"The Robe" and "Demetrius and the Gladiators" are now a wow! (1 Viewer)

[RobertGr]

Thanks for checking Joe and David thanks for the possible solution regarding the video master. You guys here are really the pros regarding the tech side of video, my love is the finding of rare fiilm elements, original negs etc.

Example on MIRACLE ON 34th STREET there are scenes that were deleted, I know FOX has treated this title with the love and respect and value the title as a National Film Treasure. And I know they extensively searched for the deleted material.

My love of the film was part of the reason I became a historian re: Macy's Parade and wrote a book on the subject. The magic of that film is in part because of the inclusion of the parade footage filmed for the movie. FOX had Macy's co-operation. FOX had numerous cameras filming the parade but only a couple of actual minutes actually appear in the movie.

Well I was recently watching an episode of VOYAGE TO THE BOTTOM OF THE SEA the episode entitled HAIL TO THE CHIEF and I was stunned to see a few seconds of footage that I can for 100% for sure identify as footage from MIRACLE ON 34th STREET that did not appear in the actual film.

I of course contacted FOX and they really were very awesome that they seemed very interested in where I saw the footage after seeing the frame grab. So hopefully it might give them another ave to check for footage.

That is the part of film collecting I love these rare finds.

Many years ago before Turner bought MGM I had a source there that swore a collector in Texas had the actual missing footage from the JITTERBUG number in THE WIZARD OF OZ, these are the types of info that I love to track down and try to see become reality!

: )

 

[Joe Caps]

David B K No, the laser master could not be made into a fake anamorphic transfer. Considering how bad the materials are for the Robe, It is amazing that they got a decent trasnfer for dvd.
As for finding missing materials, I found missing footage for two musicals - Lost Horizon and 1776.
for Lost Horizon I found three missing musiclnumbers that had been cut after the first week.
For 1776 I found almost 45 minutes of footage and remixed both Lost Horizon and 1776.
lost Horizon was originally a stereo film for about two seconds but the studio had junked the stereo track.
As for the laser transfers of The Robe and Demetrius, I was THERE when they were being done.
To muddy up the waters further, a few years after TheRobe was released on laser, Fox did a rerelease of some religious themed films on VHS. In this package was a widescreen release of the Robe that was better than the laser.
To this end, I called Bruce Venezia and Frank Hall at Image to see if they could get this new master. The Robe was up for a repressing, so Fox sent the new master for Laser and it quietly replaced the old master on Laser.
They also fixed the trailer for Demetrius that was on the Robe Laser. the old trailer had been transferred incorrectly and the people were tall and thin. They changed the ratio to make the people look normal. This is but one of the differences between the two pressings.
A Challenge - if you can find the remastered Robe demetrius and are willing to let me borrow it, I will publicly eat crow. I only demand to choose what kind of omelet is made form the egg on my face. contact me at [email protected]

 

[RobertGr]

Joe the stuff you found is amazing and that is what make film restoration fascinating. Frank Hall at IMAGE was one of my contacts and a VERY good friend, I was the editor of a laserdisc newsletter and in fact David Goldstien VP for video at FOX at the time gave me clearance to use the FOX logo in a column we featured entitles FOX CLASSICS so Frank gave me all the tech info on the releases. At one point he told me I should go out to California and take a job they had that would have involved watching films all day and voicing opinions on if it would be a viable Laserdisc release. I told him I don't like earthquakes, six months later they had the big Northridge Quake!

Frank was tops, as is Garrett Lee there too. I bought the second version of THE ROBE Laserdisc when they remastered it and lowered the price to $39.99Your line that FOX quietly provided the new master for the laserdisc repressing is exactly what happened on the dvd's. That poster at the start of this thread that asked why would FOX do a restoration and not promote it should see you said they did that on the second laser copy.

PR can cost a ton of money and FOX needs to budget for all their major releases, I guess they need to put the money behind the titles they feel will benefit from the PR blitz.

On MIRACLE they did extensive PR in fact they did a satellite TV tour, radio tour and FOX NEWS LIVE last Thanksgiving in which I promoted the disc for them. THE ROBE is important in the history of FOX and I feel it deserves a special edition, I grew up here in NY when Channel 7 had the 4:30 movie in the afternoon and they would show THE ROBE over two days the same wth KING OF KINGS and BEN HUR (4 days) every Easter and that is how many NY'rs remember THE ROBE.

I now go to a movie theater upstate NY called The Lafayette which has a classics line up every Saturday morning for $6.00. The theater opened in 1924 and is being restored by a great guy named Nelson Page. The film programmer listens to suggestions from fans like me and I have been asking him to shoiw THE ROBE and he sadi he is trying to get a print! It is a hope of the theater as the film played there in 1954 after it's major engagements were over.

The film is enjoyable and was an innovator when released and for too many years it was put miles behind BEN HUR, KING OF KINGS, SPARTACUS etc I am glad FOX is really stepping up to bat on their classics!

: )

 

[Bob Graham]

Joe,

What is the status of the flat version of THE ROBE, filmed simultaneously with the Cinemascope version? I had hoped that Fox would do a special edition with both versions and some commentary and special features. It was kind of ironic to me that THE ROBE was not part of Fox's Studio Classics series, given it's importance to the studio and film history.

 

[RobertGr]

Hey Joe

Did you know why their was a sequel to THE ROBE? The pre filming budgeted cost of making the film was so high the FOX honchos would only justify the go ahead if the sets could be used over two films to basically lessen the overall cost, as a result it was decided to make a sequel!

 

[Joe Caps]

Robert G You say you are in upstate New York- where at? I am in Elmira which is near Syracuse and Ithaca New York.

I know much about the Robe. I was friends with Ken darby who was choral director on the film and when I lived in California, got to know Jay Robinson.

Years ago, got the pleasure of having dinner with Miss Jean Simmons, and she thought it was amusing that the main films of hers I wanted to talk about were TheRobe and The Egyptian.

 

[RobertGr]

Joe I live in Long Island near Belmont Racetrack. I travel to Suffern Ny which is about an hour from my home to ho to the Lafayetter Theater. In fact this morning they showed THE LITTLE PRINCESS in a rare dye transfer print. The day before Easter they will be showing THE WIZARD OF OZ also this season they will be showing THE THIEF OF BAGDAD 1940 and other shows include A NIGHT TO REMEMBER.

Wow on Jean Simmons and Jay Robinson. He seemed to have gone so far over the top in THE ROBE that there were very few roles for him of the same type character in other films.

Ken Darby was very talented I think he got his start on OZ?

And ELMIRA NY was the hometown of HAL ROACH shom I actually corresponded with during the 1980's. Sadly his classic films are MIA on dvd!

Would love to discuss film history

: )

 

[Joe Caps]

Several years ago, a three channel stereo track was found for the FLAT versionof the Robe. It would be great if Fox could put this out.

In one scene, the scene on the cliff edge when Marcellus returns to Rome from Jerusalem and Burton is talking to Simmons on the cliff edge, they are interrupted by a slave saying to Burton, "The emperor will see you at once." That girls voice is dubbed in my Marilyn Monroe who was on the dubbing stage to do voice overs for one of her films. The girl who played the servant didn't show up and Marilyn said she could do it. this story courtesy

of Ken Darby.

Robert GR - can you find out- Fox just announced a special editon of Sand Pebbles. I know that Fox has been working on the restoration of this film to the original long version. Some sources say this new dvvd is the restoration and others say it is the same short version. Can you find out which?

 

[RobertGr]

Very intresting story on the dubbing by Marilyn Monroe, also on the three track stereo for the flat THE ROBE, I will check on THE SAND PEBBLES with my sources this week. I would totally upgrage to a special edition of THE ROBE if they can offer both versions and good bonus materials!

 

[RolandL]

I have the 2001 DVD of the Robe. I did screen captures using PowerDVD software. You can see them at http://cinerama.topcities.com/robe.htm . If someone could show the same scenes from the 2005 DVD, that would be great.

 

[David_B_K]

Mine is the 2001 version, so i am anxious to see captures from the 2005 one as well.

 

[RobertGr]

http://www.dvdscan.com/biblical.htm
Check out the above link to a great review that compares the original disc reviews of THE ROBE in R1 vs R2 and also the laserdisc editions check out his opinion that THE ROBE is in dire need of restoration!
I also want to say Joe Caps is a class act, he checked with sources and did say they agreed there were some type of restoration on THE ROBE and DEMTRIUS was restored. Although there is no proof the discs were done over.
The copyright info on THE ROBE packaging list it as 2005, which is when FOX more than likely did the dvd master upgrade and the same with DEMETRIUS.
I have seen both these film in every incarnation on video and they never looked better so FOX does deserve credit for listening to the people like us on these boards whom for years asked them to do just that.
Sure we can still beef about their pricing on some box sets but they are really stepping up. You know human nature makes us easy to complain when we are not happy but we never seem to compliment when we see things we like!
BRAVO to all the restorers of classic film!

 

[Mark Anthony]

Robert Gr I think the point has got missed somewhere along the line, besides your obvious support of good quality transfers and commendations of Fox's work, which is unecessary as their DVD's have generally always been very good since around 2000 onwards, Joe bought the discs you described - with the new cover from 2006 re-release and saw no difference.

You still have shown no evidence whatsoever of the difference in versions pre-2006 and 2006 and none of your or Joe's contact's have concurred with your assertions that the dvd transfer is different and none of the reviews you've mentioned do either - so we're still back to square one.

I'm sure many people, myself included, would love for you to be correct as it's great when problematic transfer's of classic film's get re-done, but thus far you have done nothing to prove this besides unproven hearsay.

M

 

[RolandL]

Hello Joe and Robert,
Please post screen captures of the 2005 version so we can do a comparison. Below are from the 2001 dvd.

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[RobertGr]

Mark Anthony you seem the one not to be getting it, Every review from the discs 2001 release pointed out the film was in need of restoration. FOX confirms work was done on both titles in 2005 and around 2006 stuff appears on chat forums the discs now feature restorations. Please show me one legit review from respected site that say the film looked great on dvd in 2001! And all of a sudden the images on the discs now do not match up with the reviews from 2001 and everyone is saying the film looks good on dvd. All of the discs out there in the stores on the back of the cover probably say copyright Fox 2005.

Hellooooo doesn't that tell you something.

The facts so far

2001 every review says the image is in need of restoration, not one good review out there from any respected reviewer.

2005 FOX restores the films

2006 blurbs on other chat forums mention the dvd now boasts new restorations

2006/7 the discs covers are done over and the back say copyright 2005

Evidence points to the discs being redone.

And lastly Joe said he checked with sources and they concur work was done on the films although cannot confirm if those restorations were used on dvd.

So I am correct in saying they were restored. Hey Mark why don't you call FOX and try to get an answer?

Sad people like you have nothing better to do than to stir it up!

 

[Arnie G]

All we want are screeshots from the new DVDs. Is that so difficult?:frowning:
You need an attitude adjustment.

 

[RobertGr]

Arnie you and Mark Anthony need more than an attitude adjustment you need a life.

I am personally satified that all points to the discs featuring restored prints and done without fanfare just upgraded as Joe pointed out FOX did just the with the laserdisc version of THE ROBE - haven't you heard the expression "History repeats itself?"

 

[Mark Anthony]

All I have ever asked is for you to put your money where your mouth is, we know the 2001 dvd's are from before the 2005 film restoration, that's obvious, but how can you be "satisfied" that the disc's have been upgraded when Joe's bought them and they haven't been. Who gives a monkey's what's been said on other chat forums if the posters are as ill-informed and unable to clarify their claims as you are!

I just don't see what part of this you don't understand.

One final time the new editions of the disc's you have described as being restored have been checked by a poster who knows the existing disc's very well and they haven't been.

I take personal insults from people who don't know me on a public forum with about as much credence as I do of people who make unsubstatantiated claims and prefer to insult rather than back them up.

Your respectability has just hit the dreg's of the barrel.

M

 

[Steve...O]

ROBE and DEMETRIUS controversies aside, one thing that is overlooked is that Fox has done a wonderful job with their film preservation programs and ensuring that, for the most part, their classic DVDs shine from a presentation standpoint. I have been amazed at how good some of their films look especially given the poor state of many of the elements from the 30s.
Warners deservedly receives a lot of credit for their releases, however Fox seems to be overlooked. Partly because they don't promote their product well enough (I agree with Joe Caps on this) and partly because the pricing structure on some of their box sets has probably discouraged some from buying them.
Robert Gr - I have sent you a private message.

 

[RobertGr]

Ditto Mark Anthony sadly you never had respectibility at all. I came on the board with a legitimate view and after Joe questioned me you simply attacked my views without even knwoing anything about anything. Since this Joe has been the man about it and did say he checked with sources and they said the titles said the films were restored.

My source confirmed DEMETRIUS was the restored master on dvd. And THE ROBE looks to be the restored version.

I take a lot of reviews from DIGITALLY OBSESSED, DVD SAVANT, DVD REVIEW to be quite accurate. You have the opinion they do not know anything but you do. What discs have you reviewed on major sites are you a disc reviewer or do you just always try emulate Joe Caps.

Joe Caps seems to be the only honorable guy on this thread!