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The better of the two lens kits?

Discussion in 'Photography' started by Ronald Epstein, Jul 24, 2010.

  1. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    Looking at the Nikon d5000 kits at Best Buy.


    There seems to be two body/lens kits at a rather

    significant price difference.


    The first kit, the lower priced one is here:

    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Nikon+D5000+12.3MP+Digital+SLR+Camera%2C+Memory+Card%2C+Case%2C+Extra+Zoom+Lens/9999134400050011.p?id=pcmprd134400050011&skuId=9999134400050011&st=nikon%20d5000&lp=2&cp=1


    It features camera and extra 55-200mm Vibration reduction zoom lens for $950



    The second kit is much pricier:



    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Nikon+D5000+12.3MP+Digital+SLR+Camera+with+Bag+and+Extra+Lens/9999135100050004.p?id=pcmprd135100050004&skuId=9999135100050004&st=nikon%20d5000&lp=1&cp=1


    It features camera and extra 70-300mm AF-S VR Telephoto lens for $1270


    It looks like the different telephoto lenses are what sets the prices apart.


    Is it worth going for the more expensive kit based on the lens?
     
  2. Sam Posten

    Sam Posten Moderator
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    Ron those kit's aren't what I'd get. I'd get the 70-300 for sure but separately from the kit. It's SUPER sharp and great for daytime sports, and you can get it for under $400 by itself. The package you show doesn't have a normal zoom, just the tele.


    And let's face it, Best Buy is usually a pretty TERRIBLE place to buy a DSLR from IMO (despite the fact I bought my D5000 there, shhh!) Go with B&H, Adorama, Beach or even Amazon, bud.
     
  3. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    Sam,


    I have to purchase from Best Buy. I can finance my purchase

    for 36 months by doing so. Can't do that with most anyplace else

    though I will look at Adorama and Beach (but I doubt they have

    financing programs).


    And why is Best Buy so bad? The product is the same. Does B&H

    offer a better return policy?


    Now as for your advice....


    I don't understand your recommendation.


    The kits come with a normal lens and some sort of telephoto lens.

    One kit (the more expensive one) seems to have a better lens -- or

    at least that is what I presume.


    Neil Middlemiss bought the lower-priced d5000 kit and he is taking

    great pictures, interchanging the lenses as needed with no problems.


    So, if all I want to do is have a lens to take normal everyday
    photos and a lens to do telephoto from the back of a large room

    or across the yard you are saying neither of those kits have the

    right lenses?

    Does Best Buy sell the lenses you would recommend? I would

    buy just the body and the lenses separately.


    Greatly appreciate all your help.
     
  4. ManW_TheUncool

    ManW_TheUncool Well-Known Member

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    Ron,


    I would 2nd the recommendation for that Nikon 70-300mm VR, if you opt for the Nikon D5000, especially if you think you might want to go fullframe some day. Most of the other options you mentioned so far (in the other thread) seem to be digital crop lenses, which wouldn't work on a fullframe DSLR. Not sure where Sam can get that lens for under $400 though -- maybe he meant under $500(?).


    I'm curious though. Are the photo opps in places like Comic-Con really well lit enough for these consumer telezooms? I think you mentioned that's a big catalyst for your desire to upgrade now (instead sticking w/ your old G6). I'm just a little skeptical about using the long end of these teles (even w/ the image stabilization) for that kind of use.


    _Man_
     
  5. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    Man,


    Okay, so it looks like I should go with the more expensive

    kit that has the 70-300mm VR.


    A few more questions if you don't mind...


    First, what do you mean by full frame? I now what full frame

    means in the Home Theater Room (compared to anamorphic).

    However, I don't know how that translates to photography.


    Are the photo ops well lit? The room is not, but the subject

    (from a distance) is as there are bright lights on stage.

    So, I take it these cameras need a lot of light.


    I am happy to buy just the camera body and then better

    lenses separately. However, that would involve someone

    from this forum taking the time to look at the Best Buy or

    One Call website and actually linking the lenses they think

    I should purchase for either the Nikon d5000 or the Canon

    Rebel T2i.
     
  6. JohnRice

    JohnRice Well-Known Member

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    Ron, you could get this, which has the camera and basic 18-55 lens...


    http://www.onecall.com/product/Nikon/D5000-Kit/Digital-SLR/_/R-97343


    And this, which is the better telephoto lens that has been discussed...


    http://www.onecall.com/product/Nikon/70-300mm-f-4-5-5-6G-ED-IF-AF-S/Lens/_/R-34019



    I think the Best Buy kits you linked do not have the 18-55 lens, but the links no longer work. Maybe it was a package that expired last night. The ones I find today, like this...


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Nikon+D5000+12.3MP+Digital+SLR+Camera+with+Bag+and+Extra+Lens/9999133700050003.p?id=pcmprd133700050003&skuId=9999133700050003&st=d5000


    have the 18-55 in the picture, but not in the description. Also, you are right that there is probably no reason to avoid Best Buy. It's not like there are any places left to buy camera equipment who offer actual help. B&H is an enormous stockhouse that has been in business for decades. I used to buy most of my film from them. Best Buy is fine, you just won't get any quality help, but you won't anyplace else either. OneCall is fine. Through my own manufacturer experience, I would never buy from Beach or Adorama. The one thing Best Buy gives you is a store to walk into if you want to return, but of course, you pay tax.


    Since Man brought up the full-frame issue, I'll let him explain it.
     
  7. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    John,


    Thanks....

    What is the difference with the One Call links (camera and zoom lens) totaling approx. $1300

    and the Best Buy link you provided totaling $1300 but with bag and DVD included?

    Same camera and lenses as the One Call?

    Also, I take it in both the One Call and Best Buy links the camera comes with a normal

    lens to take everyday pictures?

    So, once again. both the One Call dual links and the Best Buy one link is the same

    camera and lens? If so, the Best Buy looks to be the better deal since it has bag and DVD

    thrown in.


    EDIT: John, look at that Best Buy link again. It does mention the 18-55 lens under FEATURES
    but double check.
     
  8. JohnRice

    JohnRice Well-Known Member

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    I did some looking, because I don't keep up on what lenses are currently available. Anyway, Man makes a completely valid point that your are unlikely to be able to use the longest range of the 70-300 lens in your situation. I don;t know how important the overall cost is, but it might make sense to get the d5000 body only and this lens....


    http://www.onecall.com/product/Nikon/AF-S-DX-NIKKOR-18-200mm-f-3-5-5-6G-ED-VR-II/Lens/_/R-99776


    which would be a great all-in-one lens and I am guessing it is better at the wide range than the kit 18-55. This one lens would also eliminate the need to carry a second lens in virtually any situation you are ever likely to encounter.


    I'm sure Sam and/or Man can provide info on how well rated this lens is.
     
  9. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    John and all,


    In addition to the above...


    If I decide on the Canon Rebel T21 this would be the combination I would like to consider?


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon+-+EOS+Rebel+T2i+18.0-Megapixel+Digital+SLR+Camera+-+Black/9778635.p?id=1218171770784&skuId=9778635&st=canon%20rebel%20t2i&cp=1&lp=1


    and


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon+-+70-300mm+f/4-5.6+IS+USM+Telephoto+Zoom+Lens/7528703.p?id=1127507945894&skuId=7528703&st=canon%20lenses&cp=1&lp=6


    (Which at $650 is a wildly expensive lens). There is a 55-200mm lens here:


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon+-+55-250mm+f/4-5.6+Telephoto+Zoom+Lens+for+Select+Canon+Cameras/8758114.p?skuId=8758114&IcsCsid=2-39-798-25-2-43892-40477-25-798-604-25-798-2390-0-1&id=1205245979459
     
  10. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    John,


    I know I am still asking a lot of questions here but

    it is helping me narrow my choices.


    So if I go with the Nikon you are recommending body

    only and an all-in-one lens?
     
  11. JohnRice

    JohnRice Well-Known Member

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    Ron, one thing, don't get too wrapped up in megapixels. That is the watts per channel of the digital camera industry. While that isn't entirely a fair comparison, because if a camera has XX megapixels, it has them, but it does not equate to image quality, and higher pixel counts can even result in lower overall image quality.


    The second Canon lens you linked is a "kit" lens and will be ok, but not as good as the other lens. It seems you want good image quality. Just keep in mind that the camera is only part of that. The lens can make or break it. An alternative you might consider the Canon body only and this lens...


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon+-+18-135mm+f/3.5-5.6+IS+EF-S+Lens/9553645.p?id=1218129433060&skuId=9553645


    or for more money, more versatility with this lens...


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon+-+18-200mm+f/3.5-5.6+Telephoto+Zoom+Lens+for+Select+Canon+Cameras/9065174.p?id=1218014505092&skuId=9065174



    If you do want better image quality, you probably just want to stay away from any of the kit lenses. These more expensive, more all-in-one lenses are probably a better option, and are more convenient. Once again, Man and/or Sam can probably provide quality ratings on these lenses.
     
  12. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    John,


    The megapixels doesn't concern me.

    So, with the Canon Rebel T2i you recommend body only:


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon+-+EOS+Rebel+T2i+18.0-Megapixel+Digital+SLR+Camera+-+Black/9778671.p?id=1218171773807&skuId=9778671&st=canon%20rebel%20t2i&cp=1&lp=2


    and this lens


    http://www.dpbolvw.net/click-3865148-10597222?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bestbuy.com%2Fsite%2FCanon+-+18-200mm+f%2F3.5-5.6+Telephoto+Zoom+Lens+for+Select+Canon+Cameras%2F9065174.p%3Fid%3D1218014505092%26skuId%3D9065174


    And you are suggesting that one lens will do both normal and excellent telephoto pictures? Remember,

    I want to take normal everyday pictures that are close and also telephoto pictures from afar.
     
  13. JohnRice

    JohnRice Well-Known Member

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    As we cross post, I am just suggesting, all in all, that with either Canon or Nikon, you should consider forgoing the kit lenses altogether and opt for a higher quality, more all-in-one lens. You will lose some of the longest telephoto (up to 300 mm) range, compared to the more expensive telephoto options, but you will gain convenience, quality and may not spend much more, or may even spend less. Some of the long range zooms these days seem to be incredibly good, but you will have to spend at least $500. Just think about not having to carry a second lens.
     
  14. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    John,


    Yeah we are cross-posting. Thanks for your patience.


    I don't mind carrying an extra lens if that lens will help

    me take great telephoto pictures.


    My only fear is that everyone has different advice and with

    every new person that posts I seem to be starting at the

    beginning again.


    Just want the best bang for the buck without spending
    a fortune on expensive lenses. At most, I am willing to

    dish out $1400-$1500 for body and lenses that will help

    me do great normal and telephoto pictures. However,

    getting that price point nearer to $1000 would be a bonus.


    In any event, you guys have been VERY helpful. Just

    have to decide on Canon or Nikon.
     
  15. JohnRice

    JohnRice Well-Known Member

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    Yes Ron, both Nikon and Canon make an 18-200, which should cover virtually anything you would ever need, in one lens. It's more expensive, but I suspect it is also better and it is clearly more convenient.


    The basic thing is, those kit lenses are cheap, and not all that good.


    I'm curious what those other guys think of these 18-200s. I;m sure you can search for reviews of them.
     
  16. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    ...and I don't mind carrying around two lenses.


    I kind of like the idea of swapping out lenses -- one

    for normal pictures and one for telephoto.
     
  17. JohnRice

    JohnRice Well-Known Member

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    That makes a difference then. Perception is important.


    Just keep in mind that 18-55 kit lens is not going to be that great. However, compared to a point-and-shoot, it will be fine. It's all relative.
     
  18. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    Okay, let's start here.


    If I go with the Canon Rebel T21


    This camera and lens:


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon+-+EOS+Rebel+T2i+18.0-Megapixel+Digital+SLR+Camera+-+Black/9778635.p?id=1218171770784&skuId=9778635&st=canon%20rebel%20t21&contract_desc=null


    Plus this telephoto lens:


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon%20-%2070-300mm%20f/4-5.6%20IS%20USM%20Telephoto%20Zoom%20Lens/7528703.p?id=1127507945894&skuId=7528703&AID=10597222&PID=3865148&URL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bestbuy.com%2Fsite%2FCanon+-+70-300mm+f%2F4-5.6+IS+USM+Telephoto+Zoom+Lens%2F7528703.p%3Fid%3D1127507945894%26skuId%3D7528703&ref=39&loc=01


    Total cost: $1550



    If I go with the Nikon d5000:


    The camera and lens:


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Nikon+-+12.3-Megapixel+Digital+SLR+Camera+-+Black/9311755.p?id=1218082646627&skuId=9311755&st=nikon%20d5000&cp=1&lp=2


    Plus the telephoto lens:


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Nikon+-+70-300mm+f/4.5-5.6G+ED-IF+AF-S+VR+Telephoto+Lens/8310829.p?skuId=8310829&IcsCsid=2-39-798-25-2-28541-40576-25-798-604-25-798-2390-0-1&id=1173578368318


    Total Cost: $1350


    The Nikon seems to be a way better deal but I will have you guys check out those specs.
     
  19. JohnRice

    JohnRice Well-Known Member

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    Ron, that is the wrong Canon lens. The equivalent to the Nikon lens you linked would be this one...


    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Canon+-+70-300mm+f/4-5.6+IS+USM+Telephoto+Zoom+Lens/7528703.p?id=1127507945894&skuId=7528703


    Still more expensive overall, but that is because the Rebel is more expensive.
     
  20. Ronald Epstein

    Ronald Epstein Administrator
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    Okay I fixed the link. Thanks, John.


    So the question is, between the Nikon and the Canon packages
    in post #18 is there a preference or change you would make?


    Actually, the difference in price between the two brands ($200)

    is negligible since I would have to spend at least that much

    on a speedlight for the Nikon.
     

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