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The "Buffy/Angel" All Spoiler/Speculation Thread

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#1 of 61 OFFLINE   Patrick Sun

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Posted February 20 2003 - 01:18 PM

Okay, I'm really tired of all the bickering in the Buffy and Angel threads, mainly due to spoilering, and some unlabelled speculating.

I know we had a close vote on this topic earlier, but with such a close vote (a majority of one vote, I think), I think it's better for both camps to have their own threads.

So here it is, the ALL SPOILER/SPECULATION thread for Buffy/Angel 2003 (combined since it seems the fates of both shows will be intertwined somewhat, and it'll be easier for one-stop spoilering).

Anyone reading this thread should realize that by reading any more of this thread, it may/will impact your viewing enjoyment of either shows for the rest of the season, so tread carefully, and don't got complaining if the rest of the season is ruined for you by reading ANYTHING posted in this thread.

You have been warned.

"Jee-sus, it's like Iwo Jima out there" - Roger Sterling on "Mad Men"
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#2 of 61 OFFLINE   Diana M

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Posted February 20 2003 - 02:59 PM

Since the coming episodes of Angel are going to have a God-like figure supposedly named Jasmine, I'm thinking that maybe the new character on Buffy (Caleb) will also be God-like, maybe the other 2 members of Glory's trio of Hell Gods I'm also happy that Gina Torres is going to be on Angel, it should be awesome Maybe Wash will play Caleb

#3 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted February 20 2003 - 03:12 PM

Buffy - 7x17 - Lies My Parents Told Me

-The teaser opens with a flashback, Spike and Nikki fighting in Central Park in 1977. MiniWood is watching, and who brings their kid to Central Park in the middle of the night, anyway? Call DCFS! There’s some Nikki/Spike banter, and he doesn’t want to end the dance yet. He compliments her coat. Ha ha! Don’t worry, Spike, they pop up randomly in high school basements all the time.

-Present day. Wood’s fighting vamps in an alley. Because, you know, they all know who he is, the notorious demon fighter and all! Spike turns up, saves his ass, tells Wood not to be afraid to use that stake. Wood mutters something about how he is waiting for his moment. Wow, I so did not see that coming. He squeezes the stake so hard his hand drips blood. So, I guess he’s red-handed? *veg*

-Wood and Buffy talk in the high school, talking about how things have been quiet since the seal was shut down. Yep, whenever there’s a problem, call Andrew to cry on it and fix it. Pot roast didn’t turn out? Add a little Andrew salt! Wood tells Buffy she reminds him of his mother when she’s patrolling. Umm…okay, Principal Creepy. Giles comes in, gets introduced to Wood. Blah, blah, blah. I’m calling Andrew to cry on this scene and make it more watchable. Giles explains that his trip is about Spike, that he has something that might disarm the trigger. Wood gets interested, but not interesting, sadly.

-Back at the ranch, the SiTs are disappointed that they aren’t a part of what is going on in the basement. Honeys, I’m disappointed that you get part of a scene. In the basement, Xander is shackling Spike to a wall. Wood is down there too, probably taking notes for his upcoming S/X slashfic. Giles holds up a stone, saying they need to put it in Spike’s brain to bring out his subconscious and disarm the trigger. Ermm…yeah. He’s giving Spike his rocks back! Hee! Get it? It’s a rock…oh, never mind. Willow chants, and the rock turns into a slimy thing. No, Wood isn’t being cloned, here. Spike complains, and so do I because it sounds pretty nasty. Buffy holds Spike’s hand here, guys!

-Intermission to do the dance of hand holding.

-Another flashback, to 1880 this time. WILLIAM MY LOVE! How I missed you in all of your yamminess. He’s reading his poetry to his tubercular mom…is he trying to hasten her along? Nope, guess not, she likes it. This is so sweet I’m about to cry pure sugar.

ANDREW: Hey! That’s my job! Stop it!

OK, more sweet conversation that makes Freud’s ashes get up and dance a jig. She sings the song that we know as Spike’s trigger song.

-Back in the basement, Spike freaks out, hits Buffy (who was still holding his hand, hee). Then he picks up his cot and throws it at Dawn, knocking her to the ground! Oh, thank you, God! Throw something else, Spike, anything within your reach!

Willow tends to Dawn upstairs and Anya says something bitchy about Spike, while downstairs Spike recovers from his little outburst. Giles asks him what he remembers. Don’t ask Spike that, Giles, he remembers that the Initiative gave him drugs, and clearly has mental continuity problems. Spike says he remembers the song his mom sang to him, but that is all. Giles starts grilling Spike, saying he’s not cooperating, and that the trigger still works. At some point around here Willow gets a call from Fred in L.A.
-Another 1880 flashback, this time with William and Dru doing naughty things on William’s family couch. Then William kinda ruins the mood by bringing his mom into it, saying what fun the three of them will have. He says Dru will like her, and I’m cracking up now. Freud’s Greek Urn is now bouncing up and down in sheer glee as William’s mom gets introduced to Dru, and he explains his new nature. I swear, after this hysterical scene, I want a Dru, William and Mom spinoff. Spike bites his mom. And then puts his eyes out. OK, he doesn’t put his eyes out, but somewhere in the Elysian Fields, Sophocles demands a royalty check, and in the Angelverse, Connor doesn’t feel like such a prat anymore.

-Spike comes out of his flashback, stuff happens, Wood calls Giles over to talk to him, explaining that he was raised by a pack of mannerless vultures that fed their victims dripping guts off of forks. I mean, no, explains he was raised by a watcher. Giles recognizes the name, and after some exchange realizes that Spike killed Nikki. Wood convinces Giles that something needs to be done about Spike, and persuades him to distract Buffy for a few hours. Whoa! Please tell me this is not the real Giles.

-Wood talks Spike into going to his house, while Giles takes Buffy out on a “training session”, and starts getting into lecture mode. Buffy is unimpressed, and accuses Giles of treating her like she’s 16. No, he treated you like more of an adult at 16, Buffy. He talks about moving on and how she has to be a general. Uh oh, is Petrie involved here? I swear that man wants to be slapped by Patton. Or Riley.

-Wood takes Spike into his garage, and locks the door behind him. Spike notices that he has a collection of death’s head moths and night vision goggles – I mean, crosses all over the walls, and starts to get a bit twitchy. Wood starts rattling on about the kind of person Spike is, and finally reveals that Spike killed his mother. He explains that he doesn’t want to kill Spike now that he’s changed, he wants to kill the monster that murdered his mother, and then hits a key on the computer, cuing the trigger song and causing Spike to vamp out. Wood gets all pleased with himself. I’m really creeping out, here. This guy is a fruit loop. So much for Wood not being Holtz, part 2.

-Back to 1880. Spike is looking for his mother. He hears the song playing from the darkness, and finds her, holding a music box. She’s not sickly anymore, of course. Spike is thrilled, and wonders what kind of things she’d like to do first. No, dammit, not those kinds of things, stuff like theater and killing. Mom says she wants to be rid of him, quotes his awful poetry, and makes disparaging remarks about it. God, my poor heart can’t take this. Oh, great, it gets worse, cut back to the present, where Assholtz is beating Spike with brass knuckles. Charming. No! Please, I need more pain! Back to 1880, where Spike’s mom is getting even crueler, telling him that she wished she’d have just dashed his brains out as a baby and spared herself a horrible life of boredom. More abuse from Assholtz. More abuse from mom. Back and forth and back and forth and I am soooo not typing out all the awfulness. It’s really, really painful.

-Okay, Buffy and Giles in the cemetery. Buffy goes to kill a vampire, and Giles stops her from delivering the death blow. Giles questions Buffy as to whether she’d let the vamp live to save the world, and Buffy gets flippant, making small talk with vampy. Then he asks if she’d let vampy kill him to do the same. At this point, I’m hoping this is a practical excersise, but it isn’t. Damn. After some thought, Buffy realizes that she would. Giles goes on about how they are all expendable in this war, and that nothing should interfere with their chances of winning. Then he brings up Spike…..

…who is still being beaten. Assholtz tears the duster off him, and Spike is in and out of flashback. Really, really nasty and incestuous remarks from mom, and whoa, some of this stuff is probably gonna get cut. William is thank god horrified and heartbroken, and she orders him to get out and attacks. They struggle for possession of her walking stick, it snaps in two. Spike says he’s sorry…

…cut back to Assholtz, who hesitates. Spike mutters again that he’s sorry…

…William stakes his mom, who momentarily reverts to her familiar, kindly expression before she explodes into dust….

…Spike manages to gain the upper hand on Wood. Comes to his senses. Explains that his mom was a Slayer, he’s a vampire, that’s how it works and she knew it. Really amazing stuff here from Spike, about the nature of Slayers, about his own mom, about love. He flips on the song, and it no longer affects him. Spike says he has his free will back, and that he wanted him to know that before he kills him. He bites into Wood....

Buffy and Giles in the cemetery. Giles tells Buffy that Spike is a liability, that Angel knew well enough to leave but Spike doesn’t. Giles receives honorary membership at the Ducks board. Buffy defends Spike, saying that she wants him there, and that it’s not his fault the First is manipulating him. Giles makes the point that Ben wasn’t responsible for what Glory did, and then admits that he killed Ben. Wow! Buffy slowly realizes what is going on here. Wow, not too quick on the uptake, are we? She runs off.
Spike emerges from Wood’s house, wearing his duster again. Buffy rushes to him, trying to make sure he’s okay, but he pushes her hands away. She asks what happened, and Spike opens the door to reveal Wood, messed up but still alive. Spike explains that he let him live because he killed Nikki, but if he so much as looks at him funny again, he’ll kill him. He walks away, and Buffy turns to Wood. Some talk about her mother, about Spike. She says that she needs him to win this war, and that if Wood tries anything again, Spike will kill him. But more importantly, she’ll let him. She says the mission is what matters, and walks away, leaving him there.

Buffy is taking care of Dawn, as Giles approaches. She gets up, moves to her room. Giles starts to explain again that this was for the greater good, and Buffy tells him that Wood failed. Giles says it doesn’t matter, she still needs to learn…

Buffy cuts him off, says she thinks he’s taught her everything she needs to know. And slams the door in his face.

End Show.

#4 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted February 22 2003 - 06:05 AM

Buffy - 7x18 - Dirty Girls

- Just outside of Sunnydale a SIT named Shannon is running from a group of Bringers. She waves down a truck and a man named Caleb in a priest outfit picks her up.
- Caleb calls Shannon a whore and dirty girl without a soul. He heats up his ring with the trucks cigarette lighter and burns a symbol on her while whispering a message he wants Shannon to tell the Slayer.
- Caleb throws Shannon out of his truck and she lands right in front of a car that stops just before running her over. Willow and Faith, who were traveling back to Sunnydale from LA, get out of the car and pick her up.
- Willow and Faith take Shannon to the hospital. Willow asks Faith to go find Buffy while she watches over the injuried SIT.
- Faith, while out searching for Buffy, spots a vampire fighting a girl. Faith runs and tackles the vampire. It's actually Spike. She punches him in the face several times while he is talking about being reformed and having a soul. Buffy shows up and pulls Faith off of Spike. The girl Spike was fighting was a vampire. Faith takes a stake from Buffy's belt and stakes the vamp.
- Giles is rude to Faith when she arrives. Spike tells her that the tension isn't all her fault since Giles tried to have him killed.
- In the vineyard cellar, Caleb talks with the Bringers about how he was looking for God in all the wrong places. Morphy/Buffy shows up and asks him if he thinks it's God. He says he's beyond that. Caleb then talks about how he organized the Bringers and destroyed the Watcher's Council HQ.
- Andrew describes to the SITs how Faith was once briefly good, and we get a fantasy shot of her fighting five ninjas. Then he explains how, like a lot of tragic heroes, she turned to the dark side. A shot of Faith with a red lightsaber and Darth Vader's breathing in the background. He says that not even the most peaceful and logical races were immune to her, and we get a fantasy shot of Faith fighting a Vulcan.
- Buffy goes to Sunnydale High to talk to Principal Wood. He is still feeling the effects of his encounter with Spike. Buffy tells him everything is fine between them as long as he leaves Spike alone. She says that she needs him. Wood then fires Buffy and tells her she should be focus on her real job.
- Faith goes down to Buffy's basement to have a smoke and Spike bums a smoke from her. They start talking about how much they have in common and flirt with each other. Buffy walks in on their conversation and seems a bit jealous.
- Shannon wakes up in the hospital. Buffy and Willow questions her and she tells them the message. Caleb has something of Buffy's.
- Buffy gives another speech to everyone in her living room.
- A girl named Betty, in a trance, arrives at the vineyard looking for Caleb. She tries to come on to him, says that the words called her and she wants to know why. He says it was because of the Power and then he guts her. The body morphs into the First in the form of Buffy. Caleb says he has missed the feeling of freeing souls.
- Buffy says the most experienced SITs should get ready to do battle with Caleb and Willow can stay behind and guard the newbie SITs. Giles objects saying they know little about Caleb or his motives. Buffy tells him to piss off.
- Buffy and Faith follow a Bringer to Caleb's HQ. Faith comments that it may be a trap. Buffy says she doesn't care. Buffy asks Faith about what happened with Angel. Faith tells Buffy how she was in Angel's mind. They go back to get the troops.
- Rona talks about how Buffy wants them to go into battle and that she doesn't care about any of the SITs. Xander gives an inspiring speech about Buffy, how she has saved the world a lot and how they should trust her.
- Buffy, Faith, Spike, Xander and the SITs go into battle with Caleb and the Bringers.
- Buffy faces Caleb and he punches her across the room knocking her out. Spike tries to fight him too and the same thing happens to him.
- Caleb backhands Kennedy and Rona tries to help her. Caleb snaps Rona's arm on his knee and a Bringer is about to take her out with a knife when Xander shoots him with a crossbow.
- Faith fights Caleb and she gets beaten badly. Xander finds Buffy and saves her from a Bringer.
- Caleb snaps a SIT's neck and then kills another SIT Molly with her own knife.
- As Xander is helping Kennedy up he is grabbed by Caleb. He says Xander sees what others don't and then he sticks his thumb in Xander's eye socket, crushing his eye.
- Just before Caleb completely blinds Xander, Spike saves him.
- They retreat, carrying out their wounded. Xander and many of the SITs have to be taken to the ER.
- Buffy, devastated by her defeat, walks alone in the night.
- At the end Caleb speaks with Morphy/Buffy about the return of Glory.

#5 of 61 OFFLINE   Patrick Sun

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Posted February 26 2003 - 02:17 AM

BTW, here's a link to a TV Guide article on SMG and her leaving the show after this season (I don't think anyone is surprised by this). But there is a spoiler in this article.
"Jee-sus, it's like Iwo Jima out there" - Roger Sterling on "Mad Men"
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#6 of 61 OFFLINE   Chad R

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Posted February 26 2003 - 04:43 AM

Since I'm not fond of 'Angel' could we possibly get the details involving Faith's stay over there to fill in the hole of her returning to Sunydale?

#7 of 61 OFFLINE   Donnie Eldridge

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Posted February 26 2003 - 07:46 AM

Here is another article regarding Buffy ending.


Master Poe: Close your eyes. What do you hear?
Caine: I hear the water. I hear the birds.
Master Poe: Do you hear your own heart beat.
Caine: No.
Master Poe: Do you hear the grasshopper, which is at your feet.Caine: Old man, how is it that you hear these things?Master Poe: Young man, how is it...

#8 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted February 26 2003 - 11:56 AM

Angel - 4x13 - Salvage

- The episode picks up with Angelus feeding off of Lilah. Gunn and Wes find him, but Lilah is already dead.
- Cordy has been hit in the leg with a crossbow arrow. Connor is removing it when Gunn and Wes tell them about Lilah. Cordy smiles and says "it's started".
- Lorne casts a spell on the Hotel to protect them from Angelus returning, despite protests from Connor who doesn't trust magic. Fred questions Cordy about the spell that was supposed to return Angel's soul.
- At a bar, Angelus dusts another vampire, Rosaria, with a pool cue. He then sits down and meets up with a demon, Bogh'dar. Angelus is looking for The Beast and thinks that Bohg'dar might know where he is. Bohg'dar is so impressed with meeting Angelus, that he asks for an autograph.
- As Angelus is threatening Bohg'dar, trying to get him to tell him where The Beast's hideout is, a vamp named Paco comes up and tell him that he's seen The Beast. Before leaving, Angelus bites the waitress.
- Connor insists that they make sure that Lilah doesn't rise. Wes volunteers to do it.
The next scene is in the hotel's basement, where Lilah's dead body is sort of gift wrapped in plastic in the place Angel was strapped to in episode 10. There's an ax by her feet. Wesley is standing there looking at Lilah's body. Wesley imagines an exchange with Lilah, telling her that she never loved him (or possibly Wes is talking to Lilah's ghost) The scene switches back and forth between Lilah being dead, and Lilah there talking to Wesley. As Lilah continues to taunt him, Wes decapitates her body.
- In the next scene Paco and another guy, Karl, take Angelus to some train tracks, where they saw The Beast before. Angelus seems to pick up The Beast's scent.
Connor wants to kill Angelus. The others argue with him, but Cordy then faints and Connor takes her upstairs. Wes knows that they need Angel to defeat the Beast. So he goes to see Faith.
- A couple of scenes later, Gunn and Lorne discuss Connor. It seems like Gunn asks how someone is doing (probably Cordy) and Lorne replies that she'll be fine after some rest. Gunn corrects him and asks about Connor. Lorne replies that he's focused on killing Angelus, even if they get Angel's soul back. Gunn questions who could stop Connor, aside from Angel, since they can't.
- Immediately the scene changes to a prison yard, where Faith's number from Judgement is called out. There's a note in the script about it being day there, since it's outside of the city. It might be that Los Angeles was plunged into eternal darkness by the Beast.
- A short time later, another inmate named Debbie attacks Faith with a dagger. A fight ensues in the prison yard, near some gym equipment. Debbie mentions she's doing this for the money. Faith nearly knocks Debbie out as the guards come in to break up the fight.
- The guard comments that they were taken by surprise since no one would be so nuts as to mess with Faith. The guard examines the dagger, which the script notes is familiar to viewers of another ME show. It's probably the Bringers' dagger. Nothing in the script hints that Faith recognizes it, but it could be the dagger Faith got from the Mayor.
- Angelus and several vamps go to a warehouse where Angelus picks up The Beast's scent. The Beast is there and tells Angelus that his master wants to see him. Angelus refuses to take orders from a lackey and refuses to fight the Beast until the Beast's master shows up. After Angelus leaves, Cordelia steps out of the shadows. She scolds the Beast for letting Angelus go and then kisses him.
- Wesley goes to the jail and visits Faith. He tells her about Angel disappearing and what's going on with Angelus. Faith breaks out of jail since she can't give up on him because he never gave up on her. Faith smashes the glass between her and Wes, grabs him, then jumps out of a window with Wes.
- The two drive back to Los Angelus and Wes gives Faith the lowdown. Wes questions if Faith is up to a fight and wants to test her, and they stop and have a run in with a group of vampires. One vampire manages to escape and knows that there's a Slayer in town.
- Faith and Wes meet up with the gang at the hotel. She's giving orders, telling them to arm themselves and that they the mission is to salvage Angel. Not kill him. They have a tranquilizer gun and she wants Gunn ready to shoot Angelus if she can't take him down. Connor argues, saying she can't just come in and start giving orders. He wants to kill Angelus. Cordy has told Connor that Faith is crazy. Faith yells back at him, telling him that if Angelus has to be killed, she's the one that's going to do it.
- Several vamps are chasing a young woman. Angelus arrives, as if to save her. Angelus bites the young woman. The vamp that escaped the fight with Faith is one of the other vamps there and they start talking about The Slayer being in town. Angelus is distracted and the young woman escapes. He goes and calls the Summers' house. He finds out that Buffy is still in Sunnydale and realizes that the slayer is Faith.
- Wes, Faith, Gunn and Connor go out hunting for Angelus. They have a run-in with some vamps. Connor starts acting up, and Faith tells him to go home. When he refuses, she pins him to the ground. Connor relents, and Gunn takes him back to the hotel.
- Wes and Faith go on, and find the warehouse. Angelus has set a trap for Faith and leads her into an ambush. The Beast is waiting for her and pummels her. Outside, Wes fights two vampires. Faith is badly beaten and bloodied. She can't move. Before The Beast can kill her, Angelus stabs The Beast in the back with a special knife that kills him. With the Beast dead, the sun returns. Angelus goes to kill Faith. She swings a large hook, that smashes through a window, allowing light inside. Angelus can't get near her. Outside, the two vamps that Wes was fighting burn up as the sun returns.
- Back that the hotel, the others react to the sun rising. They think that Faith must have killed The Beast. Connor is even more impressed with her. Cordy scoffs at Angel and Connor's admiration for slayers, and reveals to Connor she's pregnant with his child.

Angel - 4x14 - Release

- Faith is rescued by Wes from Angelus. She's badly beaten, bloodied and bruised. Wes takes her to his apartment. As she gets cleaned up in the bathroom, she's filled with rage. She screams and punches a hole in the tile wall.
- Angelus brags to his vamp lackeys about what's just happened with Faith and the Beast at a demon bar. A Frotor Demon overhears what he was saying, and approaches them. He's all pissed off at Angelus for killing the Beast, thus returning the sun. Angelus attempts to strangle the demon. The demon tries to apologize, and Angelus only stops from killing him when he hears a disembodied, creepy voice that no one else can hear.
- The voice is of the Master (this is not The Master from Buffy, but the Beast's Master.) He tells Angelus that they must talk. Angelus tries to figure out where the voice is coming from. The voice is angry with Angelus for killing the Beast. He tells Angelus that the Beast was his. Angelus replies that he killed the Beast to get the Master's attention. Everyone's starring at Angelus, since he's talking to himself, so he goes off to another area of the bar.
- Angelus heads into a back room of the demon bar, where a bunch of vamps are doing drugs. Angelus wants to meet the Beast's master face to face. Then they cut to Cordelia (with white eyes) in the hotel replying that they'll meet when they're ready. Cordy is holding a glowing red crystal that she's using to talk to Angelus. Angelus asks the Beast's master why it did all of this just to get the Fang Gang to unleash Angelus. Cordelia tells him she has plans for him. But Angelus is willing to do what the voice tells him to do. He leaves, telling the voice it can kiss his butt.
- Cordelia is interrupted in her room by Connor, who's bringing her another blanket. She returns to normal and hides the crystal. Connor is concerned that Cordy isn't well. She tells him she's still tired from being hit by a crossbow by Angelus, but really communicating with Angelus drained her. Cordy puts her hand on her stomach. They talk about the baby. Later in the scene, Cordy says to Connor that something is the baby's way of saying hello. (Maybe the baby is kicking or something like that, it isn't clear. ) Cory tells Connor he has to keep her pregnancy a secret.
- Cordy wants to make sure the baby is kept safe. She says that it's special. She also reveals to Connor that she's a demon, but Connor has no idea that's she's the Beast's Master.
- Fred, Gunn and Lorne discuss the situation downstairs at the hotel, wondering if Faith should have banned Connor from the fight with Angelus and if Faith is up to the fight alone. At Wes' apartment, Faith tells Wes that she's in this to the finish.
- Angelus shows up at the hotel, trying to find info on the Beast's Master, flashing an amulet he claims gives him immunity to the anti demon violence spell Lorne cast on the hotel. Fred realizes it's fake, hits him in the head, then tries to shoot him with the tranq gun, but hits Lorne instead. Angelus makes off with Lilah's book. Connor comes in, but the spell affects him, not Angelus, and he's unable to stop Angelus. Wes & Faith come in as Angelus is escaping. Angelus grabs Wes as a human shield as both Gunn & Faith try to hit him with tranq guns. Angelus manages to escape. Wes then prepares to go after Angelus, telling the others they have to be a vicious as Angelus is.
- Angelus returns to the demon bar's back, drug room and tries to contact the voice again. But he doesn't get a response.
- Cordelia and Connor discuss the situation in Cordy's room at the hotel. Connor tells her about Angelus' visit. She asks about the anti-demon violence spell, and Connor tells her that it worked on him instead of Angelus.
- Angelus goes to an occult bookshop that has some of Lilah's books and W&H papers to do some research on the Beast's master. He complains about not being able to find anything as he tortures the shop's owner for information. The voice of the Beast's master shows up again. It tells Angelus that it sees everything and it's not happy with him seeking it out. The voice says to Angelus that they should be friends, but Angelus refuses. The voice shows Angelus the jar with Angel's soul, but it's an illusion. The voice threatens to return Angel's soul and bury Angelus deep inside Angel. Angelus then asks what the voice wants him to do and calls it master.
The scene then switches back to the hotel, with Cordy holding the jar with Angel's soul.
- Wes and Faith head out to look for Angelus, searching demon bars and other places he might be. Their search eventually leads them to the demon bar shown earlier in the episode. Faith is armed with a tranquilizer gun and Wes has a shotgun.
- Faith interrogates the Frotor Demon, smashing his head against a table, trying to get him to tell them about Angelus. Faith and Wes are attacked by another demon. Wes blows that demon's head off with his shotgun. The Frotor demon then finally spills the beans about Angelus, tells them about the earlier part and they go back to that other section of the bar. As they enter the back room, they're attacked by drugged out vamps.
- Back at Cordy's room, there's a scene with Connor worried about the anti-demon spell placed on the hotel affecting him and about being a father. Cordy takes Connor's hands and places on her stomach and reassures him
- Back at the demon bar, Faith and Wes kicks the druggie-vamps' butt and rescue a drugged, non-vamped girl. Faith interrogates her about Angelus. The girl says she doesn't know anything and Faith believes her. Suddenly, Wes pulls out a dagger and stabs the girl in the shoulder with it, pinning her to the wall. He tortures her until she gives them information about Angelus. She heard about plans being made about the rain of fire and a soul. Wes realizes that whatever is controlling the Beast is talking to Angelus.
- Wes finally pulls the dagger out and Faith helps the girl. Faith asks Wes if he's lost it. As they leave, Faith continues to argue with Wes over what he did to the girl. Wes tells her he did what she wasn't able to do. Wes calls Faith a rabid dog and reminds her of what she did to him. Faith slams him up against a wall, but Wes was only trying to get her angry enough to face off against Angelus.
- Lorne wakes up, after being hit by the tranq dart, He recognizes the fake amulet that Angelus had at the hotel and knows where they're sold. Wes & Faith go to the shop and find Angelus waiting for them.
- Trying to shoot Angelus doesn't work. A huge fight ensues. Wes is tossed down a stairwell. Angelus torments Faith, questioning her if she still wants to die. He aims a rifle at her head and pulls the trigger, but its out of bullets. They continue to fight. Faith stabs Angelus in the chest with a knife. Angelus tells her that it wouldn't make any difference if he did beat her to death, and calls her an animal and a murderer. He continues tormenting her, telling her she enjoys killing things - like he does. Faith fights back and ferociously attacks him. It looks like Faith has him beat, but she backs off instead of dusting him, arguing that she's not like him. But it was all and act and Angelus wasn't hurt. He pins her down, tells her she will be just like him and begins to bite her. The episode ends.

Angel - 4x15 - Orpheus

- The episode picks up where episode 14 leaves off. Angelus is feeding off of Faith. Both Faith and Angelus pass out. Faith had injected herself with a massive dose of the hallucinogenic drug that the vamps & the girl at the demon bar in the previous episode were using. Angelus is knocked unconscious and captured. Faith is left in a coma, near death.
- Both Faith and Angelus are back at the hotel. Angelus is caged, and is being watched on the monitored by Gunn. Faith is in Angel's room.
- Meanwhile, Angelus and Faith are journeying back through Angel's past and observing events in his life. It's things he's done wrong as Angel. One of their first stops is a dock in 1902. Then they're taken to a 1924 Chicago alley, outside of a club. It's a wet and cold fall night. Angelus looks around, trying to figure out why they are there and what happened. He sees Angel sitting on a bench outside the club. It slowly dawns on him what happens next. He tries to leave, completely panicked. A car comes speeding down the street, heading straight towards Angel. Faith shouts to Angel to get out of the way as Angelus yells that he can't do it again. Then, Angel darts across the street, narrowly missing the car. They see in his arms is a fuzzy little puppy. Angelus is embarrassed to death. The dog's owner, a flapper, comes running out of the club and thanks Angel. Angel is tempted to bite her, and the flapper is flirting with him, expecting a kiss. Instead, Angel tells her to get lost. Faith jokes that they must be in hell, since they're reliving Angel's good deeds. She laughs.
- The scene switches to Faith looking "dead" in Angel's hotel room. Lorne is near by, on "deathwatch".
- Wes, Gunn, Connor and Fred gather in the lobby to discuss the situation. Wes says that there's only one thing they can do for Faith now...
- Later on (about half way through the episode), Faith and Angelus are seated at a booth at a restaurant. Angelus is telling Faith what it's like for him to be inside Angel. Faith tells him it's Angel that deserves to be on the outside. Angel smiles and tells her it's not that simple, if (or when) Angel gets his soul back. Angelus suddenly is seated next to Faith, and he tells her that he's always inside Angel.
- The scene quickly changes to another event from Angel's past- a hold up at the restaurant. Angel stands by a jukebox as a gunman demands cash from the cashier. Before Angel can do anything, the gunman shoots the cashier. Angel starts to go after the gunman, but stops and goes to help the badly injured cashier, briefly vamping out due to the blood. It's obvious the cashier is dying. Angel tries to comfort him. Angelus mocks him as he watches.
- There's another flashback scene with Angel from the 70's.
- The gang decides to get Willow to help with the situation with Angel's missing soul. Fred calls Willow and asks her to return Angel's soul. She does a spell to break Angel's soul free from the jar. Cordy tries to stop her and keep Angel's soul for herself, but Willow's spell works. Willow goes to see Cordy (who's in bed in her room). Cordy has a knife hidden in her bed and tries to stab Willow, but can't. She throws the knife at the door after Willow leaves.
- Faith knows she's dying. She's still unconscious, but she's crying. Lorne is still there with her. He begins to cry, realizing that she's close to crossing over. Faith is letting go of everything that means something to her.
- In Faith's dream, Angel is now able to make contact with Angelus & Faith. He helps Faith fight Angelus. Faith tells Angel she's dying, and he tells her, "Yeah, easier than redemption, huh?" They continue to battle Angelus.
- Meanwhile, Cordelia tells Connor he has to kill Angelus to save their family.
- In the dream, Angel urges Faith to get up, but she's weak. She dying. She says her time is done. Angel tells her, "Our time is never up... we pay for everything." But Angel needs her to fight and help him against Angelus.
- Faith wakes up. She finds Connor in the basement, about to stake the chained Angelus. They fight. Meanwhile, Willow does a spell to restore Angel's soul. As Connor and Faith are fighting, the spell works and Angel is back.
- Angel asks Faith how she feels, and she replies, "Like I did mushrooms and got eaten by a bear." Faith heads off with Willow to Sunnydale.
- At the end of the episode, Cordelia comes down the stairs. She's visibly pregnant. She tells them that the worst isn't behind them.

Angel - 4x16 - Players

- The first act begins with Gwen Raiden meeting with a guy named Garrett at a downtown plaza at night. He nervously gives her an envelope filled with security info and blueprints of something. Garrett warns her she's going up against very powerful people. Gwen replies that she knows the risks and she isn't coming out without someone called Lisa. Suddenly Gwen is hit by lightning. Garrett runs off horrified. Gwen gets up uninjured.
- In the next scene, Gunn, Lorne, Wes, Fred & Cordy are all gathered in the hotel lobby. Gunn is pacing and giving them "the facts" about Cordelia's pregnancy- talking about how the child of two vampires "knocks it out" with a part demon, former higher-being and it results very quickly into a huge bun in Cordy's "oven".
- Gwen convinces Gunn to help her rescue a little girl named Lisa.
- The 2nd act begins with Gunn & Gwen surrounded by guards after attempting to make their way into a mansion where a ritzy party is being held, trying to pretend they were invited guests. But Gwen isn't leaving without Lisa. Gunn gets them out of the situation by pretending to know Mr. Morimoto, who he recognizes from Gwen's intel photos as a person involved in the situation. Gunn gives him a carved jade tiger as a gift to distract him.
- Next, Wes and Fred are pouring over books in the office, trying to figure out what Cordy might be pregnant with and any sort of mystical or demon causes of her pregnancy. They pondering if it could be a spikey-headed, infant Garbat demon, but dismiss the idea.
A little later on, Angel is talking to Cordelia, trying to work out what the Beast's Master is up to. It seems he's unaware of Cordelia's connection to the Beast. Angel questions why The Master would have taken all those risks. Cordelia replies (with the stage direction: leading) that the Master didn't have any other minions. Angel figures out that the Master might have. That it might have been inside other people's heads like it was Angelus'. Cordelia is impressed and tells him it's possible. Angel says they need a plan and more information. Angel comments that the Master is two steps ahead of them, and Cordy smiles.
- Back at the party, Gunn is mingling, listening to some other people discuss all the weirdness that had happened lately in LA. Gwen comes up to him, saying she's learned the situation is worse than they thought. That they're going to kill her tonight. But Gunn isn't going to let that happen. He goes off with Gwen.
- A few scenes later, Gunn has rescued "Lisa" but the situation is different from what Gunn was lead to believe. "Lisa" turns out to be the young daughter of Mr. Morimoto, who tells them that her dad is going to kill them when he finds out they tried to hurt her. Gunn figures out he's been used.
- Gunn finds Gwen trying to crack a safe in Mr. Morimoto's office. He's figured it out. She wanted him there rather than Angel because of the security scans. Gwen didn't want to rescue anyone. She was there to steal something.
- Later on, Cordelia asks Lorne when he can read her. Lorne replies he can do it in the morning. Cordelia forces a smile.
- Next, Gwen and Gunn are trying to make their way out of the mansion, slipping through the kitchen. But they're stopped by armed guards and Mr. Morimoto, who wants "the device" back. Gunn rats Gwen out, telling them he thought L.I.S.A. was a little girl.

#9 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted March 01 2003 - 06:24 AM

Angel - 4x15 - Orpheus









#10 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted March 05 2003 - 02:49 AM

Nathan Fillion will be playing the fallen preacher mass murder Caleb in the final 5 episodes of Buffy. Nathan played Malcom Reynolds, captain of Serenity, in Joss Whedon's Firefly. I think he is absolutely perfect for the role of Caleb. What do you think?

#11 of 61 OFFLINE   LarryDavenport



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Posted March 05 2003 - 06:32 AM

Maybe the whole cast of Firefly will make it to the Buffy/Angelverse before it's shut down at the end of the season (I hope next year won't be Whedon-free television).

#12 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted March 07 2003 - 01:25 PM

Episode 19 - Empty Spaces

Opens with Buffy wandering around Sunnydale and running into Clem, who is fleeing town in a new car. They have small talk banter, with Clem acknowledging that the situation is bad, getting worse, and she should get out of town. Of course, Buffy is staying, but Clem drives off.....
It is confirmed that Xander has lost an eye (very sad, he is being brave and making pirate jokes but it is obvious how torn up everyone is). Giles is in this episode. Everyone in heavy research mode -- Anya has chatted up her remaining demon buddies and has found out that the ubervamps can be staked (although their skin is extra tough) but holy water does nothing. SITs bitter and scared of Caleb

Buffy is taking the whole thing with Xander, and her feelings of failure from not protecting him and the SITs in the last episode very much to heart. Dawn, Willow and Buffy decide to research Caleb -- see if they can find any info about him in police records and files via the internet. While this is going on Buffy goes back to the school (which is now closed) to get her things; while cleaning out her desk she sees a photo of her, Willow and Xander together. She breaks down crying and when she looks up -- Caleb is there.

Spike and Andrew go off to the mission (very funny -- they bond over their mutual love of the flowering onion thing) -- while there they find the one survivor of the monks (?) who lived there. Like the girl that Caleb attacked last episode, he has a scar from Caleb's ring
He tells them that they took in a stranger (I assume Caleb) who found some sort of seal in the basement that they didn't know was there; they check out the seal and Andrew reads it. Basically it says that "it" is for her alone.

Buffy has gone back to the house; while she was unconscious Faith decided to take the depressed SITs dancing at the Bronze. Giles tells her that Spike is off on a mission, which she is not happy about -- and then she goes off in search of the SITs.

Faith and the SITs are having a great time at the Bronze, when a bunch of police arrive to haul off Faith. It appears that SOMETHING is going on with the Police, as they have ducttaped over their badges and are essentially acting as a hit squad. They haul Faith outside and basically try to kill her -- the SITs try to help and then Buffy shows up. However, I don't think Buffy gets that the police are possessed; instead, she gives Faith a big lecture about keeping the SITs safe and so on. Faith says -- why weren't you concerned about keeping them safe when you took them to the wine cellar? Buffy hits her -- Faith just takes it.

Everyone goes home (I am not doing this quite in time -- sorry -- in this part Andrew and Spike are still at the mission) and has a big welcome for Xander when he arrives back from the hospital. Everyone is glad to see everyone and then Buffy comes down and says she has been thinking about why the First isn't down protecting the seal in the basement of the school. She says that she has figured out that they are at the vinyard because there is something there that has to be protected -- so they should all go now to investigate.

EVERYONE says no. Giles says she isn't thinking clearly; Dawn says no, Rona says she is being reckless, Faith says she doesn't want to face that kind of danger again on a hunch of Buffy's, Willow tells everyone to lay off Buffy since she is under a lot of stress -- but no one backs her plan.

One of my posts got lost -- basically, after Caleb knocks Buffy out, he goes back to the vinyard and Buffy/The First asks him how it went. Caleb says everything is ready, and they cackle evilly. Sort of. They say that now she will go back to the SITs and all they have to do is give her one more little push.

Okay, so everyone tells Buffy they aren't going with her. She and Giles start bickering -- he says she can't just do everything alone -- people get hurt -- like Jenny. She brings up what he did to Spike, and Ben. Xander says he isn't going either -- he has sacrificed enough. Buffy says she is in charge because she is the SLAYER. Someone says - well, isn't Faith a Slayer too??

Faith is all like -- hold on -- no -- I don't want to lead anyone. Everyone decides they will follow Faith and not Buffy; Buffy is shocked -- she can't just sit back and watch everything go to hell and she doesn't think Faith can handle it. Dawn tells Buffy to leave the house if she can't go along, cause Faith is now in charge. Buffy looks around for support, but no one backs down. Buffy leaves the house.

Misc Answers:
1) Written by Drew Greenberg.
2) Dawn even KISSES Buffy before she kicks her out. HELLO I too hope Spike kicks their collective ass.
3) Spike is NOT in the group when they turn on Buffy. Anya really yells at her -- saying she is the slayer only by accident and has never had to work for anything.

No Buffy-Spike interaction at all.
Last scene is Buffy being kicked out and all alone.
Not sure what Buffy found out that led her to decide to go to the vinyard then -- it sort of comes out of nowhere.
In the beginning, Buffy and Willow go to the hospital to see Xander -- that is when he is making pirate jokes. Buffy is being very matter of fact but caring about him -- going over what pills they will give him and when he can get released. She then leaves to go research more on Caleb -- Willow kind of wants her to stay, asking if they can play card games, but Buffy is all we have to find out what we can now. Xander and Willow sit alone and joke and then both sort of tear up -- they just sit almost crying.

More tidbits: When Caleb and Buffy fight, he asks how Xander is doing -- and then he offers to take the other eye. Buffy goes dead serious and tells him that if he ever comes near Xander again she will destroy him. Caleb torments her with more of his misogynistic evilness ... then they fight and he knocks her out.

Wood is in the episode. On the evening that Xander returns from the hospital, Faith is waiting outside for him and Wood comes up. They have a whole scene together, and then he is inside and agrees with everyone that Buffy is too stressed to make any decisions.



#13 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted March 14 2003 - 11:59 AM

Buffy - 7x18 - Dirty Girls







#14 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted March 18 2003 - 04:41 AM

The WB: Wednesday, Apr. 2 - "Inside Out" TV-14, L, V

SEARCHING FOR THE TRUTH – Desperate to find out why Cordelia (Charisma Carpenter) has turned to the dark side, Angel (David Boreanaz) goes to demon Skip (guest star David Denman) for answers. Forcing the truth out of him, Angel learns that all that’s transpired, Connor’s (Vincent Kartheiser) birth, Cordelia’s ascension to the higher plane, Angel turning into Angelus and Cordelia’s pregnancy, were all a part of a higher being’s plan to create something even more powerful than itself. Guest star Julie Benz returns as “Darla” and Alexis Denisof, J. August Richards, Amy Acker and Andy Hallett also star. The episode was written & directed by Steven S. DeKnight"

Surprises Coming For Angel

David Boreanaz, star of The WB's Angel, told SCI FI Wire to expect a Firefly guest star and a few surprises as the season winds up. Gina Torres, who played Zoe on Fox's defunct SF western Firefly, will appear in upcoming episodes, Boreanaz said in an interview.

"She's coming over for a big arc, and she's going to end it with us, so that's really exciting," Boreanaz said. "Her character will be very pivotal to the changes that are going to happen inside of all of our characters." Torres is the second Firefly star to guest star in one of Firefly creator Joss Whedon's other series; Nathan Fillion will appear in Angel's sister series, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, in coming weeks.

Boreanaz added to expect the Angel gang once again to be uprooted. "Our living conditions, everything's going to change," he said cryptically. "I think we will probably be finding somewhere else to motivate ourselves." The original Angel Investigations apartment building was blown up in an earlier series finale. Angel airs Wednesdays at 9 p.m. ET/PT.



#15 of 61 OFFLINE   Matt Naglieri

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Posted March 18 2003 - 10:02 AM

Joss Whedon has said that should angel return for a fifth season It would be completely a completely different show and would include several "buffy" characters if another spinoff doesn't happen. I have a feeling that with most of the angel cast appearing on buffy's series finale that they will end up staying in sunnydale.

#16 of 61 OFFLINE   Barry Woodward

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Posted March 19 2003 - 08:17 AM

Buffy - 7x21 - End of Days

I have episode 21 information that will undoubtedly be volatile among Buffy fans, particularly the shipper communities. Please keep in mind that we do not have information on episode 20 yet, other than what we can surmise from the episode 21 information. Also, this information is subject to change.

Episode 21 begins in a sewer with a bomb about to go off as Faith and several Potentials, including Kennedy, are nearby. The bomb goes off as everyone dives for cover. Elsewhere, Buffy easily removes a Scythe from a rock as Caleb watches. He wants her to give it to him, but she won't. The First appears in Buffy's form to Caleb and tells him to let Buffy go; they'll get the Scythe later when her back is turned. Willow, Xander, Anya and Dawn return to the Summers home having failed to find Buffy. At the site of the bomb blast, Faith is unconscious and various other Potentials are dead and injured. The Potentials (carrying Faith) flee two Ubervamps coming after them. The Ubervamps have the Potentials cornered when Buffy arrives and dispatches them with the Scythe. The Potentials are in awe of Buffy.

Everyone, including Buffy, returns to the Summers home. We learn that the bomb in the sewer was a trap. Buffy starts to take charge again. Later, she asks Xander to do something for her. Xander doesn't seem happy about it because he wanted to be with her at the end. Buffy says she is counting on him. Willow and Giles are trying to do research on the Scythe. Giles wants Willow to draw power from the Scythe, but Willow is afraid of losing control again. Xander is in the car with Dawn and they talk. Suddenly, he puts a handkerchief over her mouth--he's drugged her so she's unconscious. The First and Caleb merge so that Caleb can be strong again.

Faith and Buffy talk about the scythe and how to be a Slayer is to be alone because they can't share the burden. As Buffy goes downstairs, she runs into Spike coming in the front door. She is unsure how to act because of the night before. She shows him the Scythe. Spike says it's the kind of thing a girl ditches a guy for. Buffy apologizes. Spike says it's ok, "last night was ... just a little cold comfort from the cellar dweller--let's don't make a thing of it." Buffy says fine, she has work to do. As they walk away from each other, Buffy turns back and tells him he's a dope. She tells him that "the reason I'm holding [the Scythe] is 'cause of you. Because of last night, the strength you gave me." She doesn't know how he feels about last night but ... Spike says he is terrified. He tells her it was the "best night of [his] life":

"I've lived for sodding ever, Buffy. I've done everything--I've done things with you I can't SPELL, but I've never...been close. To anyone, least of all you...Until last night. All I did was hold you, and watch you sleep, and it was the best night of my life. So I'm, yeah. Terrified."

She says he doesn't have to be terrified. He asks if she was there with him, and she says she was. When he asks her what it means, she wonders if it has to mean something. That breaks the feeling of closeness between them, and he withdraws a bit. She says "Maybe, when --," but he wants to just leave it. He says they'll go be heroes, then leaves as she watches him go.

Andrew and Anya have gone to the hospital to get supplies, and they talk about whether they will survive. Buffy goes to a cemetery and finds a tomb in which she finds an older woman, dressed in white. She's been waiting for someone to get the Scythe, which was made secretly without the knowledge of the Shadow Men. She tells Buffy to use the Scythe wisely to fight evil. Caleb shows up and snaps the woman's neck.

Xander gives Dawn a letter from Buffy, telling her that Buffy wanted to send her away to protect her. Dawn uses a stun gun on Xander and turns the car back around to Sunnydale. Buffy fights Caleb, and Angel shows up to help. "Heard maybe you needed a hand," he says. Buffy fights Caleb some more. After, Angel asks her to tell him she's glad to see him. She hugs him, then they kiss, tenderly at first, then a real kiss. As they kiss, we see that Spike is watching, the First-as-Buffy next to him. The First says judgmentally , "That bitch," and the last shot of the episode is Spike's pained face.

#17 of 61 OFFLINE   Doug R

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Posted March 20 2003 - 04:56 AM

Man.. if these are true then even in its second to last episode, Buffy seems to be going nowhere. Only 1 episode left and we have to sit through Spike jealousy... ?? ugh.

#18 of 61 OFFLINE   Chris S

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Posted March 20 2003 - 02:31 PM

I totally agree. This whole season (and most of the last) has just been a big waste. I was a huge fan up until the move to UPN. Recently I've pretty much quit watching because they have been so bad. The story just never seems to go anywhere. How many times do we have to sit through the whole Buffy/Spike relationship. Ugh...... Chris S.
DVD & Blu-ray - It's all about the movies!

#19 of 61 OFFLINE   Matt Naglieri

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Posted March 24 2003 - 07:42 AM

From Zap2it

More Spoilers from Shiny Happy People

Wednesday, Apr 9 - The Woman A.K.A. Jasmine (guest star Gina Torres), who was born to Cordelia (Charisma Carpenter), has the amazing ability to turn everyone she meets, including Angel (David Boreanaz) and the gang, into loyal disciples dedicated to carrying out her every command. Only Fred (Amy Acker) is able to see that Jasmine’s radiant beauty hides a sinister and powerful secret the others refuse to believe. Alexis Denisof, J. August Richards, Vincent Kartheiser and Andy Hallett also star. The episode was directed by Marita Grabiak and written by Elizabeth Craft & Sarah Fain

#20 of 61 OFFLINE   Matt Naglieri

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Posted March 24 2003 - 07:42 AM

double post

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