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help setting up my system, first time.


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23 replies to this topic

#1 of 24 OFFLINE   Dustin Wind

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Posted August 27 2003 - 12:19 PM

Hi all,
First i will say, i completely understand if nobody answers here because i'm asking a lot.

But if someone is bored at work or something, and want to kill some time....

I have never hooked up a home system and move into my new house on Friday and i'm getting all my stuff delivered.
65" Toshiba HX
Pioneer 563A DvD
Yamaha 5650 Receiver
Velodyne Sub
JBL speakers.
HDTV BOX
Gamecube with S video
X-box with comp video
panasonic VCR

Whats the best way to hook this up step by step? I'm also using 3 sets of audio cables for my DVD to receiver for my digtal/DTS sound....not optical...

All my cables are Aucustic Research Master series.

I'm pretty sure i have the proper amount of cables...i have 3 bags full!
I believe i have 3 sets of composite cables just for the HDTV box.

I really don't know what i'm doing, but from what i have been reading on these boards, it shouldn't be too hard with a little help.

So if someone can explain where what cables goes, thats would be great!
I'm also going to assume the regular cable goes direct into the HDTV BOX....then what lol Posted Image

Also my old sub for my old system has only one direct cable from sub to receiver....the new cables i bought for my new sub have 2 ends....where on the sub and receiver do i stick them?

Like i said...i understand if nobody answers because its a lot of explaining Posted Image

Thanks if anyone is bored.

I CAN'T WAIT FOR FRIDAY!!!!

#2 of 24 OFFLINE   Bill_Wil

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Posted August 27 2003 - 12:32 PM

Dustin,
Welcome to the forum and congratulations on your new system. Well as soon as its delivered anyway. Posted Image

Ok a couple things need to be cleared up. You said
Quote:
I'm also using 3 sets of audio cables for my DVD to receiver for my digtal/DTS sound....not optical...

I dont really understand this. Normally you would have a single audio cable running from DVD to receiver for digital sound, either optical or coaxial. Why do you have 3 cables?

You also said
Quote:
I believe i have 3 sets of composite cables just for the HDTV box.

In order to view a HD picture I'm pretty sure you need to use component cables and not composite. When you said composite did you actually mean component?

Of course I could be mistaken about this stuff and if I am then I apologize.

Oh ya, which JBL speakers did you get? I'm a JBL fan.

#3 of 24 OFFLINE   Dustin Wind

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Posted August 27 2003 - 03:12 PM

Thanks Bill. I'm really excited to get everything. I'm just not excited that i have to take the tv apart to fit it downstairs...i hope i don't do anything wrong.
The JBL's are the northridge series.

Yes i meant component video...not composite.

I chose the 6 audio cables because of the some discussions on this board.
Here is a copy and paste of a comment:
__________________________________________________ ________
Unfortunately Dustin, opinions as to whether a single digital cable (optical or coax) or 6 audio cables is best for actually transmitting the audio signals is a bit like having an opinion on the existence of God. This is most especially true for serious audiophiles.

Since both DD and DTS are compressed and the bit rates reasonably low, there is not too much controversy as to sending these soundtracks via a digital connection. However DVD-A and SACD use many more bits to convey the audio signal(s) and some feel that not enough of this information can be sent via digital connections and feel that the six analog connections provide a transmission environment that delivers all of the information, without loss.
Many serious listeners claim to be able to detect a difference. I don’t know enough about the amount of data (in terms of Mb/sec) requirements of DVD-A and SACD to have a valid opinion, but most of those who listen seriously and have high-end equipment prefer the analog connections.
__________________________________________________ _________




So any help hooking up my system, would be great if anyone has time and patience Posted Image

#4 of 24 OFFLINE   Bill_Wil

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Posted August 28 2003 - 02:41 AM

Did you order floorstanding speakers for the front or bookshelf? What model numbers?

As far as those audio cables go I'm not familiar with using 3 or 6 analog cables in place of one digital cable so I cant really comment. For some reason I was under the impression that you needed to use either an optical or coaxial digital cable in order to get digital sound. That post you mentioned does refer to DVD-A and SACD players so maybe it has something to do with just those formats and I dont have either one.

#5 of 24 OFFLINE   brentl

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Posted August 28 2003 - 03:37 AM

Bill, that's what I'm thinking too. For DTS and DD you only need either a Coax digital cable(RCA) or an optical digital(Toslink) cable.

The DVD player will play both DVD-audio, and SACD, I just checked. That way you may have some control to do with bass management, but you may need to check in the "tweaking" forum.

As you can tell I'm not up on DVD-audio and SACD. I don't listen that intently to my music.

You cable to you subwoofer should be a single RCA cable, not 2. G back and get a proper cable or just use one of the two you've got sitting around(in the bag).

Brent
If you were a few hours closer I'd come by and help you set up, but for me to write it all down it's too much work at the speed I type.

Somebody will come along I hopE.

#6 of 24 OFFLINE   Dustin Wind

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Posted August 28 2003 - 04:15 AM

I don't blame you Brent.
ONE MORE DAY!!!!!

Bill: My speakers are the only part i didn't upgrade. There about 2 years old.
they are the bookshelves.
N24 and N26's with the N-center.

I was told these are good speakers so i don't need to upgrade.
I would upgrade my speakers if i knew i could get much better for $700-$1000 CAN ($400-700 US). The rest of my system kicks ass so i don't want to get cheap on my speakers....but i have been told my speakers are great....even though there just the small satalites....i know nothing about this stuff.


Heres another comment by somebody about my 6 analog cables instead of Optical or digital coaxial:
__________________________________________________ ________
The Pioneer 563 has DD and DTS decoders built in. So, you could watch (and listen) your movies using the DD and DTS decoders built into the Pioneer. For this you would use the 5.1 channel analog out (your 3 pairs of audio cables) and the external decoder input on the receiver. In this case, the decoder in the Pioneer would determine the bass management characteristics.

Alternatively, you could use the digital out (optical or coaxial) from the Pioneer and let the DD and DTS decoder in the receiver handle the decoding and bass management (a better choice IMO).
__________________________________________________ _________

I actually listened to both at future shop with my DvD player and there was about 6 people crowded around listening and everything thought the 3 pairs of audio cables sounded better then the digital cables.

Man this stuff is confusing.
I'm also gearing towards the 3 sets of audio cables because my buddy works at future shop i get all my cables at 60% off.
There regular $99 for the Master series AR and i paid $45ish for each one.....can't go wrong with that price.

But i guess i could also get one more optic and switch it around to see what kind of hook up i like better.

now i could just learn to hook my system...i'm laughing Posted Image

#7 of 24 OFFLINE   Jeff Gatie

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Posted August 28 2003 - 04:31 AM

I would recommend the digital out and let the decoders on the receiver decode the digital stream, unless you want DVD-Audio or another audio format. The reasons are:

1) The decoders on the receiver are usually better than those on the DVD player.
2) The receiver almost certainly has better bass management than the DVD.
3) A single coax or optical interconnect at discount is certainly cheaper than 3 pairs of audio cables at discount.
4) Less interconnects means less wire management at the back of the receiver. Less wires to hide.

The reason things sounded better from the analog connections may not be isolated to the connections. If the system was not calibrated for each method, the difference you heard may be because one was way off and the other closer to proper calibration. Ditto with the bass management and the settings on the receiver. Unless you listen to both in your system after careful calibration, I think you are doing yourself a disservice by not trying the (traditionally) superior method of the digital interconnect. Of course, all this is out the window if you want DVD-Audio.

#8 of 24 OFFLINE   Dustin Wind

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Posted August 28 2003 - 04:56 AM

Man the decision is hard.
I talked to 5 guys who work at future shop about this and they all tell me the audio cables is a better decision then fiber optic with this specific pioneer 563A DvD player and my Yamaha 5650.
they say movies will sound better....i don't really listen to music....only in my car.

One of them is one of my best friends and i know he wants the best for my system.
I wish i knew what to do.

most people on his forum do say i should use the fiber optic over the audio cables....but a lot are also saying its a personal preferance.

I just want the best for my system and i don't really have the best ear to "test" which format i like better.

#9 of 24 OFFLINE   Dustin Wind

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Posted August 28 2003 - 05:00 AM

What if i kept audio cables and bought a fiber optic....when i put in a DvD, do i have to specify if i want it to use the Optical or the audio cables or does it take preferance somehow?

#10 of 24 OFFLINE   Ted Lee

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Posted August 28 2003 - 09:17 AM

dustin -

start with this nice post from another htf'r

http://www.hometheat....68#post1733868

it kind of details all the steps you can take.

in a nutshell, you have two major options.

1. run everything (audio & video) to the receiver
2. run all audio to the receiver, all video to your tv

some people like running video directly to the tv because it lessens the chance for signal degredation. running everything to the receiver makes it simpler to switch sources, but may cause degredation. i suggest you try both ways and see if you notice a difference.
 

#11 of 24 OFFLINE   Bill_Wil

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Posted August 28 2003 - 11:09 AM

I took a look at your DVD player at crutchfield.com and it seems like you're going to be using way more cables than necessary. Using the 3 sets of analog audio cables will only be helping you out if you're going to be playing SACD and some DVD-A discs and you said that you wont really be using the system for music. Its all a personal preferance though.
Since you said that your best friend works at furture shop and that he and some others were making the recommendations for you then it only makes sense to have him help you out with the setup to make sure it all goes smoothly. That would be a lot easier than having someone try to post step-by-step instructions on here without actually seeing everything thats going on.
You had a question about the cable for your sub having two RCA ends. Well you'll have to take a look at your sub and see if it has 2 inputs (L,R) or one. Also look at the receiver and see if it has 2 LFE outputs (L,R) or one. If theres only one like on your old sub then you'll only use a single ended cable. If the receiver has one output but the sub has 2 inputs then use a single cable and plug it into the "left" input on the sub. You could also pick up a Y splitter so you can run the single ended cable from the receiver and then plug into both inputs on the sub.
Hopefully your friend will be willing to help you out.
Good luck!!

#12 of 24 OFFLINE   Bill_Wil

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Posted August 28 2003 - 12:15 PM

For an awesome speaker upgrade within the Northridge series for $398 check these out....
http://www.jandr.com....uct_Id=2822542

Use those in the front and move your N26's to the back.

#13 of 24 OFFLINE   Dustin Wind

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Posted August 28 2003 - 01:40 PM

Bill,
Ya my buddy from future shop is coming over to hook up my stuff. But not until Tuesday.
I get my stuff on Friday so i wanted to hook it up myself.
I can't imagine staring at this stuff for 3 days......

So i will notice a big difference with these speakers?
also....i'm been doing some research at Dolby digtal and they say the Front and back speakers should all be the same level.

Well my center will be on top of my 65", so i planned on my N26's being on stands and putting them on the same level as the center....with those big speakers your recomending....how do you get them high enough to be flush with the center speaker?


Also i spoke to my friend, and he again said i shouldn't get digital for the sound....he said i want 6 channels, so i need the audio cables.....i plan on adding a back speaker soon.
He told me "just wait until you hear the audio, it will blow you away and sound better then digital.

I hate how so many people are telling me diffrent things.

Thanks for all the posts....everything is helping so much.

#14 of 24 OFFLINE   Dustin Wind

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Posted August 28 2003 - 01:48 PM

Alright, checked out the speakers you recommend....there $999 CAN for the pair.
So my friend can get them for like $800 for me.

how much of a difference will it make compared to my N26's?

I was actually going to have to go out and get another "N-center" and use that for my BACK speaker for 6.1 sound ( yes N-Center, because Future shop doesn't sell N24 or 26's single..only the center so i would have used that for the back)....but this would make sense to use the:
ND310II for the front
N26's for the rear left and right
N24 for the BACK.

Whats your opinion on the N38II? My girl might freak out if i come home with the NDS10II's.
Are the N38II a BIG upgrade compared to the N26's or no?

Thanks bill

#15 of 24 OFFLINE   Jeff Gatie

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Posted August 29 2003 - 12:29 AM

Quote:
Also i spoke to my friend, and he again said i shouldn't get digital for the sound....he said i want 6 channels, so i need the audio cables.....


With all due respect, your friend is wrong. You will get 6 channels with the digital hookup. The same digital stream from the DVD that is decoded and sent to the analog outs on the DVD player is passed to the receiver by the digital connection. It is then decoded at the receiver and sent to the speakers. Your friend may be under the impression that you need 3 sets of audio cables because telling people you need them sells more cables (which makes Future Shop very happy because it sells more cables). I'm not saying your friend is lying to you, just misled by a store policy that likes to sell expensive cables. You will definately get 5.1 from the digital out and probably better 5.1 than the analog outs. Tell your friend to read these threads, he may learn something new.

Once again, if you are not going to listen to any DVD audio only format, you do not need to hook up the 5.1 analog outs. The digital out is sufficient and usually superior.

#16 of 24 OFFLINE   brentl

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Posted August 29 2003 - 02:37 AM

I'm sure that an SACD or DVD-audio disc will sound better coming from the DVD player , but you said you don't listen to music at home!!!!!

Stick to a CO-ax digital cable for your movies, don't waste your time or money on the others.

Put the $90+tax you save towards the floorstanders that would make much more sense!!

Brent

#17 of 24 OFFLINE   Bill_Wil

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Posted August 29 2003 - 03:32 AM

As Jeff stated your friend is mistaken in thinking that you cant get 6.1 audio through the digital connection. It seems like maybe your friend is talking about music (SACD) and youre talking about movies (DVD). Does he know that you're going to be using the system for almost all movies?
The floorstanding speakers would be a big improvement but I wish you could at least hear them before spending the money. I listened to the N38's and the ND310's and I thought that the N38's were a bit muffled in comparison to the ND310's. I still think you should try to hear them for yourself if its possible.

#18 of 24 OFFLINE   Ted Lee

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Posted August 29 2003 - 06:02 AM

Quote:
It seems like maybe your friend is talking about music (SACD) and youre talking about movies (DVD).
i think this is likely the case.

make sure you two are on the same page.

movies (dts/dd) - you only need one digital connection, whether it be optical or co-ax.

music (sacd/dvd-a) - you will need six cables (one for each channel, including the sub). the reason you need six for music is because of the music industry's concern about digital piracy. by "forcing" you to use the analog cables, the music industry is comforted in knowing that pure digital copies will not be possible.
 

#19 of 24 OFFLINE   Glenn Overholt

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Posted August 29 2003 - 09:51 AM

Ted, this is something new that they have done? (CD players without a digital output)? I only ask because mine have them.

Glenn

#20 of 24 OFFLINE   AlbertA

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Posted August 29 2003 - 11:05 AM

Glenn: he said sacd/dvd-a. These are not regular cd players, these are high resolution audio players.

For both technical and political reasons current sacd and dvd-a cannot output a digital signal through s/pdif.
“Music is the arithmetic of sounds as optics is the geometry of light.” --Claude Debussy


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