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SVS Ultra vs. PB2+ ?


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15 replies to this topic

#1 of 16 OFFLINE   JackS

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Posted July 12 2003 - 02:04 AM

It may be a little too soon to ask but, has anyone upgraded from the Ultra to the PB2+? I was wondering how the single premium driver in the Ultra compared with the dual Plus drivers in the PB2+ . I did do a search but didn't find anything. Thanks, Jack

#2 of 16 OFFLINE   Edward J M

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Posted July 12 2003 - 10:37 AM

Jack:

A quote from Tom Vodhanel, SVS designer:

Quote:
With both subs set to 20hz extension, the PB-2+ will have a 4-5dB edge on the single Ultra in the 25-100hz range. In the 16-25hz range it would be a lot closer...with the PB-2+ still holding a slight advantage.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Ed
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#3 of 16 OFFLINE   steve nn

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Posted July 12 2003 - 11:32 AM

Well Jack I just took my AV15 out of the mix and put 450 watts to each of my 25-31 CS+'s and I most assuredly can tell you that the PB2-PLUS will and can knock your socks off! It's one thing to know and then it"s another thing to really know.

#4 of 16 OFFLINE   JackS

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Posted July 12 2003 - 01:33 PM

Thanks for the replys Ed, Steve. As much as I'd love to have the PB2+ I think I'm going to compromise a little and go for the Ultra. Aside from the slightly less money, the Ultra in my very small room will no doubt be more than I will ever need which is why I was interested in these two subs to begin with. I still have a coupla of weeks before making my final decision and in the meantime I'll enjoy reading more opinions and reviews on the SVS's. Again thanks, Jack

#5 of 16 OFFLINE   Arthur Vino

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Posted July 12 2003 - 04:22 PM

every time I read Ultra, I picture svs soon to be announced product pb2-ultra...

#6 of 16 OFFLINE   JessPrice

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Posted July 12 2003 - 04:32 PM

"every time I read Ultra, I picture svs soon to be announced product pb2-ultra..."

Same here, I keep thinking that. I want it SO bad, but I cannot afford the extra $800 for some extra dB gain in the 20hz region (or the fancy makeover).

#7 of 16 OFFLINE   Edward J M

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Posted July 13 2003 - 02:15 AM

Jack:

In your case I think the Ultra is a better choice than the PB2+. In a small room, you will never exploit the max SPL of either subwoofer, and the Ultra has a smaller footprint, digs deeper in the stock tune, and you are getting the killer TV-12 woof. Great choice.

JessPrice:

Clearly, the performance difference alone cannot justify the $800 price difference between the PB2-Plus and the PB2-Ultra. You have to look at the furniture grade wood finish, and the extremely costly technology of the TV-12 driver.

I think Ron's analogy with the 'vette's is a great one. The stock 350 hp 'vette can outclass just about anything on the road and is clearly an incredible performance value. The considerably more expensive Z06 'vette with 405 hp can get down the 1320 a few tenths quicker, but most people will buy the Z06 as much for the exclusivity and killer motor as for the fractionally better performance.

Like another poster said, you don't need it, you want it. And that alone is a perfectly valid reason for some people. Posted Image

Regards,

Ed
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#8 of 16 OFFLINE   Jack Gilvey

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Posted July 13 2003 - 02:59 AM

Quote:
Like another poster said, you don't need it, you want it. And that alone is a perfectly valid reason for some people.

Certainly is for me. Posted Image Given that I don't actually need any of this stuff, wanting is the best reason of all, and why such products are available. Posted Image
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#9 of 16 OFFLINE   steve nn

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Posted July 13 2003 - 03:04 AM

Very good point Edward on the $800 difference in price to performance capability. My bass dollars don't come easy so I better come back to earth and stick with my original plan of teaming up the PB2-PLUS with most of what I have now. Considering the output capability of just one dB 12 driver, I think this option will suit me just fine.

#10 of 16 OFFLINE   AndySw

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Posted July 13 2003 - 03:10 AM

As much as I'd love to have the PB2+ I think I'm going to compromise a little and go for the Ultra.


I've never heard an Ultra described as a compromise before... Posted Image

Andy.

#11 of 16 OFFLINE   Bill_D

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Posted July 13 2003 - 04:19 AM

I fall very squarely into the want category.

I have the original Dual CS-Ultra w/Samson S1000 combo. My Ultras do not have the upgraded driver. I have been planning to upgrade the Ultras with the new TV-12s but they are persistently on back-order. This is good path for me because the drivers are $579 each and SVS will credit $250 per orig. woof if you return them. So, I can temporarily suppress the "want" bug for $658 plus shipping. With shipping included, I suspect that the total cost involved would tip over $700, which is $550 away from a PB2+, which can be easily made up by selling 1 of the ultras and the Samson..........

Finally, where the PB2+ stand performance wise in relation to the original CS Ultra combo.

#12 of 16 OFFLINE   Chip E

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Posted July 13 2003 - 03:29 PM

Like another poster said, you don't need it, you want it. And that alone is a perfectly valid reason for some people.



Yep, very valid reason. Posted Image
- Chip

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#13 of 16 OFFLINE   Joel~Solid

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Posted July 13 2003 - 06:52 PM

Well from a strictly for the performance stand point I'm going with the a Dual Pb2+ set up. I have a large room to fill so I need it. At first when I saw that SVS is doing a PB2 Ultra I was bummed cause might have gone that route. But then I thought about what I paid for my Dual PB2+ set up and what a single PB2 Ultra set is approximated at and I have zero regrets with my decision. I figure my setup will out do a single PB2 ultra set up no problem. Just waiting on those Plus Drivers to get back in stock.

Joel

#14 of 16 OFFLINE   Edward J M

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Posted July 14 2003 - 02:57 AM

Quote:
Finally, where the PB2+ stand performance wise in relation to the original CS Ultra combo.

Bill, maybe the best question would be how does the original Ultra driver stack up against the current dB-12 Plus driver.

Here is a quote from the SVS website regarding the dB-12 Plus driver:

"How good is it? Well, it forced us to totally redesign the CS-Ultra driver back in December '02 since it was almost too good."

Read between the lines and I think you can conclude that above 25 Hz, a PB2-Plus will give an original driver dual Ultra set-up all it can handle and then some.

Still, the 20-39 Ultra enclosure will dig deeper in the stock tune. Even if you tuned the PB2-Plus to 20 Hz, I would still expect the original driver dual Ultra set-up to have an output advantage in the 16-25 Hz region. There is no substitute for port area way down low, and the dual Ultra set-up in the stock 20 Hz tune would have considerably more port area (six 3" flared ports) than the PB2-Plus in the 20 Hz tune (two 4" flared ports).

If I was you, I'd upgrade to the TV-12 drivers for $700. Dual co-located TV-12 Ultras would stomp a PB2-Plus pretty well, especially below 25 Hz. You will have better drivers, a lower stock tune point, more port area, and more power.

Regards,

Ed
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"What we do in life, echoes in eternity."


#15 of 16 OFFLINE   Edward J M

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Posted July 14 2003 - 03:13 AM

Quote:
Well from a strictly for the performance stand point I'm going with the a Dual Pb2+ set up. I have a large room to fill so I need it. At first when I saw that SVS is doing a PB2 Ultra I was bummed cause might have gone that route. But then I thought about what I paid for my Dual PB2+ set up and what a single PB2 Ultra set is approximated at and I have zero regrets with my decision. I figure my setup will out do a single PB2 ultra set up no problem.

Your thinking is right on here Joel. The PB2-Plus is clearly the better performance value of the two. It has been well established the TV-12 driver has about a 1.5 dB maximum output advantage over the dB-12 driver.

Dual PB2-Plus (especially co-located) would walk all over a single PB2-Ultra in terms of maximum clean output capability.

Considering that the PB2-Ultra weighs about 50 pounds (195 pounds vs. 145 pounds shipped) more than the PB2-Plus, you are probably looking at $2,150 shipped for a single PB2-Ultra vs. $2,500 shipped for dual PB2-Plus.

The demographic looking to buy the PB2-Ultra (and I predict it will sell very well) will have somewhat more disposable income and will be as much interested in the furniture grade wood finish and the exclusivity and high technology of the TV-12 driver as the fractionally better performance.

If your first priority is putting up some really big numbers in a huge room - dual PB2-Plus - all day.

Regards,

Ed
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"What we do in life, echoes in eternity."


#16 of 16 OFFLINE   Joel~Solid

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Posted July 14 2003 - 07:17 PM

Dual PB2-Plus (especially co-located) would walk all over a single PB2-Ultra in terms of maximum clean output capability.


ED,

You always know what to say Posted Image

My pair is suppose to ship at the end of this week. I'll be crossing my fingers.

Joel


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