Response from District Manager of BlockBuster on OAR! (1 Viewer)

[Jesse Skeen]

I've said it before, and I'll say it plenty more times- they need to STOP labeling pan-and-scan as "FULL SCREEN"!! I'm betting that Best Buy letter really meant to say that the widescreen versions preserve the image but just got the wording mixed up. The original "Terminator 2" laserdisc release plainly says on the back "Presented in original FULL SCREEN theatrical aspect ratio"! Meaning your screen isn't filled, but you're getting the FULL picture!

 

[Scott-C]

Sigh...between this thread and the earlier one started by Ron about OAR under attack, I'd say this is certainly a formidable threat to OAR DVDs. I'm not panicking (yet) but I do think we should initiate some sort of action here.
One thought I had is that perhaps a committee should be formed of willing HTF members, to develop an action plan on how to respond to this threat. Perhaps one of the first things the "HTF Member Advocacy Committee" can do is develop and distribute an email, on behalf of every HTF member, to every major company that is in some way involved with the DVD decision-making, production, and marketing process. In this email, our position needs to be explained, and we need to educate in a clear and rational manner with regard to why we feel so strongly about OAR DVDs. The letter could go so far as to say that informal straw polls of HTF members indicates such a strong preference for OAR that a decision to not produce them could result in substantial loss of potential profits.
Additional ideas and actions could be discussed and acted upon by the committee.
I should say I haven't run this idea by Ron and Parker for their thoughts, and we would want to get their blessing/approval prior to proceeding. However, with their blessing to this idea, and if others think it's a good idea, I'd be happy to help coordinate it.
Even if this isn't something anyone wants to pursue, I hope we can effect some sort of positive response from those in positions of power in the industry, so that OAR DVDs do not go the way of Beta videotapes.
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Scott

 

[Frank Anderson]

After reading all of this I just feel like throwing my hands up in the air and saying the hell with it. But I will continue to try and educate people.
What I do is hand out SEVEN pages of color examples to people of Widescreen vs Pan & Scan. Side by side examples. The ONLY writing on those seven pages are the titles of the movies.
In most cases this works better than getting frustrated and red in the face. However there are still those few idiots who want to fill up their TV screens. When the time comes when widescreen TV's out sell 4:3 then I guess we will be the lucky ones as well as the studios becuase then they can re-sell widescreen movies to all the idiots who bought the Pan & Scan versions.
I have come to the conclusion that some people A) Don't want to know B) Don't care C) Only care about filling their TV screens.
Showing people pictures and examples can do a helluva better job of explaining than just talking to someone. People don't listen. They get confused. Pictures SHOW them the difference. You only need to start talking after they SEE the difference.
But they will completly tune you out once you start babbeling numbers:
sixteen by nine, four by three, two point three five to one, one point eight five to one, one point three three to one, etc.
Of course the STUDIOS could also help out by stop labeling Pan & Scan as Fullscreen.

Frank
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http://www.dvdprofiler.com/mc.asp?alias=Nightdog&acceptadult=true

 

[David Lambert]

P.S. If anyone shows examples of widescreen vs. p&s, don't show a Super 35 film.....it may give the pro-full screen folks some level of justification for butchering the OAR!

Answer: By showing it visually. Check out my examples from A Fish Called Wanda showing too much information. It's at this thread, near the bottom of the page:
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/Forum15/HTML/032063.html
MORE TV ON DVD, PLEASE!

 

[Frank Anderson]

Absolutely right. So how do we answer this issue?

Easy. Do what I do. Print them on paper and carry them with you. Print just one page put it in your pocket when you go shopping or to a party.
Of course I did not have them with me once when the subject came up where I get my hair cut. But you know what I did. I went home and got them, then showed the ladies the difference.

Frank
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http://www.dvdprofiler.com/mc.asp?alias=Nightdog&acceptadult=true

 

[Ty Zucker]

It seems that the members of the Home Theater Forum have a much better relationship with the representatives from various movie studios compared to sales & marketing execs at Best Buy & Blockbuster.
Wouldn't it be prudent to continue to bring up this issue with the source - ie, the studios.
Does offering a P&S version of The Mummy Returns in addition to the widescreen version really increase sales? I really wonder. They're going to buy/rent the movie because they like it. I just don't see someone standing in a dvd store or Blockbuster thinking "Bah, I don't want to buy/rent The Mummy Returns because it has those black bars."
Not having a P&S version of The Matrix didn't hurt it's sales one bit.
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[John Sparks]

DVDFile just reported that "The Mummy Returns" widescreen edition beat out the fullscreen edition by a whopping 2%!!!!!!!!!...the public needs really needs an EDUCATION!!!

 

[Glenn Overholt]

And then I got drunk last night! Ok, not really, but I did come up with a really sick idea.
If and when HDTV ever becomes a reality, I'm assuming that 4:3 sets will all be gone. (Ok, that is a few years down the road).
So I find someone with a P&S version and say, "Hey, how long do you expect to keep that DVD?"
He: "Hey, they don't wear out! Forever!"
Me: "No, the studios are screwing you. You're going to have to buy that DVD again."
Him: "What?"
Me: "The TV sizes are all going to widescreen. That DVD is going to look like crap, and you'll have to buy the widescreen one just to see it right. You just wasted 20 bucks."
This would piss him off to no end. If they were to ask anybody about HDTV and widescreen sets, they'd find out what was going to happen, and maybe spread the word?
Would it work?
Glenn

 

[Darren Rowley]

We shall have the last laugh my friends! What is poor J6P going to do when the only type of TV they can buy is 16:9? Because they will have a collection of P&S movies, they will complain about the black (gray) bars on the sides of the screen. They will see the error of their ways.
When more and more networks broadcast in widescreen format, J6P will bend to technology because they can't stand (understand) black bars.
There is a market for widescreen, we will not be forgotten. Widescreen shall prevail!

 

[chris_sharpe]

I just read the fist page of this thread, and I feel ill, very very ill. Has Blockbuster has reached a new level of stupidity, they always manage to, in regards to the OAR debate.
I work in a retail movie sore myself and me and my
co-worker attempt to educate at least one customer a day on the evils of P&S(piss & shit). We have had a fairly good rate of conversion at least 3 people a week swear off P&S

.
Also I avoid bringing in P&S DVD's whenever possible. Unfortunately Mummy Returns P&S was forced on me at my store, but has only sold 10 copies versus 250 copies OAR.
Hopefully all of our efforts will not be in vain and we will be able to show the studios the error of their ways. At each of the next chats we have with them we should stress the importance of OAR and not allow them to do this to the films we love.
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MY POWER ANIMAL TOLD ME TO SLIDE.
MY DVD LIST(SILENTBOB96)

 

[David Lambert]

Wouldn't it be prudent to countinue to bring up this issue with the source- ie, the studios.

Well, IF we formed an "HTF Select Committee to Promote the Merits of Original Aspect Ratio" (try saying THAT 5 times really fast! ), then they would definately work with the studios, as well as the retail chains.
Look, folks...I worked in retail for a looong time. Every retail chain has some sort of "Training Dept." If we can show the chains how to get easy-to-understand material into the hands of their store associates, they'll work with us. Especially since it will improve sales.
Where do we get the materials from, and the funding? Not all studios will work with us, but SOME will. At least on the materials. As for funding? Perhaps assistance in that quarter can come from the companies to whom promoting widescreen is of supreme benefit: all the WS TV manufacturers. Maybe from some pro-OAR Hollywood-types, too...like directors "SS" and "MS".

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DAVE/Memphis

MORE TV ON DVD, PLEASE!

 

[Jim Benard]

We won the war on DIVX, we WILL win the P&S war. Keep up the pressure. Studios want to sell. If they start to see their bottom line dropping with P&S only DVDs maybe they will come around.

 

[Frank Anderson]

David - that is a pretty good idea. Of course again there is the money issue. It could be done by the studio's to insert with every DVD... but that is wishfull thinking I know.

Frank
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http://www.dvdprofiler.com/mc.asp?alias=Nightdog&acceptadult=true

 

[Nick Graham]

We won the war on DIVX, but that's mainly because at the time the entire DVD market was pretty much made up of enthusiasts. It's a whole different ballgame now, and as much as it makes me mad, most people I talk to simply don't
care for a DVD having the OAR of a film, and actually prefer pan and scan. This is nothing everybody shouldn't have seen coming. DVD is rapidly ending the life of VHS, and with that, it inherits all of VHS's shortcomings (aside from of course picture and sound). The average American consumer has a growing preference for their DVDs to be pan and scan. The more the average joe enters the DVD market, the greater the preference (if not the demand) for pan and scan DVDs will become. It's just a fact of life. We who were once the majority of the DVD market are quickly becoming the minority. I hate it, but that's just the way life is. Most consumers aren't film buffs and simply don't care about the director's vision, they just want those "annoying black bars" gone. I'm not being a pessimist here, just a realist. Quite frankly, DVDs in the orignal OAR may become as small a niche market as laserdiscs and letterbox VHS titles were.

 

[Jeff Kleist]

When I was a video buyer, I was helping some lady find a copy of "Fried Green Tomatoes". All we had was the widescreen version (:BG
She asked me "Why do they do that anyway?"
The following method has worked for almost every J6P I have encountered, and the props are right there in the store
Grab 2 VHS tapes off the shelf (don't worry, it won't give you a rash!)
Hold 1 tape upright
"Let's say this is the width of your television set."
Then slap the other tape, held horizontally on top of that other tape, making a "T" shape.
"That's the shape of the movie, letterboxing is the only way to make a rectangular peg fit in a square hole. Look how much you're losing! Almost half the picture!"
Jeff Kleist

 

[Marty M]

As we all feared, J6P + DVD player = a big problem for the people who made this format what it is today. That is very disheartening.

 

[Matt Perkins]

We shall have the last laugh my friends! What is poor J6P going to do when the only type of TV they can buy is 16:9?
I'll tell you what he'll do: demand that all 4:3 films be vertically cropped to 16:9.
I am not joking.

 

[mark_d]

Getting OT a bit, but anyway...

I'll tell you what he'll do: demand that all 4:3 films be vertically cropped to 16:9

Here in 16:9 land (well, almost) there's a channel that shows a 2 hour loop of children's programming throughout the day. Some of this stuff is pretty old. One show, The Tweenies, is native 16:9 and was always shown as such, but just recently things changed. Everything is now broadcast 16:9, which means most programmes are cropped.
What's the shape of things to come?
16:9 whether we like it or not. I couldn't care less about TV shows, but movies cropped to 16:9 - either vertically (which I haven't seen) or horizontally (which I have seen) is somethink that irks.
Mark

 

[Ali B]

There are actually a fair few of the flagged titles that allow P&S'ing of Widescreen material on the fly (Aliens comes to mind). Since it is fairky obvious that, at least for the time being, J6P does not want widescreen dvds, why not simply encode all discs with these flags? I'm sure it is possible to have an option on the menu to selected OAR or butchered (

) version. If not, then simply put a piee of paper in the insert area telling people how to set their dvd players up like this. I have been an advocate of this flagging for some time, but I'm very surprised to read hear that a lot of you have not heard of it! Admittedly it is only by chance that I have - by having to watch discs on a PC some time ago when my standalone player broke.
ali

 

[Andy Bell]

I went to my local Hollywood Video last night and just about lost it when I found out that i could rent Cats and Dogs in P&S only!
Called Hollywood Video today and made sure to voice my concerns about this. Talked to a very nice lady named DeeDee. She seemed to understand and said I was'nt the only one to complain. She said they get a lot of complaints fromm people without widescreen tv's about the blackbars on their 4:3 tv's. She said that the full screen copies of Cats and Dogs and The Mummy Returns was and "experiment".
I made it clear to her that if they are going to do this that they need to make both versions available and not screw those of us that have supported DVD and their stores long before DVD became popular!