 PM

DuWayne,

My wife and I saw the Phillips TV last week at Good Guys and it was pretty awesome looking. The rep said it had only been on the floor a matter of hours, and that they had sold out of them. The picture was fantastic, so they must have done something right to set it up. I hadn't even heard of LCOS prior to entering the store, and have spent the last 5 days here reading up on it. I'm considering this TV for my next purchase, so I have some questions for you. I'm no expert on this stuff so bear with me.

I've read that the DLP TV's suffer from a rainbow effect, and that LCOS "may" do the same. Have you noticed anything like this on this TV? Secondly, I'm curious as to whether or not you were able to negotiate with them on the price. I'm assuming not, since the thing just hit the showroom floor. I believe he said the TV was selling for $3999, no? Thirdly, what other TV's did you consider, and why did you choose the Phillips? And lastly, do you notice any artifact with fast moving scenes?


Thanks
Jay
Thanks,
Jay

#3 of 68 alan halvorson

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Posted September 11 2003 - 02:42 AM

Jay: I don't know about the Phillips, but all LCOS front projectors use three panels - one for each color - and not one as in DLP, and don't suffer from rainbow effects.

DwWayne: The one thing LCOS projectors fall down on is contrast ratio. How are the blacks?
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#4 of 68 DuWayne

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Posted September 11 2003 - 09:02 AM

Jay:
1. No raindow effect that I have seen. Unlike DLP, you can't see pixels when you walk up close to it.

2. $3999 is what I paid for it...From GoodGuys. Now this is the catch, Good Guys normally sells things at MRSP. Philips just raised this to $4199, due to demand. So act quickly.

3. I was looking at DLP, but that ended quickly. Sony is also coming out with a LCOS, but I will never buy a Sony again. You pay too much for the name alone.

4. As far as fast moving content. You ONLY notice this with Broadcast content, but this can be fix, by adjusting the setting correctly.

PS. I will post again once my DVE 2003 comes in and I optimize my set.

Alan:

1. The Philips is a one chip LCOS

2. I too was worried about Contrast, but those worries were put to rest real quick. The set is Bright and the Blacks ARE Black, not grey.
PS. I will know more once I use DVE 2003

Now, I am having one problem, which I think is my fault. I'm getting a purple haze on the right-center of the screen. I was told that the set could have been magnetize. Come to find out, my OLD center speaker was unshielded. So a Philips tech is coming out Tues. to take a look.

If anyone else know of a possible cause for this, please let me know.
Thanks.

#5 of 68 JeffreyMercado

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Posted September 11 2003 - 10:18 AM

A purple haze sounds like a magnet to me. Obviously remove the speaker from there. Turn off the tv, and after a while turn it back on and it should be gone.

#6 of 68 Ted Ross

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Posted September 11 2003 - 11:21 AM

Sound & Vision just did a review of the Philips LCoS. They compared it to a RCA DLP & a crt Toshiba.

#7 of 68 Parker Clack

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Posted September 11 2003 - 06:37 PM

Posted Image


Product Features & Benefits

Screen Size : 55" diagonal


Single Panel LCOS Technology
Philips single panel LCOS technology produces high resolution, flicker-free video, perfect convergence, without a visible pixelgrid. This Philips patented reflective technology enables a large screen size TV with low weight and shallow depth without any concerns for convergence or burn-in.

Super Slim Design : 17.4" deep

Pixel Plus™
Get more! More detail, more texture, more resolution, more high-definition-like images from any source. By enhancing the quality of the pixels on screen, Pixel Plus™ will take your viewing to new levels of enjoyment. Pixel Plus™ is only from Philips.

Digital Natural Motion™
Eliminates motion judder from film based sources such as DVD's for distortion-free, natural viewing.

Flexible Inputs for Data of HDTV : DVI with HDCP, 15 Pin DSUB, 2 sets HD Component. Enjoy connectivity and flexibility with broad input standard support.

Protective Anti-Glare Filter

Active Control™ Plus
By continually adjusting picture settings over 60 times per second, Active Control™ Plus ensures that the viewing experience is always optimal. Changes in ambient light are even automatically compensated for!

3D Y/C Comb Filter

Double Window / Two Tuner PIP

Virtual Dolby® Surround : 40 Watt RMS
Dolby® processing circuitry for enhanced surround sound effect creates the sensation of Dolby® Pro Logic without the hassle of additional rear speakers.

Incredible Surround
Dramatically expands the sound stage for enhanced stereo imaging and dimensionality.

Sound System : Hi-Fi Stereo
Recieves stereo broadcasts. Produces sound for performance through 4 speakers with an output of 2 X 15 W RMS. The loudspeaker configuration consists of two 2" tweeters and two 5" woofers. Full user controllable equalizer via the OSD menu with 4 presets "Movies, Speech, Music, and Multimedia".

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#8 of 68 JayQuinty

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Posted September 13 2003 - 09:42 AM

Anyone know if there's a big difference in picture quality in the single panel LCOS vs. the three panel LCOS? I haven't been able to find anything in writing on this.

Also, its interesting to see that there's such a huge variation in pricing between the upcoming Toshinba & RCA LCOS's compared to the Phillips. Maybe this is why Phillips is raising the MSRP on this TV.

DuWayne, when you bought your TV did GG have it in stock? I've called a couple of places about availability and they both say it's 4 to 6 weeks away. The GG where I first saw the TV also said they did not have any in stock. I didn't pay attention to whether they ever had any in stock, or if they just got a display model for the floor.

Thanks,

Jay

#9 of 68 DuWayne

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Posted September 13 2003 - 03:29 PM

Jay,

The Good Guys in my area only had 2 instock. They were only supose to get 1, but the Salesman I've been working with knew I wanted one now. so he was able to get an addional one shipped.

I was told recently by Good Guys that they were shipping directly from the warehouse on the 25th of Sep. They can't keep any in the stores.

#10 of 68 DuWayne

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Posted September 13 2003 - 03:45 PM

Something I find interesting...

RCA L5000

"A built-in decoder will accept and display all off-air digital HDTV signals, as well as regular and high definition DIRECTV signals (RCA’s digital satellite service). Unfortunately, the output to the screen is only at the 720P resolution which, while still excellent, isn’t as flexible as TV’s that also display 1080i, the other major HDTV format."

It only supports 720p ?

"Pricing for the L50000 should be $6,000 to $8,000."

I guess $4000 was more of a steal than I thought.


The Toshiba 57HLX82 does have the best potential Resolution display with a 3-chip 1080p LCOS....But you WILL pay for it = $8999

#11 of 68 Robert_Dufresne

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Posted September 13 2003 - 04:18 PM

DuWayne

LCOS will not be afected by magnet . Only crt based technology can be affected by magnet.

Robert
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#12 of 68 DuWayne

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Posted September 13 2003 - 08:39 PM

Robert,

That is interesting...Now I really want to know what the Philips tech has to say (or going to do) when he comes out Tues.

Either way, if I'm not saitfied, I have the ability to get a brand-new one, when Good Guys get their shipment on the 25th.

thanks

#13 of 68 Robert_Dufresne

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Posted September 14 2003 - 02:08 AM

DuWayne

Please keep us informed of the results, this is new
technology and I am shure a lot of us want to know
what the tech. will find out.

Thanks, and good luck!

Robert
"and if my grand-mother had wheels she'd be a wagon" Montgomery Scott Eng. USS Enterprise

#14 of 68 Stephen Tu

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Posted September 14 2003 - 12:45 PM

Quote:
It only supports 720p ?

Like all fixed pixel devices the Philips & the defunct RCA only have a single display resolution. All other resolutions are converted to 720p for display.

Quote:
isn’t as flexible as TV’s that also display 1080i,
The CRT TVs that display 1080i are also inflexible! They don't display 720p; they convert 720p to 1080i or require an external STB to do it. Panasonic used to make CRT RPTVs with multiple scan rates that did both natively, but they were discontinued in favor of cheaper sets.

Quote:
"Pricing for the L50000 should be $6,000 to $8,000."
The RCA is a long dead product that should not be bought at any price IMO.

Quote:
The Toshiba 57HLX82 does have the best potential Resolution display with a 3-chip 1080p LCOS....But you WILL pay for it = $8999
Yes, but the follow on version 57HL83 lists for less, $5500; probably can get it for $5000 street. The 57HLX82 was discontinued. Though there is a rumor floating that the 57HL83 may not make it out until the end of the year or might even never be released.

Re 3-chip vs. 1-chip - one chip saves costs, but some people will see a "rainbow" artifact on some scenes.

#15 of 68 Rod K

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Posted September 14 2003 - 02:41 PM

I saw Sears website posted the Philips 55PL9523 at 3,514.99 on Friday but now it's all gone. Now they post only 44" at 2,999

DuWayne, I wonder how it compares with the Panny PT50LC13 and Sammy DLP. Does it require to change the bulb like others? and How much the biulb costs? Thanks

#16 of 68 JauCheeze

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Posted September 14 2003 - 04:37 PM

I am also wondering how does this compare to the samsung dlp. What are the pros/cons of each?

#17 of 68 DuWayne

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Posted September 15 2003 - 05:13 AM

Quote:
Like all fixed pixel devices the Philips & the defunct RCA only have a single display resolution. All other resolutions are converted to 720p for display.



This is not True for the 55PL9773/S. I can Display all three formats. I proved this by using my Samsung DVD player /w DVI output, which I connected to AV6(DVI). While playing Ice Age, I switch between the 3 modes that were supported by AV6 (480p, 720p & 1080i). I noticed that 1080i had color seperation when you looked at the sky up close. 480p had a better color blend, but 720p was the best overall with great, sharp resolution.

Quote:
Yes, but the follow on version 57HL83 lists for less, $5500; probably can get it for $5000 street. The 57HLX82 was discontinued. Though there is a rumor floating that the 57HL83 may not make it out until the end of the year or might even never be released.



With that price, I supect that it will be a 1-Chip LCOS...but maybe not. I know Philips has patents on the 1-chip LCOS. We all know that Philips also supply chips/parts to other manufactures, so this could be the case with the 57HLX82. But I'm not going to even pretend to know that as fact.

Quote:
saw Sears website posted the Philips 55PL9523 at 3,514.99 on Friday but now it's all gone. Now they post only 44" at 2,999



I saw the samething...One thing to keep in mind:

The 55PL9523/S & 44PL9523/S are WITHOUT PixelPlus
The 55PL9773/S $ 44PL9773/S are WITH PixelPlus

Quote:
DuWayne, I wonder how it compares with the Panny PT50LC13 and Sammy DLP. Does it require to change the bulb like others? and How much the biulb costs? Thanks




I haven't seen the PT50LC13, so can't speak on it. The Samsung 50-inch DLP was going to be my first buy, but I didn't like the Screen-Door effect that you get with the DLP set. Plus, viewing this set from angles was pretty bad.

Although I can stand on the side of the 55PL9773/S and still see the Picture, it is also on a swivle, which makes it that much more easy to watch TV from my Computer desk.

On another note...

I recently went to GoodGuys and connfigured their 55PL9773. With regular broadcast TV (on coax), I had the 55PL9773/S look better that their Plasma Displays with the same brodcast. The salesmen were dumb-founded.

#18 of 68 DuWayne

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Posted September 15 2003 - 05:25 AM

Quote:
Does it require to change the bulb like others? and How much the biulb costs?


You do change out bulbs every 6000hrs. Although you can continue to use the TV after 6000hrs, you will not get full brightness and a nagging message everytime you turn on the TV after 5900hrs. As far as price, I don't know. But I'll prob. will buy 1 or two before the yeas end, just so I don't have to deal with it later. I did hear on the net that the lamps run around $250-$300.

#19 of 68 Stephen Tu

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Posted September 15 2003 - 07:11 AM

Quote:
This is not True for the 55PL9773/S. I can Display all three formats.
It most certainly is true. The TV accepts all formats, but internally it is converting those other formats to 720p so its 1280x720p LCOS chip can display it. It's just how these things work. That chip has a fixed number of pixels; it won't display anything else natively.

Quote:
With that price, I supect that it will be a 1-Chip LCOS...but maybe not.
The Toshiba 57HL83 & 65HLX83 are both 3-chip designs.

Quote:
I know Philips has patents on the 1-chip LCOS.
For their "spinning prism" technology for color display on 1 chip I'm sure they have patents, but they don't have control of 1-chip display in general. Another manufacturer could use some different 1-chip design if they wanted to.

Quote:
We all know that Philips also supply chips/parts to other manufactures, so this could be the case with the 57HLX82.
Hitachi, not Phillips, supplies LCOS to Toshiba.

#20 of 68 DuWayne

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Posted September 15 2003 - 10:29 AM

Quote:
It most certainly is true. The TV accepts all formats, but internally it is converting those other formats to 720p so its 1280x720p LCOS chip can display it. It's just how these things work. That chip has a fixed number of pixels; it won't display anything else natively.



Ok, So my next questions are:

1. Why do I see the difference in quality when I do the test stated above. (AV6 DVI)

2. If all sources are displayed equal, why would I have certain inputs allowing only certain Resolutions on the 55PL9773. Would it not matter, since everything is upscaled to 720p anyway.

3. When I hook up my Xbox and play a game that support both 480p and 720p (Soul Calibur II), why do I see the same 480p resolution that I see on my 480p CRT and a MUCH higher resolution when I switch over to 720p.

Note: I have comfirm that it upscales everything to 720p, but still leaves the question of why I can "see" different resolutions.


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