To All HTF Members: The "HD-DVD ONE FORMAT ONLY!" campaign begins...with YOUR help! (2 Viewers)

[Eric F]

Ok, so we have totally new software for new machines, for essentially a niche market. Not a good way for mass acceptance. When the D-Theater announcement was made, lots of folks were concerned (confused) that their brand new DVD discs were already obsolete.
What's the big deal if you already own the DVD already? You'ld be buying it for the new format anyways. It's not like folks here don't trade up when new editions come out.
Nobody has addressed my comparisons with the DVD-A and SACD rollout. You don't see anyone complaining that Sony is going to reintroduce their entire catalog on the CD/SACD hybrid format? Well, not here anyways, maybe on audioasylum.com.
I'm not against what you say, it's just that I feel hybrid HD-DVDs are a way to get the manufacturers to back the format and get them out faster. If a manufacturer with a big movie catalog gets behind the format that will definately help.
We'll have to wait and see.

 

[Carl Johnson]

Regardless of which format is eventually I'm sure some of the players will be backwards compatible (like combo LD/DVD players) but there's no way that the new software will work on current players. That would be like playing a PS2 disc on an original Playstation.

 

[Thik Nongyow]

Having the best video and audio quality on one disc format is good, but how can WE pressure studios that they should not over-charge prices of HD-DVDs? An affordable price will drive sales and acceptance of HD-DVD.

 

[Thomas Newton]

The reason I believe TVs should be made that wide in the future is because finally, for once, it would be a TV that presents aspect ratios the way they are expressed (with the height being a static "1").

Will there be price parity between a 2.35:1 TV that is X" high, and a 4:3 TV that is X" high?
How about motorized curtains that close to fit the OAR to keep the J6Ps from complaining about those black bars on the sides of the TV screen?

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

I don't think hybrid discs will be playable on current DVD players anyway. You can get away with CD/SACD hybrids on current CD players because both are 5 cm red laser formats. All you need is a seperate partition. But a blue laser disc, I'd assume, would have totally different layering and production design. Besides, why sacrifice quality for a concept that will be a relic a few years after release? Make the players hybrid. I do agree that the discs should be priced the same as DVD.

 

[Steve_Taylor]

I think if we go with Toshiba technology then i hope they produce players without the Chroma bug if the new technology requires so.
Heck they still don't produce chroma bug free players now!!
I think the infatuation with the silver disc regarding HD-DVD will win over DTheater Tape in the end.

 

[Brenton]

Will there be price parity between a 2.35:1 TV that is X" high, and a 4:3 TV that is X" high?

Of course not.

 

[Dan Hitchman]

I'm sure there must be a way in the digital telecine scanning transfer to create real "2.35:1 enhanced" HD-DVDs. That way those with 16x9 paneled digital front projectors and the right anamorphic lens (hopefully not just a prism) could create a full 2.35:1 image on a screen and use the entire 1920 x 1080 pixel array for maximum brightness and resolution. The player could downconvert and add the proper black bars for those with only 1.78:1 HDTV's.

This process is done today to make 1.33:1 media (today's DVDs) 1.78:1 compatible. Now it's time to make 1.78:1 HD media 2.35:1 compatible.

Who's with me?

Dan

 

[Ronald Epstein]

Update

Folks, we really appreciate your help and
discussion in this campaign. Many thanks for
those of you that used the banners on your websites.
This idea was originally Bill Hunt's -- not mine.
Parker and I simply thought it to be a worthwhile
campaign and we jumped on board.
Bill has just posted a more descriptive webpage
of what this campaign is all about.
You can find it here:
http://www.thedigitalbits.com/hddvdoneformat.html

 

[Glenn Overholt]

Ron - if you feel that my comments are ruining this, feel free to delete it, and I won't be offended.

I've been avoidiing this thread until now, and I just read through it. We're not ready for HD. I think that the Betamax workers dreamed this up so they won't have to get laid off.

Four formats - is this for real? Two (VHS/Beta) was bad enough. Four would be insane if they came out, and I know that no one would buy anything, but two would kill the whole thing as well. We know better, and yes, I'm referring not to just us, but J6P - he/she could figure this one out too.

Frankly, I don't think they are ready to go HD. If they were, they'd have just one format set up. Four just has to be a joke. We should all just sit back and laugh at them.

Besides - what do I want to see an HD P&S movie for? Oh, good grief! Ok, we'll get them to guarantee that every disk will have P&S and OAR and oh, wait, today's format and HD. (Is it getting crowded in there yet{Meaning on the disk}?)
DD and DTS - extras?

Oh, and count the $$$ for this. You say it will be a better picture? Higher quality? Let me ask you something - are they going to come out with this HD format just for us? J6P doesn't have a WS HD TV set. I could probably count the number of average people that that have WS, let alone HD sets on one finger. Why would they even consider making them backward compatible? Then we could buy and play them now, and only get a new player when our current one breaks down. We won't have to buy any disks over. Please, don't get into this. We're wasting our time here.

Glenn

 

[Eric F]

Certainly someone sees a market for pre-recorded HD material because D-Theater wouldn't exist if they didn't.

I would advise people to really take the time to read the points made in previous posts, as you'll see that many of them were already made. I already pointed out that HD-DVD and HDTV are intimately tied. Most people are purchasing widescreen HDTVs not to watch broadcast material but to watch DVDs. That's why HD-DVD might not be as big a risk as you suspect.

What there needs to be, on the current administration's part (this ain't likely to happen), is a severe drop on the current import taxes imposed on Asian electronics, thus opening the floodgates for inexpensive widescreen HDTVs. Yes, requiring a DTV tuner in every 36" or larger TV by 2006 might help a bit, but it's not enough. What would have been better is requiring every 27" or larger TV to be 16:9. That would have made a much bigger impact on the market.

 

[Dan Smith]

I agree that the PLAYER should be backward compatible NOT the DISC itself.

 

[Ed St. Clair]

You don't see anyone complaining that Sony is going to re-introduce their entire catalog on the CD/SACD hybrid format?

The CD layer on an SACD release has typically been superior to the CD release. An look for Sony to release 'mostly' new catalog title in this format.
Drooling over the Stones!

 

[JasonK]

My thoughts echo many other people's sentiments. I would like the PLAYER but not the DISC to be backward compatible. That way we can watch films that may take years to be released (Cabin Boy, for instance) while waiting for a new HD version to come out. And I would be curious about the cost of recordable DVD's. As of right now, the Toshiba model has me most interested.

Another format war does nothing but confuse and agitate consumers and stunts the growth of the new format(s).

 

[GregC]

My vote is for a Blue Laser Disk but in a case, like computer discs. This is how it should have been done the first time. Let's get it right this time. No fingerprints, no scratches, no cat hair... If that means we lose "backward-compatibility", so be it.

 

[Thomas Newton]

I would suggest that one HD disc format is important, but that getting the right format is more important than getting something out the door immediately.

The three alternatives that the studios are considering seem to be limited to about 2x to 3x the storage that is available on current DVDs. Considering how long the studios are likely to take to get any new HD format into production, 2x to 3x discs are going to be obsolete by the time there are any reasonable number of titles.

That might not matter if 2x to 3x discs had so much space that for all practical purposes, extra space would not buy any sound or video or other improvements.

In practice, a storage increase of only 2x to 3x is likely to go for encoding 1080i HDTV video at compression ratios approximating those in use today. There is not going to be a ton of space to encode resolutions much higher than 1080i (for future growth), or to accomodate 4:3 Pan and Scan and 16:9 Pan and Scan on the same disc with OAR (to keep the MAR-only crowd at bay). (I do assume that there will be enough space to include at least one 6.1 or 8.1 MLP audio track.)

I suppose if new players continue to play regular CDs and DVDs, that reduces the "forklift upgrade" problem somewhat. Also, for the moment, only a few people have really good TV sets. This is a double-edged sword. People with really nice HDTV sets and nothing to take full advantage of their capabilities may be eager for any improvement. At the same time, unless a new HD-DVD format has benefits that are large enough to make a lot of satisfied DVD owners dissatisfied when they see it, it may not gain critical mass.

 

[David Coleman]

I think whatever format is chosing between the Blu Laser proposals that the data rate has to exceed the 28mbs of DTheater since that is now the standard! That is unless a better codec(possibly this Toshiba proposal)than mpeg is proposed with a lesser bit rate but equilavent or better picture!

And yes, whatever the proposal it should also allow for a higher audio bitrate than what is currently available.

David

 

[Jon_Stevens]

I'd like to throw my support behind the idea of having a regular dvd version on the HD discs at the beginning. What I've learned from the sacd dvd-audio war is that if dvd-audio discs would have had a cd layer, the war would be over. Sony promised us hybrid discs but has not delivered. Putting both versions on dual sided discs eliminates dual inventory, allows people that don't want to upgrade to still be able to play the discs, and it makes it easier for the format to be accepted.

Just my .02


Jon

 

[Brenton]

My vote is for a Blue Laser Disk but in a case, like computer discs. This is how it should have been done the first time. Let's get it right this time. No fingerprints, no scratches, no cat hair... If that means we lose "backward-compatibility", so be it.

You mean like a floppy disc? I see what you're saying, that's a great idea. If I'm not mistaken, weren't computer CDs like that when they were first released? An optical disc is far too fragile to be exposable to the elements (especially for movies, which get rented by careless individuals).

 

[Calvin Watts III]

Count me in under Toshiba's proposal.
I'll do my part,little as it may be.
Backwards compability is a must.
Period.
Or it will fail.