Smileboxed THE WONDERFUL WORLD OF THE BROTHERS GRIMM -- Will it ever make it to Bluray? (1 Viewer)

[Moe Dickstein]

And yet people jump on me when I express a low opinion of ArcLight.

The constant diatribe just gets old. Personally, I tend to ignore criticism when someone seems to have an agenda. As someone who has worked at all levels of exhibition in theaters, just about every theater in the country is worse than Arclight in terms of quality of experience... Yeah, they tried to tear down the Dome. They lost, it stayed. I think that was... a while ago.

 

[Adam_S]

the seats are assigned, there's no reason people couldn't go into the arclight lobby. Nothing special about using the dome lobby, just wait for it to open in the arclight lobby. Plenty of bathrooms there, a souvenier shop, coffee, and a bar. plenty to do, plenty of space to stay out of the heat. You didn't have to be in the heat unless you were nuts and wanted to be.

 

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by Adam_S /t/290862/smileboxed-the-wonderful-world-of-the-brothers-grimm-will-it-ever-make-it-to-bluray/540#post_3983224
the seats are assigned, there's no reason people couldn't go into the arclight lobby. Nothing special about using the dome lobby, just wait for it to open in the arclight lobby. Plenty of bathrooms there, a souvenier shop, coffee, and a bar. plenty to do, plenty of space to stay out of the heat. You didn't have to be in the heat unless you were nuts and wanted to be.

This is blindly insensitive and insulting. Did it ever occur to you that there could be more than a few customers out there who have never been to the Arclight Cinemas before and have no idea there is a extension to the Dome? The Dome is set off from the other theaters and the other lobby and for anyone new to town or who may have parked outside the Arclight garage or used public transportation to get to the festival, it's entirely possible they have no idea there is somewhere else to wait. Just because you happen to be a regular patron who is aware of the options, don't assume that those who aren't are intentionally wrong and/or inferior to you.

 

[Moe Dickstein]

I'm surprised the ArcLight staff didn't direct patrons to the main lobby...

 

[NY2LA]

The constant diatribe just gets old. Personally, I tend to ignore criticism when someone seems to have an agenda. As someone who has worked at all levels of exhibition in theaters, just about every theater in the country is worse than Arclight in terms of quality of experience... Yeah, they tried to tear down the Dome. They lost, it stayed. I think that was... a while ago.

I too have worked in a variety of functions at both legit and movie theatres over several decades including, by the way, The Cinerama Dome. Believe it or not, I have handled a crowded theatre before. There is nothing so unique or special about this place that time honored proven techniques for handling an audience cannot be used there. The point is they do not live up to their hype. They are not customer or service oriented, as others here have pointed out. That comes from above. I don't see every chain constantly claiming they are the best of the best, to the degree that this one does. The Emperor has no clothes - and pointing that out may bring the kind of reactions I often get from those who buy into the hype. I frankly wonder about people who pointedly ignores all the obvious flaws and drink the Koolaid or suggests that others do. Are you by any chance employed by a subsidiary of Decurion? This is a company that claims to be all about the best of moviegoing without distractions, and they also attach exit signs directly to their screens. They were shown by experienced experts exactly how to achieve the best in distortion free projection at the dome, and ignored that in favor of cheap workarounds. I'm not saying they are the worst, but they are definitely not all they think they are. And the proof is everywhere. From how they shortchanged the dome to the thoughtless way they handle the guests. It's a garden variety multiplex with a haughty attitude. You don't become the best by just saying you are, you do it by constantly looking for details to improve on, and always considering the customers. It's clear that this company misses the mark. That's not an agenda, it's an honest assessment. And, looking around, I am obviously not the only one who has noticed.

 

[Moe Dickstein]

I have no professional or personal connection to any of the companies involved. I am a filmmaker and work for two directors as their assistant for my day job.
I generally frequent the Sherman Oaks location if I go to the theater, which I do a few times a year. These days I'd rather have the BD for the price of my ticket and be able to refer to it for research. Seeing The Master in 70 was my first trip to the Dome.
On the occasions I've been there, having worked over the years for AMC, Cineplex Odeon, Lowes, General Cinema, Classic Cinemas and Kerasotes, the Arclight experience from door to door was superior than any of the theaters I've been in elsewhere. That's just my personal opinion - I have no skin in this game.

 

[rsmithjr]

I have no professional or personal connection to any of the companies involved. I am a filmmaker and work for two directors as their assistant for my day job.
I generally frequent the Sherman Oaks location if I go to the theater, which I do a few times a year. These days I'd rather have the BD for the price of my ticket and be able to refer to it for research. Seeing The Master in 70 was my first trip to the Dome.
On the occasions I've been there, having worked over the years for AMC, Cineplex Odeon, Lowes, General Cinema, Classic Cinemas and Kerasotes, the Arclight experience from door to door was superior than any of the theaters I've been in elsewhere. That's just my personal opinion - I have no skin in this game.

Among multiplexes, the Arclight Hollywood is my favorite, despite my complaints. The usual attention to projection, plus the ambiance of the lobby, really make it for me.
I also like the Sundance Kabuki in San Francisco very much, a class act. I also like a little art multiplex in Monterey called the Osio, terrible projection but nice coffee shop and staff. Still film, had the pleasure of seeing a splice two weeks ago. A vanishing event.
There are a number of single-screen houses that I prefer but that is another matter.
I crave the theatrical experience and go to a lot of trouble to watch a film under optimal conditions.

 

[NY2LA]

Among multiplexes, the Arclight Hollywood is my favorite, despite my complaints.

I would go there more often were they not so pricey. One thing I do like is that the screens are most if not all side-masked, not top masked, so e widescreen movie will be wider than a flat one. Though I won't pay to sit in their 4 smallest rooms in the front end. The ones in the back are fine. But the seats, being merely wider, are not comfortable at all for not being really padded, and the headrest is hard as a rock. The body countoured lumbar supporting memory foam seats in the very compromised Universal Citywalk are infinitely more comfortable. But decent auditorium shape doesn't make it the be-all end-all. I've had some bad experiences there. And lots of attitude from staff and management.
Imagine arriving just at showtime.at the front doors of the Dome, which no longer have handles on the outside. A couple of staffers are causally chatting inside. They see you but do nothing. You wave at them, point to the door and hold up your ticket. One of them looks annoyed, the other rolls his eyes, and points over to the side of the building. Instead of opening the door for a paying patron, they expect you to walk all the way around the corner to the side, up some stairs, and back over to where they are standing. This has happened numerous times. This comes from management. They don't care what's easier for you, they want you to come in the other way. You might be tired and sore, you might have a condition that makes stairs difficult, but the heck with all that, you're right there and the movie is starting. Open the damn door! And it didn't stop there. The manager had the same attitude and was very condescending. That's the sort of stuff I mean. if I were just bitching incessantly about nothing in particular that would be one thing. But there are real issues.

There are a number of single-screen houses that I prefer but that is another matter.
I crave the theatrical experience and go to a lot of trouble to watch a film under optimal conditions.

Me too, actually, when I do go, which is rare. Which ones?

 

[NY2LA]

Back to the screen...
Did anyone see one of the digital travelogues. or the new short?

 

[RolandL]

Back to the screen...
Did anyone see one of the digital travelogues. or the new short?

Saw In The Picture short, South Seas Adventure, Cinerama Holiday, Seven Wonders of The World (partially digital, the rest from a 35mm scope print) and Grimm.

 

[rsmithjr]

I saw everything in the festival except 2001 at 2K. Hardly seems worthwhile with perfectly good 70mm prints around.
The new 3 strip "In the Picture" was a lot of fun. Mimics the plot of Cinerama Holiday. They did do some things that you shouldn't do in 3 strip such as some panning, but by and large, everything worked very well. 3 strip required a lot of work, and it is amazing how quickly the crew got up to steam.
I saw the digital remasterings. Some really amazing work! Given everything we were told about the budget, I went not expecting much. It appears that the process they use is really quite interesting in that it gets rid of scratches and dust without using temporal comparisons/copying from other frames. It seems like black magic but the results were incredible for what the price appears to be.
1. Cinerama Holiday and South Seas Adventure were in terrific shape. I had only seen clips of these on video and feared the worst, but the result was tremendous. it would have been interesting to see the DCP from HTWWW to compare the results. I suspect HTWWW is still better but not by what I had expected.
2. Seven Wonders of the World was incomplete so we saw restored and old telecines interleaved together. Wait to see the result.
3. Search for Paradise was faded 3 strip as has been seen before at various festivals. The digital is not finished but was promised for next year.
4. Windjammer (one of may favorites) was made from a 35mm composite of some age. Considering that, it was a miracle. Apparently the negatives have some missing reels and some damage according to John Sittig, requiring them to settle for the 35mm. Original sound was grafted on. I would like to see them start with the OCN's and switch to the 35mm composite only when necessary. This is a surprisingly important film I think.
5. Very impressed with Holiday in Spain, a picture I have long wanted to see. This was originally a 70mm production ("Todd-70" it was called to avoid some trademark issue). It appears that David and company put a lot of work into this to just reassmble the movie.
6. The Golden Head and Russian Adventure were the weakest technically, both from 70mm. The Golden Head had a lot of EE, and Russian Adventure was from a poor 70mm source, not impressive.
7. HTWWW, Grimm, and TIC were shown in good 3 strip prints. HTWWW and TIC are the same prints that have appeared before, the Grimm is well documented elsewhere. Grimm was the only dye-transfer Technicolor print on display, and you certainly can appreciate that wonderful process.
8. Mad World was shown in what has to be the darkest print I have ever seen made for a major film, really lacking in brightness. I thought that it was the projection equipment but am assured it was the print. I looked like you were watching it through sun glasses! Other than that, pretty nice presentation after the sound was properly balanced. This was the only actual 70mm we saw.
Overall, I cannot overstate how pleasantly surprised by the overall quality of everthing. The amount of work that David has put into this was amazing, I think he should win an Academy Award for his work on restoration and film history in the last decade, really superb. He is the Wide-Screen Renaissance Man.
P.S. This was 13 films in 3 days. LONGGG films with overtures, intermissions, walkout music, lectures and introductions. I have been back at work for 2 days and feel like I am still at sea. When I was a projectionist in college, we would work 12 hour days, then get some old print and run it at 3AM in the morning, with chemistry class at 8AM. Can't take it any more!

 

[NY2LA]

While the acting in Cinerama Holiday was understandably and acceptably dated and quaint, In The Picture made it look like Citizen Kane. Quelle fromages!
This to me was like a 1950s rural smalltown fifth grade school play on a big screen. When the "actors" began to talk I looked at the people around me and caught a general sense of "are they kidding?" The script and dialogue ranges from cornball to pulpit-preachy, and the amazingly amateurish acting did not improve on the script. Driving a car along a curvy road is mildly amusing, but hardly the occasion for the over the top rollercoaster reactions as scripted and performed. That scene would have played much better without them.
There were also several shots with the horizon bending at the join lines where the left and right panels would be at unnaturally extreme angles to the center, much more so than we see in other 3 strip films...
I had heard originally the plan was to shoot this MOS and then overdub some narration. That would have been a better idea. I think it might be saved by throwing out all the dialogue and cutting the runtime in half with minimal narration.
I found Cinerama Holiday to be, like most one projector screenings at the dome, very dim. Daylight scenes looked like dusk, some scenes looked like the before image in restoration comparisons, washed out with very muted color. The contrast was so low that the bobsled lacked in impact because the screen was mostly gray and you could hardly see the lines that would delineate the trench in the snow they were riding in. It, wisely, was not shown smileboxed, and was about 6 feet shorter on the screen than the 3strip movies were. There was no evidence of any surround sound, it appeared to be mono or 2 channel locked to the screen, sans the vibrancy of the Cinerama mags. Not a bad movie, it had puppets and ice skaters (one or two of which I believe were quite famous in the day) and (really) old New York, but...
The evening was so long, and with the movie's languid pace we were too lethargic for the promised breakdown reel which would have put us out after 2AM. I believe they decided not to run it, either because they were tired too, or because they saw how fast the place emptied out. I think Cinerama Holiday would probably play much better on a small bright home screen, and I imagine this and the one in Hawaii are the next two in line for Homevid. The ICEman kind of confirmed that they are the ones that are most ready to go as far as their work concerned.

 

[Neil S. Bulk]

I saw Mad, Mad World last night. It was a problematic presentation. The image was too dark. The center channel presumably was too low, as dialogue was tough to hear, but the music was more prominent than ever. And for some reason, the image didn't fill the screen, as there was a noticeable curve in the lower corners. It looked sloppy.

There were other issues (the overture stopped then started back up again and the curtain opened during the entr'acte), but it did have the police calls.
I've been to the Dome twice this month (the last time was for The Master). I've noticed that they no longer have staff members directing you to your seats.

 

[Rob_Ray]

I saw Mad, Mad World last night. It was a problematic presentation. The image was too dark. The center channel presumably was too low, as dialogue was tough to hear, but the music was more prominent than ever. And for some reason, the image didn't fill the screen, as there was a noticeable curve in the lower corners. It looked sloppy.
There were other issues (the overture stopped then started back up again and the curtain opened during the entr'acte), but it did have the police calls.
I've been to the Dome twice this month (the last time was for The Master). I've noticed that they no longer have staff members directing you to your seats.

I noticed the lack of staff members at the screening of the Brothers Grimm. And it's nearly impossible for this pair of 56-year-old eyes to read those tiny row labels a foot up from the floor in the subdued lighting. It was good thing my knees are holding up, otherwise I never would have found my assigned seat.

 

[NY2LA]

I noticed the lack of staff members at the screening of the Brothers Grimm. And it's nearly impossible for this pair of 56-year-old eyes to read those tiny row labels a foot up from the floor in the subdued lighting. It was good thing my knees are holding up, otherwise I never would have found my assigned seat.

Unless it's a sellout they don't care. I've found that numerous times there. Grimm was quite full the first show and you could barely find any ushers in the auditorium, they were all behind the concession where the money was coming in. And it IS so dark and they dress to match the walls, so they can literally hide against the wall and not be noticed! The usher I asked led me to the wrong seat, which I embarrassingly found out when the others arrived. Yeah it's too dark to read your ticket, let alone the tiny numbers. Speaking of which, since the tickets take up a whole page, couldn't they MAKE THE PRINT BIGGER??? With all that wasted space, why not print a little poster, some info on the movie?
But back to topic, Grimm looked great on the screen, compromises and all, just makes you realize how much greater a new print would look on a proper louvered screen... Not to mention how good the DVD/Blu Ray would look from any available source, which again was claimed by the D-ICEmen, so you know, there's that petition, or one could mention it to TCM.

 

[Adam_S]

I don't think the Dome is that dark, I was able to easily read my kindle while waiting for the show to start, and it's an old version, not the kind with a backlight.

 

[NY2LA]

I don't think the Dome is that dark, I was able to easily read my kindle while waiting for the show to start, and it's an old version, not the kind with a backlight.

The dome is kept MUCH darker than any of the rooms in the main complex, and MUCH MUCH darker than it was before the renovation. If you look at pictures of the pre-renovation days, the ring around the ceiling had bigger light openings about 2-3 times the size of the current ones. What was a relatively warm (yellow-gold/green) atmosphere is now stone cold and dark as a haunted house. I saw ushers and patrons alike using flashlights and phones just to read the tickets. There is simply no reason for it except to downplay the dim projection.

 

[Neil S. Bulk]

When I went to the Dome to see The Master I had a very good idea for where my seats were, but as I'd bought them a few weeks earlier, I wasn't completely positive. There were no ushers to help, and the person sitting in what turned out to be my row was totally useless. I asked if it was row "C" and he informed me he didn't know, as it was reserved seating. Come again? I know it's reserved seating, that's why I'm asking what row this is.

Using my logical brain, I asked the people in the row behind this guy if they were in row D. They didn't know either. Ultimately, I was able to confirm that it was indeed row c.

 

[GMpasqua]

Originally Posted by Rob_Ray /t/290862/smileboxed-the-wonderful-world-of-the-brothers-grimm-will-it-ever-make-it-to-bluray/570#post_3984158
I noticed the lack of staff members at the screening of the Brothers Grimm. And it's nearly impossible for this pair of 56-year-old eyes to read those tiny row labels a foot up from the floor in the subdued lighting. It was good thing my knees are holding up, otherwise I never would have found my assigned seat.

Someone asked me where there seats were, and since I had an idea I told them (I may have been wrong, but I didn't work there) I think they thought I did work there when they still couldn't find them

 

I saw the 2nd presentation of "Brothers Grimm". It was the reason I came to the festival from NJ. During the 30-minute repair break, I was afraid this show I'd been waiting 50 years to see would be cancelled. Then it started up again and played flawlessly - that's how I remember it, anyway. If there were any flaws or mistakes, I was too caught up in the film to notice them. What a beautiful movie - the embodiment of George Pal's kindness and love of storytelling. Seeing it in Cinerama, you become aware of how well-designed for the process it actually is. My favorite example of this: the sequence with Laurence Harvey and the local children running to the old storyteller's house - running all over the screen from end to end - accompanied by a wonderful section of Leigh Harline's fine score. The applause at the end was well-earned. You could tell the audience truly loved this film, and I was so happy to be a part of it. I only hope George Feltenstein from Warner Home Video was in the house.
Walking back to the hotel, crossing Sunset Blvd. at the corner of Ivar, I was not the only person whistling that catchy Brothers Grimm theme.
Earlier that day, I'd been very impressed by "Seven Wonders of the World" - not the print quality, but the entertainment value. Really a lot of fun, and most of the locations presented were seriously awe-inspiring. It was also cool to actually see and hear the great stunt pilot Paul Mantz on screen. He was such an important part of Cinerama, right up through "Mad Mad World". Before going back home I visited the grave of John Wayne in Corona del Mar, CA, and Paul Mantz is also buried there:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y231/billhuelbig/CentralCoast-20121002-00466_zpsb7485de5.jpg
Paying respects to Paul was a nice way to end my Cinerama vacation.