Wonderful Days...a Korean anime masterpiece? (1 Viewer)

[Seth Paxton]

And just because something becomes a genre open to all doesn't mean that film historians will fail to recognize and respect the origin, nor will those that choose to work within that genre.

In fact I think it is more impressive to think that this group of artists at a certain time and place have created a new genre. It's not like we have 1000 genres out there. Maybe sub-genres if you really nitpick it to a ridiculous amount, but not true genres. Anime is one of the few clearly unique film genres.

Of recent genres the only other movements that come to mind are Dogme and cyberpunk (which anime seems inherently intertwined with but which are definately seperate as Blade Runner, Johnny M., and Matrix show us).

Not sure when wire-fu (Wuxia) started as a genre. Slashers are 25 years old as a genre.

Maybe there are others I forgot.

 

[Morgan Jolley]

Technically, anime is what is made by a Japanese studio.

But I think this movie (Beautiful Days) would count as anime because of the style used.

 

[Dennis Pagoulatos]

It's also interesting to note that anime was originally influenced early on by the work of American and European horror/ sci-fi films, American animation (Disney), combined with Japanese mythology and legends. And now, decades later, we look at U.S. films like the Matrix, and they are clearly influenced by anime such as "Ghost in the Shell" and even "Armitage", so the whole process is circular. Look at American television with all of the recent TV series of "empowered" female superhero characters; not the prissy sexed up "Wonder Woman" of 70's television, but cyberpunk wannabe shows like "Dark Angel" and recently, "Birds of Prey" & "Alias". The influence of anime is clear in all of these shows. I remember a quote from James Cameron on the Ghost in the Shell LD a few years back where he called it "the first fully realized work of speculative fiction..." or something like that. He was obviously impressed with it, and it's no surprise that he executive produced a show like "Dark Angel" 4 years later!

Graphic Novels/ comics/ anime/ Kung-fu/ seem to be defining the visual language for 21st century film. I only see their influence increasing as time goes on; Beautiful Days trailer, for example, has images of such beauty that I wouldn't be surprised if we see exact images like that in future American films/ television shows. (Characters pointing guns at each other in front of a stained glass mural- awesome!)

I'm still waiting for the day when films like "Wonderful Days", "Spirited Away", etc. will be embraced by the larger U.S. population. In the case of "Spirited Away" as with "Princess Mononoke" before it, Disney is obviously afraid to give a true wide release or advertising budget to these gems. Why? Because they'd be mighty embarrassed if "Spirited Away" made more money in the U.S. than "Treasure Planet", which would have happened, if they'd marketed it even half as strongly as TP. I don't know what the story is with "Beautiful Days", but I hope it manages to pick up a U.S. distributor with some balls/ vision. If it's as good as it looks, it deserves to be recognized. Let's see what happens...

-Dennis

////Edit Added////
Here's the plot synopsis (in Broken English that I've tried to fix/ improve) from the Beautiful Days website:

"In the future, after human civilization as we know it ends in global war that darkens the skies with pollution, a few people who have both power and technology escape the disaster and build the last great metropolis, Ecoban. As its energy source is the irradiated pollution clouds themselves, the people of Ecoban seek to destroy their rivals, the simple people of Marr, who threaten their oppressive, industrial way of life. Standing alone against Ecoban is a young man of Marr who only wants to clear away the dense clouds of pollution to let the girl he loves see the wonderful blue sky that once was."

 

[William Lee]

can anyone upload the trailer to a better server? i'm pulling it at 1.42kb/s and i'm on broadband. I really want to see it but i can't wait 10 hours for the dl!

Thanks
Will

 

[Morgan Jolley]

And now, decades later, we look at U.S. films like the Matrix, and they are clearly influenced by anime such as "Ghost in the Shell" and even "Armitage", so the whole process is circular

And GitS was inspired by Blade Runner (really, it was).

It is circular. One thing inspires something else, takes it to the next level, then something else is inspired. Anime spawned cyber-punk, cyber-punk spawned The Matrix, The Matrix spawned futuristic kung-fu (like in Alias and such). What next? Live action mecha movies in America?

 

[Tony Stirling]

Will, it's worth the 10 hour wait!!!

Seriously, this looks beautiful. The music fits, too, but I suppose we must remember we're only watching a teaser trailer, so who knows what the music for the finished product will be like. But it's apparent that the blend of cel animation and cgi as demonstrated by even a short clip far surpasses anything produced recently (think: Titan A.E.).

Let's hope the movie lives up to the promise of the trailers!

tony

 

[William Lee]

please someone send me the trailer!

AIM : Constable Chim

 

[Seth Paxton]

And GitS was inspired by Blade Runner (really, it was).

Yes, Blade Runner was the first of the cyberpunk films and even predates the neuromancer novel. Though Dick touched on these themes of existence and reality, I don't think anyone actually considers him a cyberpunk author. But the vision that Ridley Scott applied to the story did create that type of universe out of it.

There is no mistaking the long shots of visuals of that world with only haunting music behind it (very much how Scott's cut of BR is) for example.

But I wouldn't say anime inspired cyberpunk, at least not at the beginning. Remember that GitS was basically Bandai's first anime film unless I misunderstand something, at that was only in 95, and we already had a Gibson story brought to the screen in the same year (Johnny Mnemonic), starring Reeves no less. So clearly that film also had a Matrix influence, at least in regards to casting.

But all of this stuff is 10 years delayed from the literary movement. In fact, Wild Palms (TV mini-series) is another film in the cyberpunk vein predating all of these (except BR). I wish more Sterling or Gibson stuff would be brought to the screen. I've yet to see the Abel Ferrara's version of New Rose Hotel, but is sounds like it's not so hot. That's what sucks most of all is when these great authors get brought to the screen and ruined, which then stops future attempts.


Funny enough I just watched GitS yesterday unrelated to this thread. I was just in the mood for it. Kick ass film still (oh really ).

Also note, GitS:Innocence is apparently in preproduction for 2004.

Now to spend 10 hours downloading that trailer...

Then I can stop hijacking the thread and talk about the subject at hand.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Remember that GitS was basically Bandai's first anime film unless I misunderstand something, at that was only in 95, and we already had a Gibson story brought to the screen in the same year (Johnny Mnemonic), starring Reeves no less. So clearly that film also had a Matrix influence, at least in regards to casting.

Umm, Bandai has been making anime since the 70s....

The theatrical films are usually under the "Emotion" label, and they own studios like Sunrise.

If you mean the US release, that was Manga Entertainment, nor was it their first film.

 

[Dennis Pagoulatos]

Just thought you guys would like to know...the Wonderful Days website is *moving* a lot faster than it wasn't moving the last few weeks!

I'd check out the site while it's a rockin', the trailer and still images gallery are especially cool (saved a couple of images for my desktop already!)

-Dennis

 

[Seth Paxton]

Oh, sorry Jeff. Obviously you would know a lot better than I would. I didn't realize that (they had existed so long). I thought GitS was what really got them going. This is why I said "unless I misunderstand something" since I'm no expert on anime.


I also forgot Akira which is 1988. It has many of the cyberpunk themes, though some of its strong spirituality themes (such as true ghosts, magic, forces from beyond the grave) really are not part of cyberpunk.

While I can't say for certain that little or no anime prior to the 80's was cyberpunk in nature, I certainly wouldn't call the mecha themes (such as Shogun Warrior bots or Transformers) to be cyberpunk in nature. Some ideals were in there, but then this is true for Rollerball or Soylent Green and neither of theme are cyberpunk. They merely sit on the doorstep before a major shift hits that integrates many of these variou ideals into one genre.

At least IMO. I'm always willing to here counter-examples and reasons. Like I said, Jeff, I know this is an area that you would be considered an expert in around here, so my thoughts are coming from a consideration and understanding of cyberpunk, not anime.


Anyway, back to the original topic. I took at look at that trailer and it looks amazing. Thanks for bringing it to my attention Dennis. It's amazing to see where animation is going at this point. There are so many parallel approaches right now, each beautiful and creative in their own way. It's a little disturbing though that Disney is not really anywhere near the vangaurd of any of this unless you let them sneak in by hanging around Pixar. I'm sure Walt would be thrilled by all this other great work, but you have to think it would see the challenge and rise to it, using these other works as inspiration for his own talented efforts.

 

[Dennis Pagoulatos]

There is no doubt in my mind that "Blade Runner" & "Star Wars", among others, have hugely influenced/ shaped the style of anime that we see today.

On the American animation front, I get the sense that Disney is completely out of touch with any inkling of an "adult" demographic. They have defined (in a rather limiting way) what the "formula" is to be for "children's" animation, and they stick to it. All attempts to step outside of the formula (albeit half-assed ones) like Treasure Planet & Atlantis recently, are met with financial disaster. They have only themselves to blame, because they aggressively market themselves as this puritanical, creepy, "product" oriented company. I'm sure Walt has done about 576 roll-overs in his grave- or cryogenic chamber- in the last 30 years. They have very talented people working there, and you'll hear no arguments from me about Pixar folks being geniuses...but every time I see an anime like "Spirited Away", I wonder what the hell is going on?! And I ask myself, is Disney not capable of making something this interesting/ imaginative/ original? I'm afraid the answer has been "no" for quite some time...

-Dennis

 

[Jin E]

Dang... Im getting 1.6k... and my friend in Nebraska is getting the same. I'll be able to view the trailer in about 5 hours. Anyone download the clips from the Korean site?

 

[Morgan Jolley]

On the American animation front, I get the sense that Disney is completely out of touch with any inkling of an "adult" demographic

Honestly, their best bet to do anything adult-oriented in terms of animation would be to make a movie and release it through Miramax. If it's under Disney, people will assume it's for kids.

And even when they make something more for teens or adults, like the aforementioned Atlantis and Treasure Planet, it ends up being family oriented and for kids. Either Walt wasn't thinking ahead to when they ran out of kids' stories when they made the company or they seriously lost their way somewhere.

 

[TheLongshot]

Anyone download the clip under "video clips"? Very interesting. It looks like most of the backrounds are acutally models, filmed with a HD camera and combined with animation that way. Pretty cool, actually. Probably far better integration than 3D models.

Jason

 

[Dan Rudolph]

Honestly, their best bet to do anything adult-oriented in terms of animation would be to make a movie and release it through Miramax. If it's under Disney, people will assume it's for kids.

They are doing Clerks: The Animated Movie under Miramax. They've already released Princess Mononoke this way.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

Honestly, their best bet to do anything adult-oriented in terms of animation would be to make a movie and release it through Miramax. If it's under Disney, people will assume it's for kids.

I don't want Miramax coming anywhere near any foreign language properties. Had it not been for Tokuma's "Do what we say, and don't touch a frame or die" contract, Mononoke would still be suffering under the yoke of dub-only, and probably would have been cut to ribbons to boot

Let Columbia, ANYONE have it instead

 

[Seth Paxton]

My problem is not so much with a lack of adult themed films, but rather the lack of innovation on Disney's part. There seems to be a real lack to produce anything fresh since their outburst with Little Mermaid, B&Beast, Lion King, Aladdin...and Roger Rabbit too.

It's like after that fury they saw that as the formula to follow and we got Poca, Hunchback, etc. The closest thing to "fresh" was going back to Walt's Fantasia idea.


BTW, I got a download speed for the trailer of about 15KB. Maybe it was the time of day or something.

 

[Morgan Jolley]

I don't want Miramax coming anywhere near any foreign language properties

I was referring to original works, such as the Clerks animated movie. If Disney wants to make an animated movie themselves to appeal to a market other than families or little children, they need to make and release it under Miramax.

 

[Dennis Pagoulatos]

Jason: Actual models? No way! I need to download that clip! The site seems to be down at the moment though...I'll have to try back later.

Seth: The lack of innovation is precisely the problem. When you think about it though, when has Disney ever made a completely original story (original story & screenplay, no adaptations, reimaginings, etc.) into an animated film and had it succeed financially? I don't think they've ever shown that they are great original storytellers, they've adapted and "Disney-ified" a lot of famous stories, but original story ideas are few and far between, and often seem to be pale imitations that reach to be like other stories by more gifted authors'. The quality of the art & animation is exquisite, and always has been, but without interesting, engaging material to draw from, they seem dead in the water...

A collaboration between Disney/Pixar and Miyazaki, giving Miyazaki total creative control with John Lassetter to help would be interesting. A PG rated animated film for all ages could come out of that fantasy collaboration, one that would be a classic, I'm sure...but I don't think Disney would ever let that scenario play out, even if Miyazaki/ Lassetter were interested...

-Dennis