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Wonderful Women 1 Draft (Vickie's rules)


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#1 of 169 OFFLINE   Vickie_M

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Posted April 10 2003 - 11:28 AM

Participants list:

1. Vickie_M
2. Zen Butler
3. Brad Porter
4. Angelo.M
5. Steeve Bergeron
6. Andy Olivera
7. Chris_Richard
8. ChuckDeLa


====================

1. Vickie_M
- Kate Bush (musician)
- Happy Rhodes (musician)
- Jane Siberry (musician)
- Victoria Williams (musician)
- Nicole Kidman (actress)
- Elizabeth Montgomery (actress)
- Trinity (movie character: The Matrix)
- Valentina Tereshkova (astronaut, first woman in space)
- Sally Ride (astronaut)
- Nadine Strossen (activist)
- Svetlana Savitskaya (astronaut)
- Julianne Moore (actress)
- The women of The Rabbit-Proof Fence


2. Zen Butler
- Lynne Louise (Zen's mother)
- Bjork (musician)
- Alice (literary character: Alice In Wonderland)
- Kim Gordon (musician)
- Lisa Gerrard (musician)
- Skye Edwards (singer)
- P J Harvey (musician)
- Takako Minekawa (musician)
- Kelli Ali (musician)
- Kate Beckinsale (actress)
- Enid Coleslaw (movie character: Ghost World)


3. Brad Porter
- Audrey Hepburn (actress)
- Aimee Mann (musician)
- Amy Sherman-Palladino (television writer)
- Marty (film character: Beautiful Girls)
- Mitochondrial Eve (mother)
- Barbara Stanwyck (actress)
- Lisa Miller (television character: Newsradio)
- Cathy Rogers (television producer)
- Dr. Shannon Lucid (astronaut)
- Jane Craig (movie character: Broadcast News)
- Katharine Hepburn (actress)
- Heather Graham (actress)
- Maggie O'Connell (television character: Northern Exposure)
- Ayn Rand (writer)


4. Angelo.M
- Rosalind Franklin (scientist)
- Jean Heller (reporter)
- Coco Chanel (designer)
- Emmeline Pankhurst (suffragette)
- Maria Callas (opera singer)
- Billie Holiday (singer)
- The Oracle (film character: The Matrix)
- Martha Graham (dancer/choreographer)
- Dorothy Parker (writer)
- Bessie Smith (singer)
- Virginia Woolfe (writer)
- Brigitte Bardot (actress)


5. Steeve Bergeron
- Sophie Marceau (actress)
- Vivien Leigh (actress)
- Jenny Agutter (actress)
- Isabelle Adjani (actress)
- Grace Kelly (actress)
- Ingrid Bergman (actress)
- Amelie Poulain (movie character: Amelie)
- Juliette Binoche (actress)
- Rachel Weisz (actress)
- Carrie-Anne Moss (actress)
- Monica Bellucci (actress)


6. Andy Olivera
- Natasha Henstridge (actress)
- Michelle Pfeiffer (actress)
- Naomi Watts (actress)
- Terry Farrell (actress)
- Jennifer Connelly (actress)
- Jeri Ryan (actress)
- Cameron Diaz (actress)
- Daryl Hannah (actress)
- Nastassja Kinski (actress)
- Lori Singer (actress)
- Famke Janssen (actress)
- Rachel Blanchard (actress)


7. Chris_Richard
- Natalie Merchant (musician)
- Helen Mirren (actress)
- Anne Lennox (musician)
- Rachel Carson (biologist)
- Jennifer Jason Leigh (actress)
- Myrna Loy (actress)
- Anna Karina (actress)
- Sheryl Crow (musician)
- Ursula K. Le Guin (writer)
- Margaret Atwood (writer)


8. ChuckDeLa
- Shivika Asthana (musician)
- Maureen (Moe) Tucker (musician)
- Connie Willis (writer)
- Shelley Duvall (actress)
- Dian Fossey (naturalist)
- Joni Mitchell (musician)
- Maki Nomiya (singer with Pizzicato Five)
- Wendy Smith (singer for Prefab Sprout)
- Gwendolyn Brooks (poet)
- Elizabeth Fraser (singer)


Alphabetical list:

AM: Angelo.M
AO: Andy Olivera
BP: Brad Porter
CDL: ChuckDeLa
CR: Chris_Richard
SB: Steeve Bergeron
VM: Vickie_M
ZB: Zen Butler

SBAdjani, Isabelle (actress)
SBAgutter, Jenny (actress)
ZBAli, Kelli (musician)
ZBAlice (literary character: Alice In Wonderland)
CDLAsthana, Shivika (musician)
CRAtwood, Margaret (writer)
AOBardot, Brigitte (actress)
ZBBeckinsale, Kate (actress)
SBBellucci, Monica (actress)
SBBergman, Ingrid (actress)
SBBinoche, Juliette (actress)
ZBBjork (musician)
AOBlanchard, Rachel (actress)
CDLBrooks, Gwendolyn (poet)
VMBush, Kate (musician)
AMCallas, Maria (opera singer)
CRCarson, Rachel (biologist)
AMChanel, Coco (designer)
ZBColeslaw, Enid (movie character: Ghost World)
AOConnelly, Jennifer (actress)
BPCraig, Jane (movie character: Broadcast News)
CRCrow, Sheryl (musician)
AODiaz, Cameron (actress)
CDLDuvall, Shelley (actress)
ZBEdwards, Skye (singer)
AOFarrell, Terry (actress)
CDLFossey, Dian (naturalist)
AMFranklin, Rosalind (scientist)
CDLFraser, Elizabeth (singer)
ZBGerrard, Lisa (musician)
ZBGordon, Kim (musician)
BPGraham, Heather (actress)
AMGraham, Martha (dancer/choreographer)
AOHannah, Daryl (actress)
ZBHarvey, P J (musician)
AMHeller, Jean (reporter)
AOHenstridge, Natasha (actress)
BPHepburn, Audrey (actress)
BPHepburn, Katharine (actress)
AMHoliday, Billie (singer)
AOJanssen, Famke (actress)
CRKarina, Anna (actress)
SBKelly, Grace (actress)
VMKidman, Nicole (actress)
AOKinski, Nastassja (actress)
CRLe Guin, Ursula K. (writer)
CRLeigh, Jennifer Jason (actress)
SBLeigh, Vivien (actress)
CRLennox,Anne (musician)
ZBLouise, Lynne (Zen's mother)
CRLoy, Myrna (actress)
BPLucid, Dr. Shannon (astronaut)
BPMann, Aimee (musician)
SBMarceau, Sophie (actress)
BPMarty (film character)
CRMerchant, Natalie (musician)
BPMiller, Lisa (television character: Newsradio)
ZBMinekawa, Takako (musician)
CRMirren, Helen (actress)
CDLMitchell, Joni (musician)
BPMitochondrial Eve (mother)
VMMontgomery, Elizabeth (actress)
VMMoore, Julianne (actress)
SBMoss, Carrie-Anne (actress)
CDLNomiya, Maki (singer with Pizzicato Five)
BPO'Connell, Maggie (television character: Northern Exposure)
AMOracle, The (movie character: The Matrix)
AMPankhurst, Emmeline (suffragette)
AMParker, Dorothy (writer)
AOPfeiffer, Michelle (actress)
SBPoulain, Amelie (movie character: Amelie)
BPRand,Ayn (writer)
VMRhodes, Happy (musician)
VMRide, Sally (astronaut)
BPRogers, Cathy (television producer)
AORyan, Jeri (actress)
VMSavitskaya, Svetlana (astronaut)
BPSherman-Palladino, Amy (television writer)
VMSiberry, Jane (musician)
AOSinger, Lori (actress)
AMSmith, Bessie (singer)
CDLSmith, Wendy (singer for Prefab Sprout)
BPStanwyck, Barbara (actress)
VMStrossen, Nadine (activist)
VMTereshkova, Valentina (astronaut)
VMTrinity (movie character: The Matrix)
CDLTucker, Maureen "Moe" (musician)
AOWatts, Naomi (actress)
SBWeisz, Rachel (actress)
VMWilliams, Victoria (musician)
CDLWillis, Connie (writer)
VMWomen of Rabbit-Proof Fence
AMWoolf, Virginia (writer)



====================



Here are my rules.

1. There will be 8 participants.

2. PRIORITY WAS GIVEN TO THOSE WHO DID NOT GET IN ON THE OTHER TWO DRAFTS, but only 4 non-participants signed up. I tried. Posted Image

3. We're going 30 Rounds.

4. We'll be working on the "12 hour" rule for the first 15 rounds. You must make your pick within 12 hours (or send me your pick if you're not going to be around), and if you haven't picked the next person in line can go. You can make your pick any time after that, but someone else might get one of your choices.

5. The last 15 rounds will be on the "6 hour" rule.

6. If you send me your pick and I'm not around (hey, I can't be here all the time), your pick is safe from the person who comes after you. IOW, you're going to be gone and you send me your pick of Betty Boop. The person right before you takes their turn. Then, you're gone, and I'm off seeing a 5-movie marathon or taking one of my beloved 16-hour sleeps (yes, I do occasionally). Your 12 hours goes by and the person after you chooses Betty Boop. I check in and see what happened. I'll say "no, sorry, soandso sent me his pick of Betty Boop, you'll have to choose again." Your pick is not protected from the person who comes before you, of course, no matter how far in advance you send me your pick. I don't imagine this would happen very often, but at least this rule will keep me from feeling guilty about not being around sometimes.

7. There probably will NOT be a vote at the end of it all. The fun will be in the choosing. What good is a vote between, say, Nicole Kidman and Eleanor Roosevelt? If I change my mind (unlikely, but possible), the thumbs down icon will be prohibited.

8. Women from all walks of life and all eras are welcome to be chosen. Living, dead, live, animated, real or fictional. If she's a wonderful woman in your eyes, feel free to choose her.

9. Pictures are encouraged, but if the person isn't a movie or pop star or other recognizable person, a short bio should be included with the name. At the very least, tell us what she does for a living, and how you came to know of her.

10. If you use pictures, go back every couple of rounds and replace the pictures of earlier picks with a link to the pictures. That way the tourney won't be cluttered and it will help those with dial-up connections.

11. I reserve the right to insert any other rules as I see fit.

These are human beings we're talking about, so even if you don't care for someone, words like "skank," "boobs" and other disrespectful terms will not be tolerated. Not that I could do much about it, but I could, at least, edit your name out of the participants list and ignore any posts you might make from then on. Sorry to be pre-judgemental, but some of the terms flung around in the other tourneys are appalling to me. Let's keep this one respectful, ok?
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#2 of 169 OFFLINE   Zen Butler

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Posted April 10 2003 - 11:44 AM

I like these rules. Can I play?

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#3 of 169 OFFLINE   Steeve Bergeron

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Posted April 10 2003 - 11:53 AM

I'll join only if you have trouble finding people. I'm already in the other one. Nice rules!

#4 of 169 OFFLINE   Brad Porter

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Posted April 10 2003 - 12:06 PM

The selection criteria can be anything we want? All of the others have revolved around physical appearance. To get a list of 30 I will definitely want to consider criteria other than looks. I'd hate to get ripped for picking an otherwise "wonderful woman" who isn't a pinup model.

8 people x 15 rounds x 12 hours + 8 people x 15 rounds x 6 hours = 2160 hours x (the obligatory 50% delay factor) = 3240 hours = 135 days = 19 weeks + 2 days = finish sometime in September.

OK, count me in.

Brad
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#5 of 169 OFFLINE   Angelo.M

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Posted April 10 2003 - 03:25 PM

Uh, yeah, OK. I'm in.

#6 of 169 OFFLINE   Andy Olivera

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Posted April 10 2003 - 08:19 PM

I'll play, though I was a very dissapointed participant of the all too short first draft...
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#7 of 169 OFFLINE   Vickie_M

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Posted April 11 2003 - 12:30 AM

Yep, Zen, you can most definitely play. Posted Image

Brad, yep to you too. I added this to the first post:

8. Women from all walks of life and all eras are welcome to be chosen. Living, dead, live, animated. If she's a wonderful woman in your eyes, feel free to choose her.

So far we have this lineup:

Participants list:

1. Vickie_M
2. Zen Butler
3. Brad Porter
4. Angelo.M



Waiting in the wings:
Steeve Bergeron
Andy Olivera

I'm still looking for people who didn't get in on the other two Drafts. We have until Sunday to firm up the lineup.


Quote:
8 people x 15 rounds x 12 hours + 8 people x 15 rounds x 6 hours = 2160 hours x (the obligatory 50% delay factor) = 3240 hours = 135 days = 19 weeks + 2 days = finish sometime in September.


Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image I'm not sure I needed to know that, but thank you anyway! Posted Image :P) Posted Image
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#8 of 169 OFFLINE   Vickie_M

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Posted April 11 2003 - 12:32 AM

Andy, what disappointed you about the first Dream Girls Draft? (that was short??)
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#9 of 169 OFFLINE   Zen Butler

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Posted April 11 2003 - 02:44 AM

and no voting? very cool. I like seeing others lists though.
With no voting, I expect to see and hear of some very special ladies. Posted Image

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#10 of 169 OFFLINE   Brad Porter

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Posted April 11 2003 - 02:45 AM

Quote:
Living, dead, live, animated.

So this includes fictional women? Or did you mean animated in the Elsa Lanchester Bride of Frankenstein sense? Posted Image

Brad
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#11 of 169 OFFLINE   Chris_Richard

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Posted April 11 2003 - 03:36 AM

You will probably fill up will people no in the other draft but I'll be backup #3.

#12 of 169 OFFLINE   Vickie_M

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Posted April 11 2003 - 07:42 AM

Quote:
With no voting, I expect to see and hear of some very special ladies.


I hope so too. People won't be scrambling to grab who they think will win them a vote. Not that people's picks in other Drafts aren't personal, but that does happen, we all know it.

Quote:
So this includes fictional women? Or did you mean animated in the Elsa Lanchester Bride of Frankenstein sense?


Wouldn't that be "re-animated?" Posted Image

Really, I'm so very easy you wouldn't believe it. I don't mind if someone picks a fictional character from a movie or book or play or whatever. Just give details as to why that pick is important and/or interesting to you ("you").
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#13 of 169 OFFLINE   ChuckDeLa

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Posted April 11 2003 - 08:02 AM

My problem with the "Dream Girls" draft is that I felt like I was the only one making choices based on something besides physical appearance. Seemed like (almost) everyone else was just picking "hot" women without any thought or discussion as to whether they were particularly interesting or talented. Hence my sometimes harsh words over some of their picks.

At one point someone even made a "joke" selection of Georgia O'Keefe for someone else... when O'Keefe was on my list of potential choices! Very depressing.

I'll be watching this thread with much greater interest.

#14 of 169 OFFLINE   Vickie_M

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Posted April 11 2003 - 08:14 AM

Quote:
I'll be watching this thread with much greater interest.


Do you want me to put you on the "Waiting in the wings" list?
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#15 of 169 OFFLINE   ChuckDeLa

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Posted April 11 2003 - 08:20 AM

Sure.

#16 of 169 OFFLINE   Brad Porter

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Posted April 11 2003 - 10:06 AM

Quote:
I don't mind if someone picks a fictional character from a movie or book or play or whatever.

This will change my list substantially. Why would I pick Nicole Kidman (who has an ex-husband and kids and is always on location somewhere) when I could pick Satine* (who other than dying of tuberculosis seems to be quite the catch Posted Image )? I will be more likely to choose idealized versions of women (having none of the flaws inherent with real life) than the actual women themselves.

Since we won't be voting it doesn't really matter if someone picks Nicole and someone else picks Satine - but wouldn't it therefore also not matter if two people picked Nicole? In other words, the value of the draft format is really only gained in the voting process. It shows who could compile the consensus best list in a competitive environment. If the point of this exercise is to obtain a list of people's 30 most wonderful women, then maybe it should be a list poll where anybody who wants to participate posts their list and people comment freely on them. I'm not sure what is gained by having people compete for selections but not having those selections compete against one another. No one will be able to compile their actual top 30 list because of the competition - so the final lists will only be partially revealing of the person's tastes. Just an observation.

As with all tournaments and drafts, the real value is in the conversations that are created. That's why I finally joined one of these drafts after months of observing. I plan to generate lots of content (not necessarily pictures) with each of my picks.

I will also not question or criticize the rules after this posting. I'm just doing it now because I've got too much time on my hands and there's very little else to be accomplished in this thread before Sunday. Posted Image

Brad

* I used this as an example because this will not be a pick that I would make but it might be appealing to others in the thread.
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#17 of 169 OFFLINE   Andy Olivera

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Posted April 11 2003 - 12:13 PM

what disappointed you about the first Dream Girls Draft?
Let's see: we have the people that dropped out; the bickering among the remaining people about how long it should go on, turns coming up too slowly, etc.; then Scott got sick of moderating the whole mess which pretty much sealed its fate. It was going so well for awhile that the sudden end was seriously disappointing. Just that sort of thing...Posted Image

BTW, if I get in you can expect at least the first 1/3 of my picks to be of the same variety as the previous draft, though I may start going beyond looks for the latter 2/3. To be honest, my list of "Dream Girls" isn't nearly long enough to fill thirty slots...Posted Image
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#18 of 169 OFFLINE   Vickie_M

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Posted April 13 2003 - 04:10 PM

Alright, here we go. This is starting later than I planned because I had to go out and just got home. Here's our final list of participants:

1. Vickie_M
2. Zen Butler
3. Brad Porter
4. Angelo.M
5. Steeve Bergeron
6. Andy Olivera
7. Chris_Richard
8. ChuckDeLa



Each of you might give me a rough idea of when you tend to be around your computers. Since this is starting later than I thought, I'm going to give Zen 24 hours, if needed. Brad can go after 12 hours, but Zen's pick is safe until this time tomorrow night (hopefully you won't be fighting over the same person).

Brad, have at it. As I said, I'm very easy. This is going to be a personal journey. I'm looking forward to your picks.


My first pick is the woman who changed my life. If I hadn't become a fan of hers, I never would have met my husband of 20 years, and would therefore probably be living in a different city, under radically different circumstances. Everything I have and just about everything I love is because of her. Oh, and her music is genius too.

Kate Bush

Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image


Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image

Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image

(Actually, I found out about Kate because I was a Peter Gabriel/Genesis fan, so it REALLY all starts with them)
Favorite film of 2008 (so far): The Fall

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#19 of 169 OFFLINE   ChuckDeLa

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Posted April 14 2003 - 02:20 AM

My first girlfriend worshipped Peter Gabriel. My current one worships Kate Bush. I like her, too. Posted Image

#20 of 169 OFFLINE   Zen Butler

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Posted April 14 2003 - 03:25 AM

(sorry long)

She grew up poor and raised by an alcholic father. His military background was brought home daily. She was forced to leave home at 17 and move in with a friend. Her friends father, who she trusted, raped and impregnated her. Afraid of what her friend's father would do, she hit the road, concealing her pregnancy. She met a man, stationed in 29 Palms, who was heading out for Vietnam soon. They soon married and off he went to Okinawa to await orders. To make ends meet, she went to work. During that hot summer, the babysitter entered the back room when she heard noises. As she entered a hot water heater blew up, shredding the front of her body and catching the house on fire. The house burned to the ground.
When her husband returned from Vietnam, they rapidly had 3 more children. She soon came to discover, that the man she married returned a much different person. Everyday had suddenly turned violent. Scissors, pancake paddles & belts were common weapons of choice. One day, he lost control, and threw her son through a closet door. That day, she had enough, and forced him to leave.
She then entered the work force, raising 4 children on her own. During these times, the children got to know the real woman that had been so suppressed.
Her level of compassion never stopped at humans. Rescuing a crow and nursing him to health, chasing a Great Dane down the middle of the street, that had just been hit by a car. Taking on 3 teeenagers, who thought it cool to beat a defenseless kitten in a bag. Yes soon, ALL stray animals found refuge at her house. Among this zoo of refugees, she would welcome many children in the neighborhood, when other parents found it annoying.
In 1989, she did something that would change the lives of many. She co-founded a bowling league on friday night that was to follow the noisiest bunch of marauders. This league would be specifically for gay males and females. Under much protest, this would come to be the largest bowling league in Orange County and occurred without violence and incident.
In 1996, she woke up one morning and couldn't feel her right leg. A clogged artery was found but too late to fix. The doctors had to remove her right leg. As the children went in to see her after her surgery. Her only statement to her children was Do you think I'm ugly now?. Her son stood in disbelief and in an instant reflecting back on her compassion, not only for her children, but for minorities, the gay community and on down to the smallest animal. He replied, You ugly? Mom never
Well news in 1997 got only worse. When she went in for a gall stone removal. A typical biopsy showed that she had some form of cancer. Upon further analysis, it had spread throughout her upper right quadrant. They gave her 3-6 months to live. She went on like it was nothing, refusing therapy and opting for trips to the beach. Her son, would pick her up on mondays, and they would go see movies. In March of 1999 (over 2 years since the doctors gave her 3-6 months) she lost her battle with cancer. With her 6 children (she had two more)around her she muttered the most comforting words her children had heard throughout their life, a quietly whispered I love you honey. She then took her last breath....
this woman was my mother Lynne Louise

who taught us compassion, tolerance, history and that all these come with and start with love. Despite some of her bad choices, she is a triumph in my eyes. This is a salute to all single mothers. I couldn't think of anyone who would deserve the #1 spot more.

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